Chinese semiconductor industry

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hvpc

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I don't think it really matters what he thinks. As soon as China can mass produce 7 nm chips (I mean at high volume), they will be buying a lot less from TSMC/Nvidia/Qualcomm and the revenues at these companies will collapse. Let's see how well TSMC does in 3 or 4 years when it has a bunch of advanced fabs with low utilization.
not sure if you realize, in 3-4 years, China would be 8-10years behind…

This is why i had relayed my concern last year that the gap between China and the industry leader is growing bigger and bigger.
 
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tphuang

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not sure if you realize, in 3-4 years, China would be 8-10years behind…
That doesn't matter (and I don't agree with that assessment). There is basically no application that must have 3 to 5nm process chips. Since Chinese chip designers and users are going to be deprived of access to 3/5 nm node, then they will have to use what's available locally. The end user for much of what TSMC/Nvidia/Qualcomm sell are on the mainland. If China has to make do with 7nm process chips from SMIC, then they will just do that.

the chips will be a little larger and have worse power consumption, but they will still be able to do all the computation that you would want to have done. Sure, your Chinese smartphone will use up its batteries faster than iPhone, but that can be compensated with lower prices and better charging technology.
 

CMP

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not sure if you realize, in 3-4 years, China would be 8-10years behind…

This is why i had relayed my concern last year that the gap between China and the industry leader is growing bigger and bigger.
That's not how this works. Right now, the only practical use for the most advanced chips is cellphones. That is because of high cost but greater power efficiency. The same has been true for years now. What China cares about most as a short-term objective is to become self-sufficient in the lower tech chips used in electric vehicles. That's where the majority of industry revenue is and costed China hundreds of BILLIONS in imports from Taiwan and South Korea. The medium-term objective is chips for data centers and super computers. China can produce chips for these but is not yet the top competitor at this end.

Since Chinese industry no longer has the option of importing those chips from foreign scumbags, they have no choice but to use domestic chips that are behind. The only real consequence in the short term is that Chinese cell phones will be less energy efficient. In the mid to long term, the consequence is that Taiwan and South Korea will completely lose out on the largest chip market in the world. Meanwhile, the Dutch and Japanese are on track to lose out on the largest chip manufacturing equipment market in the world.

People in China who really want "the latest and greatest" are still going to be paying top RMB for iPhones. That was the case before the chip bans and will still be the case going forward. Those hanjian scumbags. The majority of everyone else will go for their Oppo/Vivo/Xiaomi/Huawei/etc.

Also, the vast majority of TSMC and Samsung revenue/profits comes from selling their older chips, not the latest and greatest. That means China has the opportunity to cut their legs out from under them.
 
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tokenanalyst

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Jingce Semiconductor won the bid for Xinsheng Semiconductor's 3 polishing wafer inspection machines​

Shanghai Jingce Semiconductor Technology Co., Ltd. (hereinafter referred to as "Jingce Semiconductor") won the bid for the procurement project of Shanghai Xinsheng Semiconductor Technology Co., Ltd. for 3 polished wafer inspection machines.

Jingce Semiconductor was established in July 2018. It is mainly engaged in the R&D, production and sales of semiconductor volume testing equipment, and also develops some testing equipment in the field of display and new energy.

Founded in June 2014, Xinsheng Semiconductor is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Shanghai Silicon Industry Group Co., Ltd. It is a Chinese company that commercially provides 300mm (12 inches) semiconductor silicon wafers. The 300mm silicon wafers it produces are widely used in integrated circuit industries such as memory chips, logic chips, image sensors, IGBT power devices and communication chips. (Proofreading/Han Xiurong)

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european_guy

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not sure if you realize, in 3-4 years, China would be 8-10years behind…

Yes....but only thanks to Trump and his banning of ASML EUV. That was a startegic long term ban with minimum cost for US firms and maximum effect in the long term. When China will localize the EUV machine, it can easily be already 10 years after the ban.

Instead this hysterical decoupling frantically pursued by the new US administration has no long term vision: China is now pressured like crazy to close the (relatively small) gap on DUV as soon as possible. Here with 16-28nm nodes, we are not talking of 10 years, but at worst 2/3 years, and probably even less.

President Trump managed to keep away China from state-of-the-art for a long time with EUV. Instead Biden administration (when I talk of president Biden I always say Biden administration, you know, the people that write him what to say), they not only are failing in stopping China, but they even pushed China to accelerate its development....and for what? For a couple of years of delay in time to market of a limited range of products?

They have fully followed the steps of Trump, but differently from him, they lack a clear final target and they just act out of rage and panic. But you know, the copy is never like the original.
 

olalavn

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Someone post in havok thread. Translate later.

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这个消息靠谱吗?

Is the 28nm project led by the company or other players involved? Who is the leader?

It is the State Z Committee. There is no one from Huawei in the 28nm special group. However, there are Shanghai Microelectronics and Huawei in the EUV light source of the next-generation lithography machine. The Shenzhen State Z Committee and the Shanghai State Z Committee established a new company in November last year, of which 40% are from Shanghai Microelectronics and 60% are from Huawei.

After the 28nm is produced, as long as the user verification is passed and mass production can be carried out, it is equivalent to completing the project?

Well, as long as the chip can be manufactured at the 28nm process, the project is considered complete. ZTE's 14nm or 7nm process technology, i.e. if the 7nm process can be achieved through multiple exposures, then the 7nm and above processors will not be restricted.

The company's products are compared with ASML's NXT2000

interesting details
 
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