Chinese semiconductor industry

Status
Not open for further replies.

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
I don't know what the American reaction will be IF Huawei presented its Flagship P60 powered by Hisilicon 14nm 3D chiplet in 2023...lol

I can see Their narratives ohhh!!! its 3 generation behind Apple with its 4nm chip (enhance 5nm)...lol BUT the US can't deny the symbolism, A Chinese company that they heavily sanction are able to produce by themselves a chip worthy of praise, Apple the American pride and joy is nowhere near as innovative, resilient and adoptive. It's a smack of embarrassment for a State to bully and plan to destroy a private company and see it survived and thrive.
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
I'm surprise nobody post this YT video, It's fantastic especially how they explain the corruption probe, it's all about insider trading and the actual tangible investment had been build.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!





7.1K views1 day ago

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Standing on the brink of the Web 3.0 era, the CHIPS Act of 2022 casts a shadow over the world. As a signal of another round of ...
New
 

henrik

Senior Member
Registered Member
So true bro so true, TSMC will be releasing its 3nm next year and 2nm by 2026, while in the US the TSMC FAB will be finished by 2024 and start producing 5nm in 2025, So in essence the American by 2026 will be 2 generation behind. So both the Chinese and the American are in the same boat...lol I'm saying this cause I believed by that time SMIC will be producing a 5nm Chip either thru a DUVL or EUVL.

What the American doesn't understanding even though the DPP is stupid and can be manipulated, the Taiwanese and TSMC in particular are NOT, IF the know how for achieving 3nm and 2nm chip stays in Taiwan, when the Chinese are able to have a functioning EUVL, they will use it to produce in China cause it's more cost effective and profitable thing to do. It's also the reason why Japan and the US had a JV on 2nm and EU had the same ambition. Globalization is dead and regionalism is in and Asia is where the action is and the American want a piece of the pie even though she has nothing to contribute.

Taiwan is lagging way behind, as they cannot even make the machines that tsmc uses. Japan and US JV on 2nm is a joke. Basically, the yankees know they are inept, so they forced Japan into spending money on this project. But Japan is also inept on this.
 

henrik

Senior Member
Registered Member
I don't know what the American reaction will be IF Huawei presented its Flagship P60 powered by Hisilicon 14nm 3D chiplet in 2023...lol

I can see Their narratives ohhh!!! its 3 generation behind Apple with its 4nm chip (enhance 5nm)...lol BUT the US can't deny the symbolism, A Chinese company that they heavily sanction are able to produce by themselves a chip worthy of praise, Apple the American pride and joy is nowhere near as innovative, resilient and adoptive. It's a smack of embarrassment for a State to bully and plan to destroy a private company and see it survived and thrive.
How fast is the Huawei P60? Does it have 5G modem on chip?
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
How fast is the Huawei P60?
I don't know bro, I'm waiting for info, it's a part of Huawei advert regarding Their Return of the King. ;)
Does it have 5G modem on chip?
IF it doesn't support 5G then why bother introducing it in the first place and just use Qualcomm 4G chips;)

Wild rumor has Huawei using a 14nm Kirin 9100 chip for 2023 P60 flagship​

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

JUL 21, 2022, 11:17 PM
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

1
Wild rumor has Huawei using a 14nm Kirin 9100 chip for 2023 P60 flagship


Thanks to the United States, Huawei is no longer the smartphone powerhouse that it once was. Just a few years ago, the Chinese manufacturer was poised to become the world's largest smartphone manufacturer.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
by the U.S., the company could no longer access its U.S. supply chain which prevented it from doing business with some of its important suppliers including Google.


Exactly one year later to the day, a change in U.S. export rules made matters worse for Huawei since it prevented the company from obtaining cutting-edge chipsets from foundries that use American technology. These new export rules would prevent Huawei from replenishing its supplies of the latest chips after using up its inventory. In order to prevent these U.S. bans from taking its Honor sub-unit down with it, Huawei sold the unit two years ago for over $15 billion.

Huawei has been unable to produce 5G handsets thanks to the U.S. ban​


Unable to obtain cutting-edge chips with 5G support for its flagship P50 phone released last year,
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
used a 4G-only version of the Snapdragon 888 chipset. Having said that, it was manufactured using the 5nm process node meaning that the chip had a large number of transistors inside allowing it to deliver strong performance and energy efficiency. The lower the process node, the higher the number of transistors that can fit inside a chip.

Tipster posts wild rumor about the chipset to be used on the Huawei P60 series - Wild rumor has Huawei using a 14nm Kirin 9100 chip for 2023 P60 flagship

Tipster posts wild rumor about the chipset to be used on the Huawei P60 series
With this in mind, according to
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
, a tipster has posted an interesting rumor on China's Weibo social media site about the next iteration of the photography-based P-series flagship series. The tipster says that the 2022 P60 handsets will be powered by a 14nm Kirin 9100 chip. The Kirin chips are designed by Huawei's HiSilicon unit and at one time, before the U.S. took the air out of Huawei's balloon, Huawei was the second-largest TSMC customer after Apple.


Despite being produced with a 14nm process node, the tipster adds that the performance of the Kirin 9100 chip will be comparable to a 5nm chipset. Huawei hasn't commented on the rumor. We would suggest taking this rumor with a grain of salt. There is no way a 14nm chipset can deliver 5nm performance. As a comparison, Samsung's version of the A9 chip used on the 2015 iPhone 6s and iPhone 6s Plus used Samsung's 14nm process node which contained 2 billion transistors. Compare that to Apple's current 5nm A15 Bionic which carries 15 billion transistors.

The rumor also doesn't mention whether the 14nm Kirin 9100 will support 5G although that also seems impossible, The only reason we could see Huawei employing a 14nm chipset on a new flagship is to take back some control over the production of its own integrated circuits
 

tphuang

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
Well, 14nm is already 2 generations behind, so why trying to block ASML on it?

But, more importantly, how can you think to sell US tools for nodes where there is already Chinese local competition but not for the others? This makes no sense at all. Once a Chinese firm switches to a localized solution they will not turn back.

This kind of export control rationale works as long as the sanctioned state has no local innovation capacity. It is a logic borne for arms control to prevent selling advanced weapons to technological way inferior states. A logic that US administration is now stretching to a very different scenario, clearly they are stretching too far and the basic assumptions upon which is built are no more valid. Here the elephant in the room is that China does have local innovation, and is even running on all cylinders on it!

The end result cannot be different from decoupling, at least for the Chinese side that will use only localized tools.

I cannot believe US administrators are so blind not to see it. I still believe they really aim at decoupling.
I think 99.99% of Westerners simply do not get to hear about the progress that China has made. I don't think they are looking to decouple. They are just delusional enough to think they can "trip up" (in their words) Chinese process in this area. It's also due to Intel being so incompetent at producing 5/7 nm chips. Remember back in 2005, EU was about to lift the arms embargo. US senate pressured EU to not do that because they were concerned about China catching up. Now 15 years later, China has been exporting weapons to Serbia. If not for NATO/geopolitical factors, China would be exporting weapons to more countries in EU. Same in space technology. Now, EU is excited to cooperate with Chinese space agency because the ISS is going to decommission in a few years.

America is run by wall street, lobbyists and some really stupid/corrupted politicians. It doesn't do logical things.

Also, I don't see Western countries just not buy Chinese chips. China is an integral part of the Western supply chain. For example, China is going to be the main supplier of neon gas (and other noble gases), raw silicon and probably a lot of other things I don't know about. It's very likely that over time, China will slowly just take over larger portions of the chip making process due to these current sanctions that will create powerful Chinese IC suppliers. In 5 years, it would be very hard for the "global" supply chain to not rely heavily on Chinese suppliers. That's China's genius for not sanctioning anyone despite getting heavily sanctioned.

With this in mind, according to
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
, a tipster has posted an interesting rumor on China's Weibo social media site about the next iteration of the photography-based P-series flagship series. The tipster says that the 2022 P60 handsets will be powered by a 14nm Kirin 9100 chip. The Kirin chips are designed by Huawei's HiSilicon unit and at one time, before the U.S. took the air out of Huawei's balloon, Huawei was the second-largest TSMC customer after Apple.
This is the key here. Although technically, TSMC gets most of its revenue from the US market, but a lot of that revenue are for chips by intel, Qualcomm and Nvidia that go into phones by Chinese smartphone makers. So once China can get to fully domestic 7/14 nm process and mass produce (maybe that take another 3 to 5 years fully ramp up), Chinese government needs to pressure most of the domestic smartphone makers to use domestic processors rather than Qualcomm ones. Even if 7 nm is 2 generation behind 3 nm, they need to just suck up and do it for "national security" reasons. Breaking this cabal of TSMC/Qualcomm/Intel that dominate the Android phone and laptop CPU market is crucial to weakening their R&D and would actually weaken Taiwan's semiconductor industry. There are real strategy implications when a single industry economy like Taiwan starts to see declines in that industry. Tell Xiaomi/Oppo/Vivo/Lenovo to shut up and use Chinese processors on their phone.
 

tokenanalyst

Brigadier
Registered Member
Improve the layout of optical inspection equipment through holding investment

It is understood that the main products developed by Zhongwei Company - plasma etching equipment and chemical thin film equipment are the key equipment for manufacturing various microscopic devices, which can process various devices of micrometer and nanometer. At present, Zhongwei's plasma etching equipment has been widely used in many etching applications from 65nm to 5nm and more advanced processes by international first-line customers.

In addition to these two core products, Yin Zhiyao told Aijiwei about the layout of optical inspection equipment and the progress of research and development, which is mainly reflected in the company's investment in Shanghai Ruili Technology. In recent years, Ruili Technology has developed rapidly, and has launched many optical measurement equipment products. Currently, it is making defect detection equipment, and will soon have line width measurement capabilities.

According to the data, Ruili Technology was established in June 2005 and is committed to the research and development and production of equipment in the field of front-end process testing of integrated circuit production. Its main products are optical film thickness measurement equipment and optical defect detection equipment, as well as silicon wafer thickness and warpage measurement. Equipment, etc., is one of the few high-end equipment companies in China that has entered the world's leading 12-inch production line, and is the only domestic integrated circuit equipment company that has entered a leading Korean chip manufacturer.

At present, Ruili Technology is developing the next generation of film thickness and OCD measurement equipment that can support higher-level chip manufacturing processes and defect detection equipment used in integrated circuit chip production, further expanding the market size that can be served. In view of this, the holding investment in Ruili Technology will be of great benefit for China Micro to focus on and implement the strategy of high-end chip equipment and improve the business layout.

Three major production and research projects and 15 equipment projects are "flying together"

In order to ensure the rapid development in the next ten to fifteen years, while laying out new growth drivers such as optical inspection equipment, China Micro is carrying out the construction of three major production and research projects. After the completion in the next two years, China Microelectronics will gradually build factories fifteen times larger than the current one, so as to have enough space for R&D, production and operation, laying a solid foundation for future development.

Among them, China Micro's production and R&D base of about 140,000 square meters in Nanchang has been partially completed, and some production clean rooms will be put into trial production in July 2022; the production and research and development base of about 180,000 square meters in Lingang, Shanghai Most of the construction has been capped, and it can be partially put into use early next year; the R&D center and headquarters building of about 100,000 square meters on the shore of Shanghai Lingang Dishui Lake is also under construction.

352546067868.6096.png


As for whether such a large-scale expansion is used for the expansion of existing products or the research and development and production of new equipment, Yin Zhiyao said that there are both, but the expansion of existing products will not be so large. "We are developing new products in etching, thin film and testing equipment. In addition, China Microelectronics has now entered emerging fields such as MiniLED and MicroLED, among which the main focus is MOCVD equipment, and two projects have begun to do semiconductor front-end. CVD equipment. Overall, there are now at least 15 projects in development at China Micro.”

It can be said that the research and development of new technology products of Zhongwei Company has made staged progress. For example, its MOCVD equipment has been put into mass production on the production lines of industry-leading customers, and it has become the world's leading manufacturer of GaN-based LED equipment. It is understood that China is the world's largest demand market for MOCVD equipment, and its holdings account for more than 40% of the world's total. With the gradual application of MOCVD equipment in many emerging fields such as MiniLED, MicroLED, and power devices, the market size of China Micro is expected to further expand.

"No supplier is not supplying parts due to US-China tensions"

In the post-epidemic era, in addition to facing the continuing and repeated impact of the epidemic, in the context of increasing uncertainties and risks in the international political and economic environment, actively taking measures to deal with external impacts has also become a must-have topic.

Yin Zhiyao emphasized, "In fact, we have done a lot of work on domestic and foreign suppliers in the past 18 years. So far, foreign suppliers have very positive attitudes towards Zhongwei, and suppliers including the United States and Japan have always placed our company in the Very important position to support. There is no indication yet that because of the tension between China and the United States, they are not willing to provide us with parts.”

"But we also have to take precautions, let domestic suppliers and non-US suppliers account for the majority, and continuously reduce the proportion of US suppliers. We also announced that 60% of the parts of the etching machine are purchased from China, and then purchased in the United States. 10%. Among them, 80% of MOCVD has been purchased from China, while only 5% of US components. We have countermeasures on how to develop domestic and non-US suppliers, including constantly making better localization to make suppliers More solid and so on,” Yin Zhiyao said.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

tokenanalyst

Brigadier
Registered Member
Heyan Technology: Won the title of the fourth batch of specialized, special and new "Little Giant" enterprises by the Ministry of Industry and Information Technology

Recently, the Ministry of Industry and Information Technology announced the list of the fourth batch of national-level specialized and special new "little giant" enterprises. Shenyang Heyan Technology Co., Ltd. (hereinafter referred to as "Heyan Technology") has made unremitting efforts in the field of semiconductor grinding and technological innovation were successfully selected.

Heyan Technology is a leading enterprise in the R&D and manufacturing of special equipment for integrated circuit wafer dicing and cutting in China. The company's main products include 6-12 - inch DSseries precision dicing machine, JSseries automatic cutting and sorting machine and other integrated circuit special equipment, which are widely used in the field of chip manufacturing such as integrated circuits, discrete devices, optoelectronic devices and sensors. Among them, the DS9260 automatic dicing machine broke the foreign monopoly of 12-inch wafer dicing equipment, and became the first domestic dicing machine brand used in mass production in the field of wafer dicing and cutting, realizing localization. The newly developed JS2800 automatic cutting and sorting machine has entered the stage of mass production, breaking the foreign monopoly and filling the domestic gap in the field of packaging, testing and cutting.
 

horse

Colonel
Registered Member
America is run by wall street, lobbyists and some really stupid/corrupted politicians. It doesn't do logical things.

This is the key here. Although technically, TSMC gets most of its revenue from the US market, but a lot of that revenue are for chips by intel, Qualcomm and Nvidia that go into phones by Chinese smartphone makers.

Yeah, absolutely. This does not even need to be explained, this is just understood.

The final end user, pays for everything.

Every time I hear about that TSMC has no Chinese customers and makes all its revenue from American companies, and that TSMC is fine without Chinese customers, I just love it.

Do we believe in social Darwinism? Such as like people from Florida, get awarded more Darwin awards than people in other states?

Not sure about that myself, about the social Darwinism. What I do believe is business Darwinism and corporate Darwinism. The most certainly exist!

The stupid may find a way to survive living in Florida, but the stupid will not survive in business or the corporate world.

:oops::D
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top