Chinese semiconductor industry

european_guy said:

This is the only valuable piece of information I was able to find in the article.

If it is true it means ASML will anyhow deliver the already sold machines, even in the worst case where it will eventually refuse to take new orders.

This is not a small detail.

We can assume SMIC, YMTC and CXMT have already bought the needed litho machines for their current expansion plans (they would have been very incautious if they didn't), and the other Chinese manufacturers are on 28nm node or above anyhow, so no impact on them.

Click to expand...

ansy1968 said:

Bro to answer I gave you an article from FT and see the Cope and despair the impact of SMIC 7nm had created....lol , we have to forgive her since she knowns nothing about SEMICONDUCTOR, a matter of fact our @Loveleenkr can even teach her about the intricacy of China IC since she learned a lot from this forum....lol

On a serious note TSMC had done it with their first generation 7NM DUV why would SMIC can not, the 7nm yield process can be improve as there is a huge demand and with Liang Mong Song at the helm, this 7nm chip and the future 5nm is his baby, he want to have his name etch in history as the person Who bring SMIC in particular and China in general at the forefront of chip technology.

By

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

an opinionate article from FT

A breakthrough by China’s largest chipmaker revealed last month triggered a gasp of surprise among observers outside the industry. But the move by Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corporation to start shipping advanced “7 nanometre” semiconductors had only been a matter of time. The more interesting question now is how much time and money the company is willing to sink into producing them at scale using a method their international rivals have abandoned for a more efficient one. That development, expected to unfold over the coming year, will show whether Chinese chipmakers are really ready to prioritise the political cause of making their country self-sufficient over the business case of making money. For starters, 7nm — the marketing name for a technology process for making chips — is one generation behind the most advanced in mass production. It trails the 5nm generation of chips offered by industry leaders Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company and South Korea’s Samsung. And 7nm is just the minimum required for the high-performance computing chips that rapidly process large amounts of data in everything from servers to smartphones. Since hiring former TSMC veteran Liang Mong-song as its co-chief executive in 2017, SMIC has made advances in mastering manufacturing technology generations such as 16nm and 10nm. But the company’s problem is that the US is blocking exports of extreme ultraviolet machines to China. Such lithography equipment, which can put integrated circuit patterns on a wafer surface by exposing it to light only once, has become the mainstay for making chips with the 7nm process and more advanced technology since 2019. “The furore over SMIC’s progress is quite overblown — they are using extra exposure to make up for the lack of EUV,” says Douglas Fuller, an expert on the Chinese semiconductor industry. “But it is understood that the yield is terrible.” SMIC has been open about its quest for 7nm technology. In early 2020, the company said it was developing an “n+1” process “comparable to 7nm”. In October that year, Chinese chip company Innosilicon announced that it had completed final design and testing for a product that would use this process. SMIC has also said it aims to bring the technology to mass production next year. However, as SMIC cannot secure EUV equipment, it relies on using deep ultraviolet machines. This equipment is a generation behind EUV which can finish 7nm chips only through three or even four rounds of patterning. Driven by concerns that Chinese chipmakers could get around the US’s EUV ban this way, Washington has in recent months discussed with equipment makers such as ASML of the Netherlands and Japan’s Nikon the option of stopping delivery of DUV machines to China as well. But analysts believe China has bought enough of the equipment to protect it against such a risk. However, the technical challenges of transitioning to 7nm have plagued many other chipmakers. Intel struggled for years to move below 10nm technology. And even if SMIC succeeds, competing with global rivals will be an uphill battle give the extra costs and time required using DUV machines. Whether that is a fight SMIC wants is an open question. Liang and his co-CEO Zhao Haijun have been in disagreement over what price the company should pay to continue its push to catch up with international peers. While Liang wants to continue pushing forward with the development of cutting-edge technology, Zhao has advocated focusing on expanding less advanced capacity to gain market share. Just last Friday, he told investors that SMIC would flexibly allocate capacity to less advanced technology generations to respond to strong demand in areas like industrial use chips. Beijing’s past attempts to push breakthrough innovation in semiconductor manufacturing have been hampered by chipmakers’ reluctance to risk using little-tested homemade solutions. SMIC is now at a crossroads over this priority. Constrained by the US restrictions on chip technology exports to China, the company’s reliance on its home market has risen by more than 10 percentage points over the past four years to almost 70 per cent of revenue. But industry experts say that does not equal acquiescence to prioritising national industry goals. A semiconductor executive says: “Their true ambition is to be a technologically strong and profitable company. The moment they are forced to give that up, that is the moment China is truly decoupling from the world.”

Click to expand...

european_guy said:

This is the only valuable piece of information I was able to find in the article.

If it is true it means ASML will anyhow deliver the already sold machines, even in the worst case where it will eventually refuse to take new orders.

This is not a small detail.

We can assume SMIC, YMTC and CXMT have already bought the needed litho machines for their current expansion plans (they would have been very incautious if they didn't), and the other Chinese manufacturers are on 28nm node or above anyhow, so no impact on them.

Click to expand...

Oldschool​

Junior Member​

ChongqingHotPot92 said:

I wonder if Chinese companies have already stockpiled enough imported DUVs ( including backup ones) that would last the country long enough until China's own DUVs catch up to those of ASML (I mean 5-10 years or longer).

Click to expand...

ansy1968 said:

Bro what I learned from @weig2000, SMIC in particular had a DUAL APPROACH Strategy, using ASML to research and produce advance node like 7nm , while using SMEE in developing 28nm and 14 nm domestic line. In this way they have an insurance just in case the American decided to cut them off.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Aug 26, 2021 — China is expected to achieve full-scale mass production of 14nm chips by localising the entire production line and supply chain as early as ...

Click to expand...

henrik said:

They probably are moving fast as the cyclotron in Beijing is coming online.

Click to expand...

BoraTas said:

Semi industry worker here. Specifically ASIC design automation. The article is copium. A quite ridiculous one. Many claims zero substantiation.

Click to expand...

ansy1968 said:

bro from @Oldschool it mentioned 80 machines and more coming. And like we discussed before they had escape the gauntlet , the same with SMIC and they may mass produce 7nm N+2 without care. My question can they replace the American materials used in their production process? like local Chinese materials, Japanese or SK?

Click to expand...

european_guy said:

bro this is an interesting question, because AFAIK consumables and row materials (wafers, chemicals and gases) are almost all from Japan with an important and successful localization effort going on polished wafers. For gases and many chemicals, they are already fully localized, for photoresist there is still some catch up to do. For masks I guess is still Japan the main source.

I am not aware of any dependency on American materials apart from spare parts. Please someone with more knowledge correct me if I am wrong.

Click to expand...