- Agreed. That is the key of any business success. Cheaper for same quality and features (Toyota, VW etc.), or more features for higher price (BMW, Mercedes, Audi and Lexus etc.). China as a late comer is at this moment going through the path of the former, just like Japan in the 1960s to the 2000s, or SK in the 1980s to today.
- Disagree to some extent. The fact is "I am seeing it right now" instead of "will see." In my reality, I am feeling the strong pressure from Chinese competitor in my industry, so to me it is very real. BTW, my industry is not making shoes or clothes but high techs
. History tells me that Japan did it, SK did it (or still doing it), the same question was asked about Japan in the 1980s (I still remember western media bashing Japan at that time, which was also taken up by some Chinese media). Same question was also asked about SK in the late 1990s and even today. It is "fair" to ask the question about China. But I won't bother that question because the history is repeating itself and will probably repeat again this time around. If I were the doubter, I would rather assume China's innovation and invention as a certain thing, so I would not be knocked off balance over the sudden.
Chinese Economics Thread
- Thread starter Norfolk
- Start date
Blackstone
Brigadier
Quite frankly, I'm positive of Chinese advancements and future capabilities in all human endeavors. I also believe Chinese creativity and ingenuity will extend the frontier of human knowledge in all areas of science, technology, medicine, industry, culture, entertainment, philosophy, politics, and just about anything else you care to name, even vice. But, the proof is in the pudding, so until there's sufficient proof of achievements, it remains potential and not fact. Therefore, I'll have to stick with "we'll see" until evidence show otherwise.
- Agreed. That is the key of any business success. Cheaper for same quality and features (Toyota, VW etc.), or more features for higher price (BMW, Mercedes, Audi and Lexus etc.). China as a late comer is at this moment going through the path of the former, just like Japan in the 1960s to the 2000s, or SK in the 1980s to today.
- Disagree to some extent. The fact is "I am seeing it right now" instead of "will see." In my reality, I am feeling the strong pressure from Chinese competitor in my industry, so to me it is very real. BTW, my industry is not making shoes or clothes but high techs
Sure and fair, I won't "force" you to change your mind, after all only one's own life experience will convince one, you have not faced that experience yet while I have.
broadsword
Brigadier
Exactly. Lineage is jack.
Lethe
Captain
I would not see the decline in the success and prestige of Japanese consumer electronics only as a story about being undercut by increasingly competitive South Korean and now Chinese products. Sony and other Japanese manufacturers missed the boat regarding the PC and software-driven development in the 1990s and never seemed to recover, thereafter they have always been on the defensive.
Note that Japan did not lose its dominance in music (Walkman, CD) to SK or China, but to USA with the iPod -- which in turn laid the foundation for the success of the iPhone, another development that Sony was not ready for, leading it to fall in with Google's Android (like everyone else) and in turn opening the door to commoditisation. There was a cultural blindness here, or inability or unwillingness to adapt fast enough, to get ahead of the curve and dictate the path that others would follow. There are lessons here for China.
Note that Japan did not lose its dominance in music (Walkman, CD) to SK or China, but to USA with the iPod -- which in turn laid the foundation for the success of the iPhone, another development that Sony was not ready for, leading it to fall in with Google's Android (like everyone else) and in turn opening the door to commoditisation. There was a cultural blindness here, or inability or unwillingness to adapt fast enough, to get ahead of the curve and dictate the path that others would follow. There are lessons here for China.
Absolutely, I always see that as the one of the turning points.
broadsword
Brigadier
Before the smartphone there was the cellphone, which they also failed to dominate, unlike with the other electronic consumer goods. That was more baffling to me because it was a no-brainer.
Sony Ericcsson did alright I think?
broadsword
Brigadier
None of the Japanese companies seized the initiative, or made a meaningful dent in the market share thereafter. I don't think any of the Japanese brands ever made it to the top 3 or 4 placings in the aggregate world market share. Panasonic was the king of the cordless phone segment, but made a feeble stab at the cellphone market. I think they did quite well in the rugged portable computer segment, but it was a niche market.
Sony Ericcson, even with their merged operations, still can't break past the Chinese placings, much less Samsung and Apple. There is not much they could offer in terms of specifications that are better than the Chinese brands.
Sony Ericcson, even with their merged operations, still can't break past the Chinese placings, much less Samsung and Apple. There is not much they could offer in terms of specifications that are better than the Chinese brands.
I was talking about the mobile phone market (pre-iphone/pre-smartphone), where I think Sony Ericsson did alright then? Apple and Samsung were not very big players in the phone market back then, I think (or at least Apple definitely wasn't)... and of course Nokia and Blackberry were still relevant as well.
That said, I don't remember what the marketshare was like back then, so it's just anecdotes from me.