Chinese Economics Thread

[weig2000]

Follow the €€€

This scholar's analysis is excellent. Chinese domestic companies dont want the deal because they would face competition and thus the deal was geared to giving more advantages to the EU. So China is now saying, the deal was we give you benefits and you stay neutral.

Now that the EU wants the deal and also to sanction China for "human rights" and "genocide", China is saying yeah whatever, the deal cannot pass and thats ok with us, either way we were on the losing side from the deal

However, I said it before, Merkel knows her stuff and she will manage to pass the deal through the EU Parliament. It is impossible to me, for the Parliament to decline to pass the CAI with so many profits to made in China if the deal would pass

China made huge concessions at the end of last year, within a very short time period after having back-and-forth negotiations for seven years, to the surprise of the EU negotiation team. Clearly the pressure was from the very top (read: Xi himself), the goal is more strategic in nature than trade or investment for China.

Most of the EU politicians are bunch of idiots, a lot of styles but no substance; throughout the continent, only Merkel can be considered some kind of statesman (or stateswoman). EU is going from weak to weaker. That appears to be its destiny.

 

[sndef888]

Merkel is honestly a pretty decent leader. It's partly why Germany has the only industrial sector worth a damn in Europe.

I only hope when she retires Germany gets another decent leader and not another typical Anglo sychophant. France has fallen a long way since the days of Charles de gaulle.

 

[voyager1]

Merkel is honestly a pretty decent leader. It's partly why Germany has the only industrial sector worth a damn in Europe.

I only hope when she retires Germany gets another decent leader and not another typical Anglo sychophant. France has fallen a long way since the days of Charles de gaulle.

I am afraid your hopes wont materialise...

The "next" leader (the next party head after Merkel leaves the party) who is regarded to have the most chance of being elected is regarded as a pragmatic leader and he would have good relations with China and Russia (in my opinion of course)

The problem is that to form a new government they will need to cooperate with another party, which would most likely be the "Green Party". Well, let me tell you that this party is anti-China, and is US-friendly and it is pushing hard for actions against China. I think they already said that if the next gov wants cooperation it must take a hard line against China.

So as you can see, the US influence is still strong on Germany. I personally think that things will continue to be ok, but I fear that the US might try to force Germany to go against China (Green Party, media, CIA, NGOs, Propaganda etc).

BTW the next election will be on September

 

[quantumlight]

China made huge concessions at the end of last year, within a very short time period after having back-and-forth negotiations for seven years, to the surprise of the EU negotiation team. Clearly the pressure was from the very top (read: Xi himself), the goal is more strategic in nature than trade or investment for China.

Most of the EU politicians are bunch of idiots, a lot of styles but no substance; throughout the continent, only Merkel can be considered some kind of statesman (or stateswoman). EU is going from weak to weaker. That appears to be its destiny.

Given the realities of Peak Oil, declining EROEI, resource depletion, climate disasters, etc it is in China's favor for there to be more failed India and failed EU... there is not enough pie to go around, if these other folks want to collapse themselves all the better for China

 

[sndef888]

I am afraid your hopes wont materialise...

The "next" leader (the next party head after Merkel leaves the party) who is regarded to have the most chance of being elected is regarded as a pragmatic leader and he would have good relations with China and Russia (in my opinion of course)

The problem is that to form a new government they will need to cooperate with another party, which would most likely be the "Green Party". Well, let me tell you that this party is anti-China, and is US-friendly and it is pushing hard for actions against China. I think they already said that if the next gov wants cooperation it must take a hard line against China.

So as you can see, the US influence is still strong on Germany. I personally think that things will continue to be ok, but I fear that the US might try to force Germany to go against China (Green Party, media, CIA, NGOs, Propaganda etc).

BTW the elextion will be on this September

Oh I remember the green party, it's filled with morons like the one that supported taiwan or something. It'll be a disaster if they get their way, both for China and Germany.

 

[Nutrient]

I agree with @voyager1 that this conversation doesn't belong in the coronavirus thread. Let's see if I can put the following comment in the economics thread.

There's nothing to admit; that's obvious. Corruption is in every country and China under Xi is making big efforts to tackle it. It can never be eradicated but it has definitely been reduced.

You did say "Those who waste time solving problems that don't exist", meaning that corruption is a problem that doesn't exist. Now you contradict yourself, admitting that corruption does indeed exist. Can you make up your mind?

The success of the modern US proves you wrong.

The US is a perfect example of my thesis, that billionaires can totally corrupt a country. In 2008, the people who caused the financial crisis got themselves bailed out. And last year, many of the same people got to share in trillions more free dollars. If that is not corruption on an epic scale, I don't know what is. And if you can't see that the US is rotting from all that corruption, you must be blind.

Hell, China's current rise, concurrent with the rise of its private industries and billionaires, proves you wrong.

No, it just proves that you are short sighted. If corruption is not curbed, China will rise -- and then fall. The fall can be quite fast.

 

[manqiangrexue]

You did say "Those who waste time solving problems that don't exist", meaning that corruption is a problem that doesn't exist. Now you contradict yourself, admitting that corruption does indeed exist. Can you make up your mind?

I am always consistent. The problem is that you didn't even know what you were suggesting to do. If you said we need to fight corruption, I would agree perfectly. But did you say that? No, you said we need to leash all the billionaires before they get too strong. That doesn't say anything about corruption; that means you want to punish people not for being corrupt but for being too successful and you don't even know how you want to punish them. You didn't give it much thought. That's just nonsense. Next time, give things thought before you try to turn them into an argument because right now, you have no point.

The US is a perfect example of my thesis, that billionaires can totally corrupt a country. In 2008, the people who caused the financial crisis got themselves bailed out. And last year, many of the same people got to share in trillions more free dollars. If that is not corruption on an epic scale, I don't know what is. And if you can't see that the US is rotting from all that corruption, you must be blind.

The US is the most powerful country in the world. That is the stand-alone evidence that refutes all of your complaints, and China only became a challenger to the US by fusing its political system with some aspects of capitalism. With just OG no-billionaire communism, no country can hold a candle to the US. But who knows what you're even talking about? You sound like you are trying to vouch for communism by leashing and reigning in the rich, then say you are just talking about corruption. What are you talking about? You have no coherent argument.

No, it just proves that you are short sighted.

I don't see at all what you are talking about because even you yourself are admitting that you don't know what you want to be done and now it looks like you don't know if you are talking about corruption or communism. Short or far-sighted, I'd have to be imagining things to see what you see.

If corruption is not curbed, China will rise -- and then fall. The fall can be quite fast.

Of course we curb corruption. If someone is earning riches by gaming the system and doing detriment to the national good, then s/he should be thrown in jail. No problem, but that's not what you said. You said just rein in or leash the billionaires, men and women who honestly built up a tech enterprise and are earning billions in capital in order to compete globally. They should be leashed. What the hell does that mean?

Until you can actually answer that, you're just babbling nonsense. And when I do a point-to-point, I actually answer every point. You just ignored all the hard questions that you couldn't answer, picked a few sentences and responded to them in a way that does nothing except make it look like you're still carrying the conversation when you know you're talking on empty.

 

[Bellum_Romanum]

I agree with @voyager1 that this conversation doesn't belong in the coronavirus thread. Let's see if I can put the following comment in the economics thread.



You did say "Those who waste time solving problems that don't exist", meaning that corruption is a problem that doesn't exist. Now you contradict yourself, admitting that corruption does indeed exist. Can you make up your mind?



The US is a perfect example of my thesis, that billionaires can totally corrupt a country. In 2008, the people who caused the financial crisis got themselves bailed out. And last year, many of the same people got to share in trillions more free dollars. If that is not corruption on an epic scale, I don't know what is. And if you can't see that the US is rotting from all that corruption, you must be blind.



No, it just proves that you are short sighted. If corruption is not curbed, China will rise -- and then fall. The fall can be quite fast.

While your concerns of the excess and undue influence of the bazillionaires are duly noted and are actually share by most of the people on this forum myself included, not to mention by the large swath of the people in China. Your solutions or lack thereof to this pertinent issue along with your conflation of political rights and governance between the oligarchic U.S. and the C.P.C. (were the state is the absolute authority over capital) in my opinion is misplaced.

It's one thing to be guarded and rightfully be mindful of the billionaire class but it's another thing when the policy being set or suggested will have ramifications that have yet to be foreseen. You can't guarantee that whatever set of solutions you have in mind will not deter the Chinese entrepreneurs, innovators, thinkers, from being discourage to pursue what these people excel at. Plus the culture in the U.S. and the context of that country's entire history is wholly different that of China.

 

[ansy1968]

China made huge concessions at the end of last year, within a very short time period after having back-and-forth negotiations for seven years, to the surprise of the EU negotiation team. Clearly the pressure was from the very top (read: Xi himself), the goal is more strategic in nature than trade or investment for China.

Most of the EU politicians are bunch of idiots, a lot of styles but no substance; throughout the continent, only Merkel can be considered some kind of statesman (or stateswoman). EU is going from weak to weaker. That appears to be its destiny.

@weig2000 correct it was Xi in coordination with Merkel, looks to me if the CAI is not approve by the EU parliament , individual state will make separate deals with China. Please check Alexander Mercouris video below

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Xi's Historic Call to Merkel: Free Yourself From Washington, Help Us Build A New World News Topic 100: Xi urges Germany, EU ...

 

[ansy1968]

Merkel is honestly a pretty decent leader. It's partly why Germany has the only industrial sector worth a damn in Europe.

I only hope when she retires Germany gets another decent leader and not another typical Anglo sychophant. France has fallen a long way since the days of Charles de gaulle.

@sndef888 cause she is an engineer, in Xi she can relate due to having the same profession and socialist experience since she came from East Germany. Her leaving will leave a large void but I think the German industrialist will want an independent stance after being burn multiple times from American sanction of Russia.

Regarding Macron, I think he will lose the coming election to Le Pen and the Atlanticist will lost an ally. She maybe racist but her policy is for the greater good of Vive La France.