bladerunner
Banned Idiot
The Chinese have been migrating for centuries, and all being well, will continue to do so.
Chinese Economics Thread
- Thread starter Norfolk
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RedMercury
Junior Member
The rich who are planning to "emmigrate" only really care about having a backup plan, i.e. citizenship in another country, so they can flee if they feel like it. They still plan to conduct their business in China, as it is a far better place to get rich-- not just because of the economic malaise much of the west is in, but the cultural familiarity and ease of doing business with the right connections (which they already have built up to get that rich, no point wasting that capital). Besides, they can try to do business in the west, but they will run into a lot of cultural differences, have to build connections from scratch, face different laws and regulations, and won't be able to bribe through it as readily. So really, "china" as a society isn't losing their capital, nor would it really miss their capital when foreigners are lining up to invest.
As for food safety, environment etc, if they were rich, they didn't deal with that anyway; these were only problems for the poor and middle class.
In an unrelated note, the sons and daughters of these new rich Chinese tend to be quite spoiled and utterly useless wastes of oxygen. Their wealth won't last more than a generation...
As for food safety, environment etc, if they were rich, they didn't deal with that anyway; these were only problems for the poor and middle class.
In an unrelated note, the sons and daughters of these new rich Chinese tend to be quite spoiled and utterly useless wastes of oxygen. Their wealth won't last more than a generation...
Martian
Senior Member
China Bests Japan in Americans’ Eyes
"China Bests Japan in Americans’ Eyes
June 13, 2011, 8:42 PM JST
By Anna Novick
It’s official, at least as far as a Japanese is concerned: Americans see China, rather than Japan, as their most important partner in Asia.
A man in an American flag outfit watched the ceremony of lowering the flag in Tiananmen Square, Beijing, in May. (Getty Images)
According to results from the 2011 edition of an annual commissioned by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, some 39% of “general public” respondents selected China as “the most important partner of the U.S. in Asia,” while 31% chose Japan.
While the 2010 version of the poll showed the Asian rivals tied with a 44% rating, the 2011 numbers, compiled from interviews with 1,200 citizens from February to March, represent a stark change compared with just three years ago. In 2008, 43% of the general public selected Japan as the most important partner for the U.S., while 34% plumped for China.
The result of the poll, which the ministry commissioned the Gallup Organization to conduct, is part of a broader consultation on what the public, and opinion leaders, in the U.S. make of Japan. As well as the general public segment, pollsters also interviewed 200 opinion leaders for a separate set of results.
The opinion leaders’ view of which country in Asia is the most important partner for the U.S. offers even more emphatic confirmation that trade relations, usually cited as the main reason for a preference for China, are increasingly carrying more weight than political or general ties with the U.S., usually cited as a reason for choosing Japan. Over the past three years’ surveys, opinion leaders’ preference for Japan has nearly halved, to 28% from 54%, while their preference for China increased to 46% from 38%. The results in part reflect China officially overtaking Japan as the world’s second-biggest economy earlier this year.
In slightly better news for Tokyo, the ministry said, “The percentage who perceived Japan to be a dependable ally was 84% among the general public and was 90% among opinion leaders, high figures similar to last year’s poll.” And 77% of the general public and 87% of opinion leaders viewed cooperation between Japan and the U.S. as “excellent” or “good,” the ministry said.
Other crumbs of comfort from the survey: Among the general public, Japan was viewed as “a country with great traditions and culture” (97%); “a country with a strong economy and high technology” (91%); “a country which launches new cultures such as animation, fashion, and cuisine” (88%) and “a country with beautiful nature” (85%).
–Kenneth Maxwell contributed to this article."
[Note: Thank you to "Kobo-Daishi" for the article link.]
"China Bests Japan in Americans’ Eyes
June 13, 2011, 8:42 PM JST
By Anna Novick
It’s official, at least as far as a Japanese is concerned: Americans see China, rather than Japan, as their most important partner in Asia.
A man in an American flag outfit watched the ceremony of lowering the flag in Tiananmen Square, Beijing, in May. (Getty Images)
According to results from the 2011 edition of an annual commissioned by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, some 39% of “general public” respondents selected China as “the most important partner of the U.S. in Asia,” while 31% chose Japan.
While the 2010 version of the poll showed the Asian rivals tied with a 44% rating, the 2011 numbers, compiled from interviews with 1,200 citizens from February to March, represent a stark change compared with just three years ago. In 2008, 43% of the general public selected Japan as the most important partner for the U.S., while 34% plumped for China.
The result of the poll, which the ministry commissioned the Gallup Organization to conduct, is part of a broader consultation on what the public, and opinion leaders, in the U.S. make of Japan. As well as the general public segment, pollsters also interviewed 200 opinion leaders for a separate set of results.
The opinion leaders’ view of which country in Asia is the most important partner for the U.S. offers even more emphatic confirmation that trade relations, usually cited as the main reason for a preference for China, are increasingly carrying more weight than political or general ties with the U.S., usually cited as a reason for choosing Japan. Over the past three years’ surveys, opinion leaders’ preference for Japan has nearly halved, to 28% from 54%, while their preference for China increased to 46% from 38%. The results in part reflect China officially overtaking Japan as the world’s second-biggest economy earlier this year.
In slightly better news for Tokyo, the ministry said, “The percentage who perceived Japan to be a dependable ally was 84% among the general public and was 90% among opinion leaders, high figures similar to last year’s poll.” And 77% of the general public and 87% of opinion leaders viewed cooperation between Japan and the U.S. as “excellent” or “good,” the ministry said.
Other crumbs of comfort from the survey: Among the general public, Japan was viewed as “a country with great traditions and culture” (97%); “a country with a strong economy and high technology” (91%); “a country which launches new cultures such as animation, fashion, and cuisine” (88%) and “a country with beautiful nature” (85%).
–Kenneth Maxwell contributed to this article."
[Note: Thank you to "Kobo-Daishi" for the article link.]
Martian
Senior Member
Hares and tortoises
Hares and tortoises
Jun 13th 2011, 10:20 by The Economist online
Which countries have had most, and least, GDP growth per person since 2001?
FOR all its faults, GDP per person is still the measure that gives the best indicator of economic progress or lack thereof. The countries where GDP per head grew fastest between 2001 and 2010—Equatorial Guinea, Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan—are all rich in natural resources, and were beneficiaries of the past decade’s boom in commodity prices. China is an exception to this rule, which makes its growth even more impressive. And while it usually helps to start relatively poor, a bad start does not necessarily result in success later on. Haiti and Zimbabwe have both explored how much ruin there is in a nation over the past decade and show little sign of improving. They are two of only 15 countries that have seen negative growth since 2001. Slow population growth also helps: although America's economy has grown considerably faster than Japan's since 2001, Japan’s population has shrunk while America's has risen. This means that income per head in Japan has grown almost as rapidly as in America over this period.
Hares and tortoises
Jun 13th 2011, 10:20 by The Economist online
Which countries have had most, and least, GDP growth per person since 2001?
FOR all its faults, GDP per person is still the measure that gives the best indicator of economic progress or lack thereof. The countries where GDP per head grew fastest between 2001 and 2010—Equatorial Guinea, Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan—are all rich in natural resources, and were beneficiaries of the past decade’s boom in commodity prices. China is an exception to this rule, which makes its growth even more impressive. And while it usually helps to start relatively poor, a bad start does not necessarily result in success later on. Haiti and Zimbabwe have both explored how much ruin there is in a nation over the past decade and show little sign of improving. They are two of only 15 countries that have seen negative growth since 2001. Slow population growth also helps: although America's economy has grown considerably faster than Japan's since 2001, Japan’s population has shrunk while America's has risen. This means that income per head in Japan has grown almost as rapidly as in America over this period.
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Rich people wanting to emigrate to the USA is seriously nothing new. The first thing a Canadian does when he strikes it rich is move to the USA. Seriously, I'm struggling to think of a single extremely successful Canadian who didn't go to the US for warmer weather and lower taxes.
I agree with both of these statements, but I do think there *could* be an issue here. A book was published a couple of years ago titled "Capitalism with Chinese Characteristics". I did not read it, and I am basing my comment on my recollection of a very short and vague review which contained the phrase "latinamericanization of Chinese society". On top of this, the phrase was not accompanied by an explanation.
Yet, I think I know what they meant! Latin American countries have been periodically afflicted with "capital flight", "brain drain", etc. The issue is not that "people" in general want to leave, but that there is a very big wealth gap, and the rich (who are also the educated, of course) are quite free to come and go -- with their money and their knowledge -- and do so whenever things become inconvenient for them.
The problem is that this tends to limit the policy options for the various governments; the situation gives the rich a kind of trump card which tends to make the governments beholden to the rich.
China is moving quite rapidly toward the internationalization of its currency, and we will soon see what effect this has on policy. Today, the Chinese government can control prices if it wishes to, it can stiffen labor laws, and in short, it can "make the rich pay" in ways no other "capitalist" country that I know of can. Will it still have this power in 5 or 10 years? Having such power gives China a distinct advantage, in my opinion.
Happily, the Chinese government seems to estimate that it is not a serious problem, and that it will not loose "control" as a result of its reforms. They obviously know more than I do. Maybe China is just that much BIGGER and stronger than Latin American countries.
Spartan95
Junior Member
Well, if the rich got rich using less than legal means (graft, using unsafe practises/ingredients, etc), will it be surprising if they are trying to get out before they get prosecuted? Those that have made their big bucks may not have reason to stay if they have been using melamine in milk, used sub-standard materials for construction, received bribes, cooked the books, etc.
Red___Sword
Junior Member
Good point, they (the corrupts, the cheaters, the less-than-legal-overnight-millionaires) go where they feel home.
Mr. G.W.B reprensenting the good part of the world once said: If you harbors terrorists, YOU ARE TERRORISTS.
- I am looking forward to the same perspective.
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AssassinsMace
Lieutenant General
China blurs A380 order, backs 747 amid EU row
By Tim Hepher Fri Jun 24, 2:20 pm ET
.
LE BOURGET, France (Reuters) – China downgraded the announcement of an Airbus superjumbo order and signed up for the Boeing 747-8 as deals worth $9 billion coincided with a row over European emissions trading rules, industry sources said.
The deals both involved parts of the HNA airlines group and had been planned before the Paris Air Show, they said, but the decision not to announce the names of the buyers triggered one of the mysteries of this week's event.
Industry sources said plans to announce a high-profile $3.8 billion deal between Airbus and Hong Kong Airlines for 10 A380 superjumbos were called off on Thursday because of China's anger over European plans to charge airlines for emissions.
China threatened last month to hold back on purchasing Airbus aircraft because of the EU emissions trading scheme, which airlines body IATA has called illegal.
Additionally, industry sources said a company affiliated to the same carrier, Hainan Airlines, was behind the unexpected announcement of an anonymous deal at Boeing this week.
Boeing said an unidentified airline had provisionally committed to 15 747-8 passenger jets worth $4.8 billion.
Airlines often choose to buy jetliners without identifying themselves to their competition, but such announcements are rarely made at air shows which are designed for publicity. Boeing also rarely announces deals before they are confirmed.
Airbus (EAD.PA) and Boeing (BA.N) declined to comment and representatives of the HNA Group were not available.
Hong Kong Airlines is 46 percent owned by HNA Group, the parent of Hainan Airlines Co Ltd (600221.SS).
TEMPTING TARGET
Airbus and Boeing both brought their largest passenger jets to the show, a biennial event which rotates with the Farnborough Air Show in Britain.
The 747-8 with 467 seats is Boeing's first stretched version of the 747 and is in the midst of flight testing. It will enter service initially as a freighter, then in a passenger version.
The 525-seat A380 is the world's largest airliner and Europe's most high-profile aircraft since Concorde, making it a tempting target in any political tensions affecting aerospace.
The Airbus deal has not itself been blocked and is in the manufacturer's order book, but the decision to cancel a signing ceremony is a clear protest signal, the industry sources said.
Aircraft purchases also need Chinese government approval.
The 747-8 purchase followed competition between Airbus and Boeing for the Hong Kong Airlines order.
While advancing development of its own smaller airplane, China tends to balance orders between the two foreign suppliers.
From Jan 1 next year, the EU will require all airlines flying to Europe to be included in the Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS), a system that compels polluters to buy permits for each tonne of carbon dioxide they emit above a certain cap.
China's top aviation industry body ramped up pressure on the European Union earlier this month, saying it would give full support to legal action against the forced entry of airlines into the EU's carbon trading scheme. [ID:nL3E7H60D5]
China says the scheme is unfair for developing countries and costly.
(Additional reporting by Matthias Blamont; Editing by Jon Loades-Carter)
Copyright © 2011 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.
By Tim Hepher Fri Jun 24, 2:20 pm ET
.
LE BOURGET, France (Reuters) – China downgraded the announcement of an Airbus superjumbo order and signed up for the Boeing 747-8 as deals worth $9 billion coincided with a row over European emissions trading rules, industry sources said.
The deals both involved parts of the HNA airlines group and had been planned before the Paris Air Show, they said, but the decision not to announce the names of the buyers triggered one of the mysteries of this week's event.
Industry sources said plans to announce a high-profile $3.8 billion deal between Airbus and Hong Kong Airlines for 10 A380 superjumbos were called off on Thursday because of China's anger over European plans to charge airlines for emissions.
China threatened last month to hold back on purchasing Airbus aircraft because of the EU emissions trading scheme, which airlines body IATA has called illegal.
Additionally, industry sources said a company affiliated to the same carrier, Hainan Airlines, was behind the unexpected announcement of an anonymous deal at Boeing this week.
Boeing said an unidentified airline had provisionally committed to 15 747-8 passenger jets worth $4.8 billion.
Airlines often choose to buy jetliners without identifying themselves to their competition, but such announcements are rarely made at air shows which are designed for publicity. Boeing also rarely announces deals before they are confirmed.
Airbus (EAD.PA) and Boeing (BA.N) declined to comment and representatives of the HNA Group were not available.
Hong Kong Airlines is 46 percent owned by HNA Group, the parent of Hainan Airlines Co Ltd (600221.SS).
TEMPTING TARGET
Airbus and Boeing both brought their largest passenger jets to the show, a biennial event which rotates with the Farnborough Air Show in Britain.
The 747-8 with 467 seats is Boeing's first stretched version of the 747 and is in the midst of flight testing. It will enter service initially as a freighter, then in a passenger version.
The 525-seat A380 is the world's largest airliner and Europe's most high-profile aircraft since Concorde, making it a tempting target in any political tensions affecting aerospace.
The Airbus deal has not itself been blocked and is in the manufacturer's order book, but the decision to cancel a signing ceremony is a clear protest signal, the industry sources said.
Aircraft purchases also need Chinese government approval.
The 747-8 purchase followed competition between Airbus and Boeing for the Hong Kong Airlines order.
While advancing development of its own smaller airplane, China tends to balance orders between the two foreign suppliers.
From Jan 1 next year, the EU will require all airlines flying to Europe to be included in the Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS), a system that compels polluters to buy permits for each tonne of carbon dioxide they emit above a certain cap.
China's top aviation industry body ramped up pressure on the European Union earlier this month, saying it would give full support to legal action against the forced entry of airlines into the EU's carbon trading scheme. [ID:nL3E7H60D5]
China says the scheme is unfair for developing countries and costly.
(Additional reporting by Matthias Blamont; Editing by Jon Loades-Carter)
Copyright © 2011 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.