Chinese Economics Thread

B

Biscuits

Colonel
Registered Member
North Korea is as likely to clash with China about its use of the Bohai as Great Britain is likely to clash with USA about its use of the Atlantic.

That said, a nuclear but unstable NK isn't good for anyone in the world. As long as NK is more about the Kim family than about the rule of the people for the people, there is no real way to help them that wouldn't backfire further down the road.

Honestly I think Kim Jong Un has been a vast improvement over his father at putting the people first (or at least bumping them up in the priority list) so things are going well.

When NK is ready, China can provide stable institutions and shield them. But when they are OK with leaving behind their personality cult and embracing modern socialism is a decision that can only be left to the North Korean people, its not one that China can force them to make.
 
manqiangrexue

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
escobar said:
He tought appeassement would make US stop. He has even accepted US sanctions on Nkorea hoping US will stop harassing china. Appeassement for the sake of appeassement is not a strategy. Overall china foreign policy is weak and don't seem to have a very clear objective. Over reacting so quickly to low level challenge but not reacting to true challenge.

What strategy? Often China reacts exactly like this US boxer.
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The strategy is very simple: grow. That is the strategy utilized by all nations with confidence in themselves. Only countries that don't believe they can compete with their rivals resort to sabotage and attack. China's strategy is to grow its economy, military, and technology faster than the US and not be distracted by any American efforts to drag it off course.

What's America's strategy? Where has it gotten? China's economy is growing 3x as fast, exports are up for 2019 despite the dip to America, Chinese tech companies up in arms about developing domestic technology, Huawei up 22%, US deficit up over $1 trillion, US farmers on tens of billions of dollars of welfare with increase in bankruptcies and suicides wondering if they will ever be able to get back into the Chinese market, same worries in the semiconductor industry, etc...

I don't look at who yells more or who seems more aggressive; I look at results.
 
Blitzo

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
manqiangrexue said:
The strategy is very simple: grow. That is the strategy utilized by all nations with confidence in themselves. Only countries that don't believe they can compete with their rivals resort to sabotage and attack. China's strategy is to grow its economy, military, and technology faster than the US and not be distracted by any American efforts to drag it off course.

What's America's strategy? Where has it gotten? China's economy is growing 3x as fast, exports are up for 2019 despite the dip to America, Chinese tech companies up in arms about developing domestic technology, Huawei up 22%, US deficit up over $1 trillion, US farmers on tens of billions of dollars of welfare with increase in bankruptcies and suicides wondering if they will ever be able to get back into the Chinese market, same worries in the semiconductor industry, etc...

I don't look at who yells more or who seems more aggressive; I look at results.
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Agreed.

Putin's Russia has often been cited as having a very aggressive and forward no nonsense foreign policy towards the US, and while I think it is correct to be respected and admired, Russia's primary objectives is very different to China's. Just as important, the range of options and potential for Russia and China to grow are also different.


In geopolitics just as in conflict, one should be careful to choose competitions that are the most important to one's interests and not be goaded into diversionary competitions of minimal interest that may draw you away from your overall strategic goal. It is of course important to react to the changing environment if it can cause you to risk losing the ability to attain your strategic goal, and one always needs a degree of flexibility to respond to new threats, but at the same time, longer term strategic goals are more important than trying to win every single petty skirmish that emerges.
 
A

Appix

Senior Member
Registered Member
escobar said:
He tought appeassement would make US stop. He has even accepted US sanctions on Nkorea hoping US will stop harassing china. Appeassement for the sake of appeassement is not a strategy. Overall china foreign policy is weak and don't seem to have a very clear objective. Over reacting so quickly to low level challenge but not reacting to true challenge.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know. They will give him one month respite and then they will be back in the spring to force him to stop industrial subsidies, industrial plans and downsize SOE's. When that is achieved China is kneecapped. The goal is so that China cannot mobilize state to achieve her technological and industrial goals (see Made in China 2025) and keep the whole country in technological and economical inferiority. That's why I say no concessions because when you give them it will be easier to shower more concessions in the future when again confronted with hostility with huge repercussions for China. They give concessions in phase one unequal treaty while US at the same time is busy with urging other counties to not allow Huawei 5G-telecommunications equipment and preparing new sanctions and measures to hobble and destroy the company. What can you say. Keep tranquil and diplomatic and take the punches. What a 'strategy'.
 
C

Chish

Junior Member
Registered Member
escobar said:
He tought appeassement would make US stop. He has even accepted US sanctions on Nkorea hoping US will stop harassing china. Appeassement for the sake of appeassement is not a strategy. Overall china foreign policy is weak and don't seem to have a very clear objective. Over reacting so quickly to low level challenge but not reacting to true challenge.
Click to expand...
Anyone with half a mind would know US is not going to stop until China collapsed, you know that, me know that, definitely Xi always know that. Its just that Xi have smarter plans that you can't comprehend.
 
manqiangrexue

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Appix said:
Yeah, I know. They will give him one month respite and then they will be back in the spring to force him to stop industrial subsidies, industrial plans and downsize SOE's. When that is achieved China is kneecapped. The goal is so that China cannot mobilize state to achieve her technological and industrial goals (see Made in China 2025) and keep the whole country in technological and economical inferiority. That's why I say no concessions because when you give them it will be easier to shower more concessions in the future when again confronted with hostility with huge repercussions for China. They give concessions in phase one unequal treaty while US at the same time is busy with urging other counties to not allow Huawei 5G-telecommunications equipment and preparing new sanctions and measures to hobble and destroy the company. What can you say. Keep tranquil and diplomatic and take the punches. What a 'strategy'.
Click to expand...
That is what the US seeks to do; question is whether it is succeeding. Do you see any success on the ground level? How can China approach this challenge?

1. No way: Capitulate
2. Predictable way: Fight head on
3. Deadly way: Make your opponent think the can win if he keeps playing, but keep him losing the whole time.

Number 3 is how casinos take your everything. Have you ever been yelled at by a casino owner before? No. They give you free luxury suite, complimentary buffet, when you lose more, they even send gifts to your room to comfort you. They give so many concessions, so many free things, you're robbing them blind, right? Next thing you know you need to call your wife to explain why y'all will be moving out of your house and into your mom's basement.
 
S

Shaolian

Junior Member
Registered Member
manqiangrexue said:
That is what the US seeks to do; question is whether it is succeeding. Do you see any success on the ground level? How can China approach this challenge?

1. No way: Capitulate
2. Predictable way: Fight head on
3. Deadly way: Make your opponent think the can win if he keeps playing, but keep him losing the whole time.

Number 3 is how casinos take your everything. Have you ever been yelled at by a casino owner before? No. They give you free luxury suite, complimentary buffet, when you lose more, they even send gifts to your room to comfort you. They give so many concessions, so many free things, you're robbing them blind, right? Next thing you know you need to call your wife to explain why y'all will be moving out of your house and into your mom's basement.
Click to expand...

Haha, this is a great analogy!

Come to think of it, America was also using this strategy as well. That was how they managed to lull the whole world, using "freedom and democracy" to do it's bidding. But alas, the banker, through countless miss-steps, is unable to continue its game. We can say that they don't want to play this game anymore, they just want to cash-in now, while they still can.

There is no cashing-in for China, they are just starting.
 
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