Chinese Aviation Industry

I tell you, Chinese promotion in the civilian sector is doing a very good job in marketing thier civilian technology to national and international customers

ARJ21 has 329 orders and C919 has 235 to give a total of 564 order!!!! thats 2 planes made for the first time and not even yet started full scale production and they have bagged that many , all the orders from the home grown customers now stays inside China, all the money which otherwise would have ended up in the pockets of Boeing and Airbus now goes to Chinese aviation companys who can now invest more into R&D and make better and bigger planes

btw anyone know the prices for C919 and ARJ21?


not a bad start, probably the best start out of all the new comers, I hope China can market its helicopters also in such a sucessful way like the AC313 heavy lift helicopter

i guess China simply doesnt want do the same for its military products

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China's own C919 commercial airliner, domestically produced, will be ready for export to overseas markets starting in 2016, after two years of test flights, said Wu Guanghui, the chief designer.

Wu, deputy general manager of the Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China and a member of the Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference National Committee, said the company had already received orders from the United States and Singapore, bringing the total number of domestic and overseas orders to 235.

"The first plane will be off the assembly line as early as next year. Production on a much larger scale will take place in 2016, after two years of test flights," Wu said.

The narrow-bodied airplane can carry 168 passengers and has a maximum flight distance of 4,400 kilometers to "cover all domestic flight routes and as far as Southeast Asia", Wu said.

The first batch of the C919 planes will use the advanced LEAP-X1C engines, which are installed in Boeing and Airbus SAS aircraft.

The imported engine, jointly developed by General Electric and Safran SA, is expected to lower fuel consumption by 13 to 15 percent, Wu said.

However, development of a Chinese-made engine for the airliner is currently under way.

Wu said the company's domestically-made engine for the plane, codenamed "Yangtze 1000", will be installed later.

"In the future, C919s can carry either of the two engines. However, the plane will definitely have a Chinese heart," Wu said.

In 2010, at the China International Aviation and Aerospace Exhibition in Zhuhai, Guangdong province, the Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China received orders for about 100 units from domestic and overseas airlines, including Air China, China Eastern Airlines and GE Capital Aviation Services, according to China Economic Weekly.

However, the government won't need to solicit sales for the C919, since "it will enter market competition", Wu said.
"China's homegrown airliner is still at an early stage. It still needs time," he added.

Wu expects global demand for airliners to reach 20,000 over the next 20 years.

In 2030, the total number of commercial airliners globally will increase to 36,000, more than double the current figure of 17,600, according to the Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China.

According to an earlier report in China Daily, the corporation predicts in a 20-year industry forecast that passenger revenue per kilometer will increase by 4.9 percent annually.

About 4,700 of the new C919 aircraft, valued at about $500 billion, are likely to be delivered to Chinese carriers, which are expected to comprise 15 percent of the world's total number of commercial aircraft by 2030, compared with 9 percent today.

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A lawmaker said Saturday that China's civil aviation enterprises sternly oppose the European Union's inclusion of China's aviation industry into its carbon emission trading scheme, which is not in line with international regulations.

The EU's unilateral move to tax airlines for their carbon emissions runs against the principles of fairness maintained by international civil aviation organizations, said Ren Jidong, deputy general manager of China Southern Airlines Co., Ltd.

Ren, a deputy to the National People's Congress, the country's top legislature, said the EU's decision could cost China's aviation enterprises billions of yuan.

Meanwhile, the EU's decision has triggered widespread opposition from many governments. A total of 29 countries signed a joint declaration in Moscow on Feb. 22 to oppose the carbon tax plan.

Under the tax scheme, it is estimated that around 4,000 airlines will pay the European Union for pollution permits.

Despite the EU's move, Ren said cooperation between his company and other European aviation enterprises will not be affected.

He said many aviation companies are actively negotiating with the European Union over the issue.

"There might be a turning point, and the possibility that the EU might give up its decision can not be ruled out," Ren said.

hmmwv said:

What about this news from last June? It seems to be the same thing.

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I agree this discussion should be moved to the civil aviation thread.

Click to expand...

Seems that there is no order cancellation


European aircraft manufacturer Airbus Thursday said that the company has not canceled the orders in its order book from China, but is keeping a low profile on those orders as they are not approved yet, due to China's opposition to the European Union's decision to charge airlines for their carbon emissions.

"The status of the orders from China that have been included in Airbus order book has not changed," Airbus said in an e-mailed response to the Global Times Thursday, "We don't communicate about ongoing negotiations with customers or orders that are subject to government approval."

Airbus China's response came after German daily Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung reported on March 1 that China has postponed the order of 35 A330 aircraft to increase its bargaining power in negotiations with the EU on the carbon tax.

Chinese airlines' aircraft orders need to be approved by the National Development and Reform Commission, a person familiar with the matter told the Global Times yesterday on condition of anonymity.

"The orders for 35 A330 aircraft in question might belong to the orders that have been agreed upon by the airlines but not approved by the commission yet," said the source. "The report on postponement is a possible signal of China's opposition to the EU carbon tax."

On February 22, China and 28 other countries signed in Moscow a joint declaration opposing the European scheme that forces all airlines to pay for their carbon emissions.

As for another report claiming that Hong Kong Airlines has canceled an order for 10 Airbus superjumbo A380 jets, Airbus China yesterday said that "there is no change to the status of the order from Hong Kong Airlines, which was included in our end-of-year order book."

"A loss in China business is the last thing companies want to see amid disputes between the EU and China," Zou Jianjun, a professor at the Civil Aviation Management Institute of China, told the Global Times yesterday.

Last month, Airbus Chief Executive Tom Enders said at an aviation conference in Singapore that he's "very worried that new EU carbon emission charges for airlines could spark a trade war between Europe and the rest of the world."

China has been a big buyer for airplane producers. For A330 alone, there were a total of 86 aircraft in service in China operated by Air China, China Southern, and Sichuan Airlines by the end of January this year.

China is likely to approve the orders for Airbus in the end as the country currently does not have a better choice to buy planes, given that the US is preparing to impose duties on subsidized goods from China which may lead to tensions between the two sides, Cao Yin, a consultant with Frost and Sullivan, told the Global Times yesterday. "China is still dependent on imports for its aircraft demand."

China Air Transport Association, a key industry association which filed a lawsuit against the EU over the EU decision to impose the carbon tax, could not be reached for comment by press time.

Nope, no order cancellation, but no firm order neither since CAAC hasn't approved it yet. Hopefully it'll all work out and Hongkong Airline does need those birds to expand its fleet.

escobar said:

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A lawmaker said Saturday that China's civil aviation enterprises sternly oppose the European Union's inclusion of China's aviation industry into its carbon emission trading scheme, which is not in line with international regulations.

The EU's unilateral move to tax airlines for their carbon emissions runs against the principles of fairness maintained by international civil aviation organizations, said Ren Jidong, deputy general manager of China Southern Airlines Co., Ltd.

Ren, a deputy to the National People's Congress, the country's top legislature, said the EU's decision could cost China's aviation enterprises billions of yuan.

Meanwhile, the EU's decision has triggered widespread opposition from many governments. A total of 29 countries signed a joint declaration in Moscow on Feb. 22 to oppose the carbon tax plan.

Under the tax scheme, it is estimated that around 4,000 airlines will pay the European Union for pollution permits.

Despite the EU's move, Ren said cooperation between his company and other European aviation enterprises will not be affected.

He said many aviation companies are actively negotiating with the European Union over the issue.

"There might be a turning point, and the possibility that the EU might give up its decision can not be ruled out," Ren said.

Click to expand...

That EU carbon tax on all airlines coming and going to Europe is a scam I tell ya. Why should any American, Russian, China, African, South Americans, and Indian airlines has to pay for this nonsense?

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European plane-maker Airbus has teamed up with French flag-carrier Air France and supplier Safran to call for France's help in resolving tensions with China over the European Union's controversial carbon emissions tax, which they say is threatening orders, French daily Les Echos said.

The heads of all three companies have written a letter to French Prime Minister Francois Fillon, copied to European Commission head Jose-Manuel Barroso, warning that a refusal to negotiate is threatening $12 billion in Chinese orders and jobs, the newspaper said in an advance preview of its Monday edition.

"The (EU) measure is threatening more than a thousand jobs (at Airbus) and another thousand throughout the supply chain," Les Echos quoted Airbus CEO Thomas Enders as saying.

Airbus parent European Aeronautic Defence and Space (EADS) publicly took on the EU's controversial emissions rules earlier this month, exposing growing fears that China could make good on a threat to retaliate by cancelling plane orders.

Hong Kong Airlines was reported last week to be ready to scrap a $4 billion order for 10 A380s over the row over European plans to charge airlines for their emissions.

Although Air France is not in the business of selling planes, it has in the past expressed concern that the dispute over the carbon tax could harm French competitiveness.

its ok for Western nations to develop for the last 200 years and killing the enviroment but when someone else wants to make country and also use renewable energy at the same time all of a sudden its about CO2 emmisions?

China did very good to cancel these orders, you cant have one rule for youself and another rule for everyone else

asif iqbal said:

China did very good to cancel these orders

Click to expand...

In fact, there is no plane order cancellation.

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CHINA is to open up its low altitude airspace from 2015 to enable a growing number of planes for general aviation, including the purchase and use of private jets, the country's top civil aviation regulator said yesterday.

A trial operation in the southern Guangdong and central Hubei provinces will be expanded to northeast and south-central China this year and cover the whole country in 2015, Li Jiaxiang, director of the Civil Aviation Administration of China, said on the sidelines of the Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference in Beijing.

China's low-altitude airspace, normally below 1,000 meters, is controlled by the air force and the regulator. Every private flight needs approval to use the airspace.

China is also to build 72 new airports, for regional aircraft and private jets, mainly in the country's west, by 2015, Li said.

Shanghai is not on the list of trial areas, but the East China Bureau of the CAAC has said its airspace management plan will be formulated within five years.

Local aviation experts agree that the city should begin airspace management reform in view of the potential demand for helicopters and light planes.

Wei Jian, an aviation professor with Shanghai University of Engineering Science, said the move will be a further source of economic growth for the city.

Wei said the strict control of low-altitude airspace had long been regarded as a bottleneck in aviation development.

There are no figures for the number of private aircraft in China but earlier research suggests that there are 300,000 potential buyers.

A State Council document in 2010 said the country's low-altitude airspace will be divided into three sections - controlled areas, monitored areas, and areas where aircraft can fly freely after reporting flight plans in advance.

China has 9.98 million square kilometers of usable airspace, including 32 percent for civil aviation and about 24 percent for military use, according to the China National Airspace Technology Laboratory.

Zhang Wu'an, a spokesman for Shanghai Spring Airlines, said domestic airlines would welcome measures to open up more airspace to help reduce delays