China's Defense/Military Breaking News Thread

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Maggern

Junior Member
main argument: arms embargo remains until china loses the authoritarian dictatorship label who massacres tibetans. it makes me wonder how and why exactly they think china not being those will be an automatic definition of permitting lifting embargo though..

The reason last time they wanted to lift it seems to be US pressure out of fear of facing European weapons in a potential showdown over Taiwan. So now they've moved from a conduct in a specific hotspot to be a more general "because you're China"
 

escobar

Brigadier
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The National Civil Air Defense Office of the People’s Republic of China (PRC) organized more than 30 experts in information and protection fields from 7 organizations of the Chinese People’s Liberation of Army (PLA) to carry out periodical appraisal of the subject of Research on Important Civil Air Defense Construction under Information-based Conditions jointly undertaken by 5 scientific research institutions of the PLA on April 9, 2012 in Beijing.

The experts highly praised the research subject and offered 15 constructive advices, suggesting the scientific research institutions to further rationalize and adjust project resistance grades and other performance standards by learning from the latest scientific and research achievements in information and engineering protection fields in compliance with the new position of civil air defense projects under the information-based conditions.

According to Xu Zhengfeng, director of a design and research institute under the General Staff Headquarters (GSH) of the PLA, the subject aims at improving the overall survivability of important civil air defense projects under the information-based conditions, reducing the risk of mass casualties and comprehensively optimizing the protection performance. It solved technical problems such as establishing an information-oriented physical network platform for protection and rescue and improving survivability of civil air defense projects. Some research achievements will be transformed and applied in the first half of 2012.
 

paintgun

Senior Member
well there is no doubt there are alot corruptions in china. and i don't think PLA is not affect by it either. all you need to do is goto one of those chinese city near military base etc. found plently luxuary cars with military plates.

well that article needs some between the lines reading, and as always the truth lies somewhere in between

corruption in PLA, or in China in general is no shocker, but the degree that article described or trying to portray is hard to accept

The reason last time they wanted to lift it seems to be US pressure out of fear of facing European weapons in a potential showdown over Taiwan. So now they've moved from a conduct in a specific hotspot to be a more general "because you're China"

x2
 

CottageLV

Banned Idiot
main argument: arms embargo remains until china loses the authoritarian dictatorship label who massacres tibetans. it makes me wonder how and why exactly they think china not being those will be an automatic definition of permitting lifting embargo though..

If this was 20, 30 years ago, it would be in favour of China to import as much as possible. But right now, the catching up is accelerating. More and more stuff are being indigenized and further innovated.

It would be somewhat against China's favour to open up right now. It would stall the self innovation and make China more like India.
 

Lion

Senior Member
It's too late... China already indigeneous most of the stuff. See how China making 5th gen fighter and Europe none...

Just let the status remain. China I think already dont bother much abt the ebargo. They will rant but end of the day, it will not benefit China much even embargo lifted.
 

CottageLV

Banned Idiot
It's too late... China already indigeneous most of the stuff. See how China making 5th gen fighter and Europe none...

Just let the status remain. China I think already dont bother much abt the ebargo. They will rant but end of the day, it will not benefit China much even embargo lifted.

J20 doesn't mean much. All we have seen from J20 so far is a stealthy shell and nothing more. To be a legitimate 5th gen fighter, there are few criterias, stealth, supercruise, superior avionics and superior maneuverability. So far we have only seen stealth. Until it is shown in front of our eyes or proven somehow in real life, those are just speculations.

Anyways, drifting off topic. What I'm trying to say is that J20 doesn't really show anything in Chinese military advancement other than its shell.

Europe currently is still decades ahead of China in turbine engines, avionics, satellites, specialized military grade steel, and many more that would take too much time to mention. These things are the foundations of a modern military. They directly reflect the ability of a country's weaponry. China currently still has to import engines for its jets and warships. Plus regional SAMs still have to be imported from Russia. There are countless other avionics and guidance related parts China imports every year for its missiles and jets.

Yes, indeed China's military industry is advancing rapidly but we cannot be overly confident about the status quo. China just begun its rapid advances in the last 10 - 15 years, which is still almost an infant compared to the century old counterpart of the West.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
The reason last time they wanted to lift it seems to be US pressure out of fear of facing European weapons in a potential showdown over Taiwan. So now they've moved from a conduct in a specific hotspot to be a more general "because you're China"

Or rather, because China dare to have their own set of foreign and domestic policy objectives instead of meekly doing exactly what the west say they should do at home and abroad.

The west harp on about 'human rights' regarding China, but are practically clambering all over each other to sell arms to Saudi Arabia who's citizens have far far less freedoms.

The EU embargo will stay, because America's catpaws in the EU (the UK and the new eastern block countries funnily enough) will do their master's bidding, and also because increasingly, there is less and less reason for the EU to lift the embargo since there is precious little China would actually want to buy from the EU anyways.

EU weapons are good, but nowhere near good enough to justify their price tag. Even if China could buy anything they wanted, they would not make large full system purchases now or in the future. They will likely only be interested in a few limited fields like engines, imagery and EW etc and will only be interested in making minimal sized purchases to gain access to the technology for domestic absorption instead of for front-line deployment.

The PLA would never trust the EU enough to rely on their weapons for fear of hidden black boxes or kill codes.
 

Lion

Senior Member
J20 doesn't mean much. All we have seen from J20 so far is a stealthy shell and nothing more. To be a legitimate 5th gen fighter, there are few criterias, stealth, supercruise, superior avionics and superior maneuverability. So far we have only seen stealth. Until it is shown in front of our eyes or proven somehow in real life, those are just speculations.

Anyways, drifting off topic. What I'm trying to say is that J20 doesn't really show anything in Chinese military advancement other than its shell.

Europe currently is still decades ahead of China in turbine engines, avionics, satellites, specialized military grade steel, and many more that would take too much time to mention. These things are the foundations of a modern military. They directly reflect the ability of a country's weaponry. China currently still has to import engines for its jets and warships. Plus regional SAMs still have to be imported from Russia. There are countless other avionics and guidance related parts China imports every year for its missiles and jets.

Yes, indeed China's military industry is advancing rapidly but we cannot be overly confident about the status quo. China just begun its rapid advances in the last 10 - 15 years, which is still almost an infant compared to the century old counterpart of the West.

I believe your view will change even more after you read my counter post and link provided... Decades ahead? I doubt so... Seriously, China dont really need much Europe stuff.

SIA PACIFIC
Date Posted: 08-Sep-2010


Jane's Defence Weekly


China makes modifications to Russian Salyut AL-31F jet engine

Reuben F Johnson JDW Correspondent - Kiev

Key Points
The PLAAF has developed its own upgrade for the Russian-made Salyut AL-31F jet engine

The development demonstrates that the Chinese have achieved near autonomy in supporting their fighters' Russian-made engines


The Chinese People's Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF) has developed its own service life extension modifications for the Russian-made Salyut AL-31F engine, a Moscow-based defence and foreign policy think-tank has reported.

The modifications to the AL-31F/FN P.2 series engine increase its operational limits by more than 65 per cent - from 900 to 1,500 flight hours, according to the privately owned Centre for the Analysis of Strategies and Technologies (CAST).

The AL-31F engine is the powerplant for several types of aircraft in the PLAAF inventory: the Sukhoi Su-27 (which is also licence-produced at the Shenyang Aircraft Works as the J-11), the Su-30MKK and the Chengdu Aerospace Corporation J-10. The AL-31FN is a special derivative of the original AL-31F design that was developed by the Salyut plant in Moscow for a single-engine application to be fitted to the J-10.

The service life modifications were reportedly developed at the PLAAF Overhaul Plant Number 5719. The key to the service life extension is a specific set of improved, Chinese-made components that are part of what is described as a "re-manufacturing kit" that is introduced during the process of a full-scale remanufacturing and overhaul process.

The plant is located near the city of Chengdu in Sichuan province, employs 2,000 personnel and is reported to be a model of innovation within the PLAAF's network of repair plants. During the past several years the facility has initiated 63 different research and development programmes and has been awarded more than 20 state prizes for achievements in technological innovation. In the same time period, the plant's assets have more than doubled from CNY1.1 billion (USD147.2 million) in 2004 to CNY2.9 billion today.

The plant's officials credit the success of their overhaul process to a decision taken in 2004, when some of the first AL-31F engines were presented to the plant by the PLAAF for overhaul. A decision was taken, according to the Chinese news sources originally cited, to completely reorganise the overhaul process. This streamlining of the overhaul disassembly and servicing line resulted in a 27.3 per cent decrease in the time required to complete an overhaul and increased the plant's production capacity by 60 per cent.

This level of improvement in the engine's design demonstrates that the Chinese have achieved near autonomy in the support of these Russian-made engines. Russian specialists who spoke to Jane's state that this is "another example of how the technology sold to the Chinese during the 1990s has now been fully assimilated by them. It is only a matter of time before the engines that China produces will be as good as or better than anything designed here in Russia".

China only imports 123 AL-31FN engine for its last deal and its clearly going only for J-10A. J-11B, J-15 and J-11BS new plane coming out from production line will definitely be using domestic WS-10 engine becos AL-31FN is specifically modify for J-10A to use only.

Even China next generation engine WS-15 is going to be domestic. Not going for import for J-20.

As for Type 52C destroyer and Type 054A , with serial production started, no way they are using foreign import engine for those things.

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What CIDEX is instead is a exhibition of the many components that make up the Chinese military’s weapon systems, radar networks, computerized control and navigation systems, etc. Chinese firms attending CIDEX are often also not very forthcoming about which weapons systems their products are used in either and it takes someone who has knowledge of that hardware in order to discern what it is they are looking at.

An example would be the firm, Kotel Micro Technique Co., Ltd. This company is one of the leading firms in China for design and manufacture of Micro-Electro-Mechanical Systems (MEMS) technology and is utilized in the design of the Chinese equivalent of a Boeing Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM)-type kit that can be retrofitted to conventional, “dumb” bombs.

The set of components manufactured by Kotel for this kit are:

— SAK01-03 acceleration switches - These are installed in three separate sections of the bomb kit and interactively operate with one another. They provide pressure and acceleration data that are then fed into the bomb kit’s guidance system.

— FKZD-01 vibration sensor.

— INS-M100 MEMS Inertial Navigation System - This unit is the main control module in the bomb kit’s guidance system, operating at an RS422 bit rate. Like all MEMS components it is quite small and measures only 120mm x 120mm x 120mm. Data sheets provided by Kotel on this component state that it utilises GPS for its targeting system. The company does not say whether of they also can datalink with the Russian GLONASS global positioning system, nor does it make any mention of the Chinese COMPASS GPS system.

The photo shown on the Kotel stand is clearly that of the China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology (CALT) Fei Teng (FT)-1 precision-guided bomb. The company also supplies components for the Luoyang Optical-Electronic Technology Development Centre (LOEC) Leishi (LS)-6 extended-range glide bomb and the (Leiting) LT-2 laser-guided bomb, as well as for the other CALT design, the FT-3.

Kotel representatives stated that their chief customer is the Chinese military, but that they are looking for export partners, one of which is presumed to be Pakistan. The JDAM-style bomb that was shown on the Kotel stand showing the use of their components in this type of weapon appears to be the China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology (CALT) Fei Teng (FT)-1.

Chinese defence products were once thought of as being moderately capable copies of previous-generation hardware that contained attributes of Russian, European and Israeli designs. Some of those bloodlines can still be seen in their designs, but the products now being seen at an expo like CIDEX show that Chinese firms have capabilities that approach first world industrial, state-of-the-art levels of sophistication.

In the 1990s, when the Russian defence was in danger of drying up and closing its doors due to an almost complete collapse in any funding from their own government, it was China that saved the day. China bought billions in military hardware from Russia, but it also sent its engineers, designers and technicians to study inside of Russian industry to learn how the weapons it was purchasing had been developed in the first place.

This transfer of technological know-how, plus some enormous investments by the Chinese military into its state-owned industries (what more than one Russian has referred to as “uncontrolled and rampant modernisation”) has produced a defence electronics industry that far outstrips the size and capacity of that which existed in Russia when Chinese industry first began their cooperation with Moscow in the early 1990s.

Today the former students (the Chinese) have become the masters. Chinese industry now has the ability to produce components that the Russian electronics industry (after almost two decades of no investment by their government) is no longer capable of either designing or manufacturing. The initial failure rates on the production of transmit/receive (T/R) modules for the Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radars being designed for the Mikoyan MiG-35 and the Sukhoi T-50/PAK-FA 5th-generation fighter, for example, were so high that it would have bankrupted any western firm involved in a similar programme.
Not surprisingly, this year’s CIDEX show saw groups of Russian specialists going through the halls and looking for components that they could source out of China to be utilised in Russian-designed weapon systems. Russian specialists will point out that they are now at a huge disadvantage to the Chinese in two very significant respects.

One is that the commitment by the central government in resources to the defence electronics sector is both sustained and serious. “They can take a field where there is nothing but flat land and wild grass,” said one Russian company representative, “and the next thing you know there is a full-blown factory or design centre there turning out a world-class product.”

Defence Exhibit showing mostly homegrown military chipset for JADM, radar, communication set and others....

http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/str...ce-program-news-views-50-1143.html#post181579

The latest high-resolution images delivered by China's high-resolution remote sensing satellites ZY-1-02C and ZY-1-03C were released by China's Center for Resources Satellite Data and Application Wednesday.

The ZY-1-02C, launched on Dec 22 of last year, has become the first customized land resources satellite for Chinese clients, the center said.

Yu Wenyong, head of the China's Center for Resources Satellite Data and Application, said, “Engines of large aircraft at Beijing's Capital International Airport can be clearly seen from the images delivered from remote sensing satellite ZY-1-02C, as well as vehicles and trees on the road, and the texture of the Bird's Nest and Water Cube, and even steel beams of the Bird's Nest are clearly seen.”

“The highest resolution of remote sensing satellite ZY-1-02C is 2.36 meters,” he added.

With two high-resolution color cameras and one multi-spectral camera, the ZY-1-02C will provide clients with images for disaster relief services, agriculture development, environmental monitoring and other applications.

China's first high-resolution remote sensing satellite ZY-1-02C has carried out orbital tests, and images delivered from it reach international standards, China's Center for Resources Satellite Data and Application said Wednesday.

“As for the ZY-1-03C, the highest resolution is 2.1 meters. The resolution of our current satellites has reached the level of the same kind in France, Japan and India,” said Yu Wenyong.

According to Yu, the test of ZY-1-02C and ZY-1-03C has entered the final stage, and they are about to be used. China will launch three more land resources satellites, and the pixelation will reach 1 meter, which will offer important technical support to China’s land resources and stereo mapping figures.

Home grown high resolution satelite and Beidou II GPS which already achieve operation end of last year for most Asia region. Asia Pacific full coverage will be attained end of this year.

Europe Gallileo so far has not attained any kind of operation status and expected to be delay even further more....

Finally, there is reason why China has demoted to number 4th world arms importer... Becos of the domestic military parts and component are working. As I say, its too late for Europe to reverse and keep China rely on them.
 
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antiterror13

Brigadier
What CottageLV meant was his dream baby "Steppers", that's what he knows (does he ?) and the rest are just pure speculation

he said "J20 doesn't mean much" ... it shows how much he knows ?, perhaps J-20 don't use "steppers", that's why doesn't mean much to him, ohh well :)
 
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