China should purchase CH-47 Chinook

PrOeLiTeZ

Junior Member
Registered Member
Paragraphs please ^.^ I can barely read it without loosing track of which line I was up to, pretty good analyzing...Gizhou what is wrong with Soviet Designs that you despise so much about?? Soviet Designs are superb but its just the equipment inside that aren't that great, Mi-17 Soviet Design and is brillant platform...
 

man overbored

Junior Member
Paragraphs please ^.^ I can barely read it without loosing track of which line I was up to, pretty good analyzing...Gizhou what is wrong with Soviet Designs that you despise so much about?? Soviet Designs are superb but its just the equipment inside that aren't that great, Mi-17 Soviet Design and is brillant platform...

Mi-17 is nothing special. It is late 1950's technology comparable to the old Sea King in design but with an even lower payload than that old slug. It is not a very sporty helo to fly, in fact it's main difference from the Mi-8 was to lower the tail boom so the pilot would not chop off it's tail in flight by using too much back stick during aggressive military maneuvers! Just to make you feel better a lazy Sea King pilot could also amputate the tail boom if this pilot forgot to move the cyclic forward one inch upon touchdown, otherwise as the collective is lowered too much back stick will allow the blades to contact the tail rotor drive shaft tunnel ( I know an instructor who's students did in two old Sea Pigs this way in one month ). The Hip unfortunately could do this too you in flight with predictably catastrophic results. Hinds up through the D model have this same weakness and this bit a few Soviet pilots.
A Blackhawk or NH-90 will run circles around the many Mi-8/17/171 variants. The Mi-17 does not have very good hot and high performance either. Hinds could not hover out of ground effect in Afghanistan, neither can the Mi-17 with any load. This is not a great helicopter, just very inexpensive. For most that is good enough. It is the Russian equivalent of a 1950's era Sea King that has been kept in production in the absence of a more modern design to replace it. This is not a credit to Russian helicopter design. The sad thing is that the Russian companies have better designs to sell, but there is no one interested in financing any of these, so they sit unbuilt.
 

tphuang

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
Mi-17 is nothing special. It is late 1950's technology comparable to the old Sea King in design but with an even lower payload than that old slug. It is not a very sporty helo to fly, in fact it's main difference from the Mi-8 was to lower the tail boom so the pilot would not chop off it's tail in flight by using too much back stick during aggressive military maneuvers! Just to make you feel better a lazy Sea King pilot could also amputate the tail boom if this pilot forgot to move the cyclic forward one inch upon touchdown, otherwise as the collective is lowered too much back stick will allow the blades to contact the tail rotor drive shaft tunnel ( I know an instructor who's students did in two old Sea Pigs this way in one month ). The Hip unfortunately could do this too you in flight with predictably catastrophic results. Hinds up through the D model have this same weakness and this bit a few Soviet pilots.
A Blackhawk or NH-90 will run circles around the many Mi-8/17/171 variants. The Mi-17 does not have very good hot and high performance either. Hinds could not hover out of ground effect in Afghanistan, neither can the Mi-17 with any load. This is not a great helicopter, just very inexpensive. For most that is good enough. It is the Russian equivalent of a 1950's era Sea King that has been kept in production in the absence of a more modern design to replace it. This is not a credit to Russian helicopter design. The sad thing is that the Russian companies have better designs to sell, but there is no one interested in financing any of these, so they sit unbuilt.
I agree, but with the additional note that mi-17 series has gotten better recently with the latest variants. Of course now, the Russians are still building these helos with cold war era assembly lines. But you know what they say, in spite of the age of this design, if pla really needs it, it will keep on building it.
 

PrOeLiTeZ

Junior Member
Registered Member
Mi-17 is nothing special. It is late 1950's technology comparable to the old Sea King in design but with an even lower payload than that old slug. It is not a very sporty helo to fly, in fact it's main difference from the Mi-8 was to lower the tail boom so the pilot would not chop off it's tail in flight by using too much back stick during aggressive military maneuvers! Just to make you feel better a lazy Sea King pilot could also amputate the tail boom if this pilot forgot to move the cyclic forward one inch upon touchdown, otherwise as the collective is lowered too much back stick will allow the blades to contact the tail rotor drive shaft tunnel ( I know an instructor who's students did in two old Sea Pigs this way in one month ). The Hip unfortunately could do this too you in flight with predictably catastrophic results. Hinds up through the D model have this same weakness and this bit a few Soviet pilots.
A Blackhawk or NH-90 will run circles around the many Mi-8/17/171 variants. The Mi-17 does not have very good hot and high performance either. Hinds could not hover out of ground effect in Afghanistan, neither can the Mi-17 with any load. This is not a great helicopter, just very inexpensive. For most that is good enough. It is the Russian equivalent of a 1950's era Sea King that has been kept in production in the absence of a more modern design to replace it. This is not a credit to Russian helicopter design. The sad thing is that the Russian companies have better designs to sell, but there is no one interested in financing any of these, so they sit unbuilt.
Who cares is what the Russians are thinking money is money and its business. China thinking its heli afterall that can transport troops from A to B alright. It seems to be a stopgap before their co-produce Z-15 enters service. My theory lets :) lets see if I'm right couple years down the track.
 

tphuang

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
Who cares is what the Russians are thinking money is money and its business. China thinking its heli afterall that can transport troops from A to B alright. It seems to be a stopgap before their co-produce Z-15 enters service. My theory lets :) lets see if I'm right couple years down the track.

no, they are two completely different classes. The only thing that can really replace Mi-171 is the new 10 ton helo they are developing. I just can't see why they are always getting ToT for these small helos, when they need a lot more help with the larger transport helos.
 

Sczepan

Senior Member
VIP Professional
according to a german newspaper (source:
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
)
three weeks ago the Taliban "kidnapped" three Helos, one Chinook, one Black Hawk and one Cobra, which was dismantled to be transportet by truck from Karachi to Jalalabad in Afghanistan.
The helos are missed between Peshawar and the afghanian border.
May be there are on the road to China ????
 
Last edited:

montyp165

Senior Member
The 11,000hp engines on the Mi-26 if mounted on a tandem design would blow away even the 4600 hp Chinook, reason why using those engines in a newer design may still be worthwhile.
 

PrOeLiTeZ

Junior Member
Registered Member
its always been about the engines china never really wanted the airframe behind it that can be done by china itself. china has always had keen eyes over the f-16 engine instead of the su-27 engine (al-31), so it is logical that they only want the engine chinook to incoporate onto their own domestic heli.
 
Top