Best Trained Air Force Pilots

Did I deny the possibility of a Mirage downing an F-14?

And those Fulcrums arrived too late. They never engaged a Tomcat.

Gollevainen said:

so what??, we had 32:1 ratio against soviet airforce

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When was this?

(their best aircraft, the Mirage F.1EQ, could down one only with luck and an advantage in numbers!).

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Read that BrotherofSnake.

MIGleader said:

just cause some country had a XX/X ration of kills against another country doesn't mean it can do the same to every country. it might even be an example of how untrained certain airforces are. for ex. Us can kill a few hundred iraqi aricraft with minimal losses, buy can it do the same to europe or china? this is not a good measure of training because there is no control group.

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But India has a highly regarded Air Force and is defintely in the Top 10 in the world. And here's an interesting article for


Foreign Encounter - PAF Vs IIAF
In 1977, the PAF had a rare opportunity to demonstrate its marksmanship prowess in a competitive encounter with another air force. Group Captain Safdar who was then commanding No 23 Squadron narrates the story:

"While visiting our base Masroor in September 77, the CAS mentioned that during his recent visit to Iran, the Shah had inquired whether the PAF would be interested in hosting an armament competition with an Iranian Air Force fighter squadron. The CAS asked me if I would take on the Iranian squadron. Needless to say I was excited by the prospect. As a side issue the CAS promised a reward of Rs. 10,000/- to 23 Squadron if we won, and God help us if we lost!

"He instructed the ACAS (Ops) to extend all possible facilities to us in preparing an 8-member team which comprised myself, Squadron Leaders Javed Latif, Javed Qazi, Tahir Hussain, Imtiaz and Shams, and Flight Lieutenants Farhad and Khalid. Every F-6 Squadron was asked to lend 2 aircraft to 23 Squadron for the exercise and very soon we had nearly 30 F-6s at our disposal. I allotted two aeroplanes to each team member and instructed them to harmonize their aircraft themselves. Somiani range was reserved for us and each pilot was scheduled to fly two ground attack and two air-to-air missions per day. Within a month our performance improved significantly and we began to average 90% scores in strafing and over 50% direct hits in rocketry. Our air combat scores also improved proportionately.

"In October the Iranians flew into Masroor with their beautiful F-5Es. Compared to the F-6 the Northrop F-5E was a pretty sight, and incorporated the latest American technology of that time. I could sense that my pilots were a little apprehensive, but their urge to 'have a go' was stronger. The competition started and I led the first ground attack mission, followed by one of the Iranians; and thus we alternated through all the events. When final scores were declared we were delighted, for we had beaten the Iranians hands down both in air combat and ground attack.

"The next day we received a signal from the CAS congratulating the squadron and saying that we could collect Rs.10,000/- from the base accounts officer. But the base commander told me that since the competition had been a collective effort, the money would be claimed by the base. I was quite disappointed, as I had been planning to purchase some new furniture and rugs for the squadron for our forthcoming move to Samungli. I mentioned this to the ADC to the CAS, and told him what my base commander had said. Next day the accounts officer came and handed over Rs. 10,000/- to our squadron adjutant!"

(Taken from the book "The Story of Pakistan Air Force 1948-1988)

The IAF is a very professional and advanced force, but the PAF (which is 1/5 the size) has repeatedly been able to defend its airspace against the IAF's Aviators.

To megalomaniac Americans, some information regarding the F-14:

US Navy Kill Record
Confirmed Kills ________ 6
Unconfirmed Kills ______ 1
Damage/Close Calls ___ 2
Forced Down _________ 1
Radar Lock-ons _______ 3
Fractricide ___________ 1


Iranian Air Force Kills Against The Iraqi Air Force
Confirmed Kills ________ 123
Unconfirmed Kills ______ 5
Shared Kill ___________ 1
Damage/Close Calls ___ 8


Iraqi Air Force Kill Claims Against The Iranian Air Force
Confirmed Kills ________ 3
Unconfirmed Kills ______ 9
Damage/Close Calls ___ 1

I hope this will make some of you think twice before making baseless remarks regarding our air force.

Issa said:

To megalomaniac Americans, some information regarding the F-14:

US Navy Kill Record
Confirmed Kills ________ 6
Unconfirmed Kills ______ 1
Damage/Close Calls ___ 2
Forced Down _________ 1
Radar Lock-ons _______ 3
Fractricide ___________ 1


Iranian Air Force Kills Against The Iraqi Air Force
Confirmed Kills ________ 123
Unconfirmed Kills ______ 5
Shared Kill ___________ 1
Damage/Close Calls ___ 8


Iraqi Air Force Kill Claims Against The Iranian Air Force
Confirmed Kills ________ 3
Unconfirmed Kills ______ 9
Damage/Close Calls ___ 1

I hope this will make some of you think twice before making baseless remarks regarding our air force.

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Wow, so the quality of the Iranian AF didn't go down after the revolution! But the Iranians also had the advantage technologically, most of the F-14s could fly, and they had plenty of BVR missiles including the Phoenix!

Without the heroes who sat in the cockpit, the F-14 would not have been as successful.

Issa said:

Without the heroes who sat in the cockpit, the F-14 would not have been as successful.

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True, very true. Where did you get those stats anyways?

ACIG.org