Artificial Intelligence thread

tokenanalyst

Brigadier
Registered Member
Ironically, it's what killed Imperial China, after Europe got the nearly 100% free cash injection from a whole continent of South American idiots, they could pay for so many people to study and become literate. While Europe was making knowledge available to millions, either due to practical or institutional reasons, the top knowledge in Imperial China was only avaliable to a handful of people.

Statistically, the side with millions of people able to give their input on a subject will always win over the one with just a few 1000 or even just 100s.

That's also a good explanation for why US procurement is so ridiculously ineffective. It's not just a corruption thing, it's also about too many people hoarding their knowledge because they fear sharing their discovery will make them redundant.

US' new weapons are all "relics" (in the sense they are world class, but only avaliable in painstakingly few numbers and can only be maintained by supply lines that barely exist). With the exception of F-35, but that program basically broke the back of their whole military budget, sucked the funding from god knows how much else.

A near-China sized economy who's putting 4%+ gdp in military should not struggle with fielding at least two 6th gen programs.
I think China adopt an academic approach even to military research because they want to create a research ecosystem. Its feel that the US is like they are losing the ability to distinguish between fundamental research and implementation. Even in the worst days of the cold war the US knew that distinction and importance that fundamental research have in creating research ecosystems.

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tankphobia

Senior Member
Registered Member
Honestly it doesn't seem to be doom and gloom for Nvidia? The fact that any medium sized company can spend some money for a cluster and set up a in-house AI rather than relying on GPT subscription will just mean that more GPUs are needed. Decentralization is actually good for graphics card sales.

They still maintain pretty much a monopoly on training hardware after all.
 

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Honestly it doesn't seem to be doom and gloom for Nvidia? The fact that any medium sized company can spend some money for a cluster and set up a in-house AI rather than relying on GPT subscription will just mean that more GPUs are needed. Decentralization is actually good for graphics card sales.

They still maintain pretty much a monopoly on training hardware after all.

Of course NVIDIA is not going to collapse over night. It is still a very innovative company with world leading products. The thing is that the stock price is way over valued, and it will knock that down a notch.
 

dandelion clock

New Member
Registered Member
To release R1 as open source with also a detailed technical paper is 3D chess geopolitical genius move.

We don't know if they did it purposely, but now the effect is clear to anyone who wants to see it (not everyone wants to see btw).

We were going toward a dangerous oligopoly of tier-1 AI providers: closed, US big companies, supported by a clear geopolitical agenda of world-domination by monopolizing the key enablers of our economic future (f.i. see restriction of NVIDIA chips outside of US as a stark example, it is not only anti-china, it is anti-everybody).

Never like today, at the dawn of a this new and powerful technological revolution, the world needs a counterbalance to US hegemony, if we don't want to end up split in good and bad guys, where the bad/good guy patent is given by a single actor, according to its sole interests.

As an European I have to admit that today only China can be that counterbalance.
competition and fight for resources, national interest and dominance between different countries and races has been an almost eternal theme of the human civilization, right after the clan/tribal warfare period, whereas political system within one society or country has proven, by history to be a largely parallel subject, thus unfortunately, can any greatest scholar or politician give an aboslute positive answer to such question, as all discussions seem finally boil down to: democracy adopted by countries theoretically and automatically remove or even actually relieve those competition and dominace-seeking nature and thus their foreign policy practices?

As we all have been witnessing, the US as a nation, its control of and dominance over many other democracies and to only a less extent the whole world exceeds any empire in history, exactly enabled by modern technology capabilities, military (Japan, Germany, Korea especially), economic (SWIFT, corporates, dollar, sanctions), political (anglo-sphere countries esp., international orgs), (English language) Mass media (also the reason why such notions were soldom brought up in their narratives), and the technology monopoly (aero, space, semi, software, internet platform) in our case, if we don't count the culture in. The US thus gains hegemony and keep reinforcing and practising it through these means. Those countries and their politicians have become accustomed to such obedience and sacrifices to a foreign existence. And I think the saddest thing of all is, it subjugates their poeple, into acceptance or oblivion, like a colonized democracy their ancestries would not have fought for right?.....
 
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dandelion clock

New Member
Registered Member
To release R1 as open source with also a detailed technical paper is 3D chess geopolitical genius move.

We don't know if they did it purposely, but now the effect is clear to anyone who wants to see it (not everyone wants to see btw).

We were going toward a dangerous oligopoly of tier-1 AI providers: closed, US big companies, supported by a clear geopolitical agenda of world-domination by monopolizing the key enablers of our economic future (f.i. see restriction of NVIDIA chips outside of US as a stark example, it is not only anti-china, it is anti-everybody).

Never like today, at the dawn of a this new and powerful technological revolution, the world needs a counterbalance to US hegemony, if we don't want to end up split in good and bad guys, where the bad/good guy patent is given by a single actor, according to its sole interests.

As an European I have to admit that today only China can be that counterbalance.
And even besides that, International counter-balance is a real organic factor and is always needed, whether from a non-democracy like China is always a lesser factor. I myself for one, being a supporter for Chinese people's democratization, never---it almost goes without saying, believe that the US, the US govenrment, its bipartisan parties, its corporations and even the majority of its people would sincerely wish (not to talk about help) China to build an advanced Civil Aviation industry, a cutting-edge IC industry, a leading Automobile industry, even if China one day is ranked No. 1 democracy above India, even if China is India or Canada. The national competition is always more real and fundamental than the political system attributions.

absolute power and dominance leads to corruption and abuse, this is a painfully-proven truth for a society, it should also be absolutely true for the international society. Human beings have not found the ultimate solution, but science and technology itself does not provide values, so we have to make good use of it, for example by sharing and democratizing the so-called AI like again in our case.....
 

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
competition and fight for resources, national interest and dominance between different countries and races has been an almost eternal theme of the human civilization, right after the clan/tribal warfare period, whereas political system within one society or country has proven, by history to be a largely parallel subject, thus unfortunately, can any greatest scholar or politician give an aboslute positive answer to such question, as all discussions seem finally boil down to: democracy adopted by countries theoretically and automatically remove or even actually relieve those competition and dominace-seeking nature and thus their foreign policy practices?

As we all have been witnessing, the US as a nation, its control of and dominance over many other democracies and to only a less extent the whole world exceeds any empire in history, exactly enabled by modern technology capabilities, military (Japan, Germany, Korea especially), economic (SWIFT, corporates, dollar, sanctions), political (anglo-sphere countries esp., international orgs), (English language) Mass media (also the reason why such notions were soldom brought up in their narratives), and the technology monopoly (aero, space, semi, software, internet platform) in our case, if we don't count the culture in. The US thus gains hegemony and keep reinforcing and practising it through these means. Those countries and their politicians have become accustomed to such obedience and sacrifices to a foreign existence. And I think the saddest thing of all is, it subjugates their poeple, into acceptance or oblivion, like a colonized democracy their ancestries would not have fought for right?.....

It’s the state policy.

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european_guy

Junior Member
Registered Member
I myself for one, being a supporter for Chinese people's democratization

I don't want to post outside of thread's subject, so please moderators delete my post if is not ok...but I have to answer here.

In theory I am for democracy too...but I am now quite persuaded that if China would be a democracy, it couldn't confront US because it would have been "regime changed" already multiple times. In democracy politicians are subject to external pressure, or let's say "external help" if they think is good for them: they don't always make the interests of their citizens, but of the "hands" that put them at the helm. The reason why US strongly supports "democracy" as a geopolitical tool is IMHO because so they can better influence foreign countries policies (media control, economic coercion, local politics interference, etc...the list is long and US intelligence agencies know all the tricks). OTH because of this, for them is not possible to game a system like China, hence all the narrative/rhetoric about "our values", etc.
 
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