Artificial Intelligence thread

tphuang

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AGI, if really achieved, would have the potential to change almost everything about our society. If you crack the code to consciousness(/intelligence) you have a template you can copy endlessly. It's not that AGI would replace just white-collar jobs, it's that it would replace every job, only limited by the physical instrumentation we give it. Definitionally, if AGI cannot do any job a human can (given the right physical apparatus), then it is not AGI. If you believe that such a thing is possible in the next few years, it's not a bad bet to make (slowing your adversary by any means possible). The problem is that it's very unlikely AGI will be achieved in this decade.
I think we are trying to say is that LLMs could achieve something that looks AGI to end users because AI companies will do a lot of work up front to train the models and utilize it and provide info for it (via RAG or something) to look like it can know everything and answer everything.

But behind the picture, there is a lot of stuff going on that end users don't see.

I will give you an example of limitations. Today, I had a call with some colleagues about implementing some features. Because we've seen hallucination in responses, we can't trust GPT-4o with actually giving us the correct answers every time, so we had to end up putting additional validation steps using non-AIs.

It's hard to really appreciate how much hallucination you get with these models still. Dealing with hallucinations is one of the biggest challenges for AI users.
 

Overbom

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I will give you an example of limitations. Today, I had a call with some colleagues about implementing some features. Because we've seen hallucination in responses, we can't trust GPT-4o with actually giving us the correct answers every time, so we had to end up putting additional validation steps using non-AIs.

It's hard to really appreciate how much hallucination you get with these models still. Dealing with hallucinations is one of the biggest challenges for AI users.
One mitigation strategy I have seen wrt to unreliability issue is using multiple LLMs doing the same thing, alongside non-AI validation steps
 

Xiongmao

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If ASI is x months away, China needs to do AR within half of x or 6 months, whichever is sooner
If you are talking about machine consciousness, then I don't believe we will ever achieve it with the way semiconductors are currently built. I subscribe to Roger Penrose's theory that human consciousness arises due to quantum entanglement effects between microtubules in neurons. In computers, the LLMs and other AI models exist in high level application space many levels above the bare metal, so any quantum entanglement effects will be between adjacent transistor gates but have no logical connection to the AI model being executed whatsoever.
 

ZeEa5KPul

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It's hard to really appreciate how much hallucination you get with these models still. Dealing with hallucinations is one of the biggest challenges for AI users.
They're not hallucinations. To hallucinate, you have to have a mind that suffers a malfunction in some way. With LLMs there's no mind, just the probability distribution of the next token based on the data the model was trained on.

This isn't something that can be solved in the paradigm of ANNs trained by backpropagation, it's intrinsic to the statistical nature of these systems.
 

Eventine

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If you are talking about machine consciousness, then I don't believe we will ever achieve it with the way semiconductors are currently built. I subscribe to Roger Penrose's theory that human consciousness arises due to quantum entanglement effects between microtubules in neurons. In computers, the LLMs and other AI models exist in high level application space many levels above the bare metal, so any quantum entanglement effects will be between adjacent transistor gates but have no logical connection to the AI model being executed whatsoever.
I find far-flung explanations of human intelligence to be rather passe. There's nothing special about humans. The main advantage of the human brain is the sheer number of connections. There are ~100 trillion synaptic connections in a typical human brain, against the largest neural network right now, which is just ~1-2 trillion parameters. Obviously the two are not 1:1 comparable, but you get the idea - the average human brain has an order of magnitude more connections than our largest neural networks today and it all fits inside a small skull box, compared to the large GPU clusters needed to do inference on anything close to the same size.

The other difference is how they were trained, or rather in the human case, how it evolved. Functional human brains are the product of two complementary processes - evolution (biology) and education (nurture). Humans are born with a biological blue print shaped by millions of years of evolution, which only need to be "fine tuned" on their actual life experiences. By contrast, we're training our AI models from scratch. Roughly speaking, "evolution" is what we're trying to emulate through feeding the model the whole of the internet to create a baseline.

But it's a poor man's version of evolution because it can only learn from human artifacts like text, videos, images, etc. It can't learn the embodied, interactive behavior that the human brain evolved to handle. That's why LLMs are "merely" pattern matching boxes - the equivalent of the visual-spatial-verbal processing components within the human brain. They lack the rest of the machinery we've evolved to have, and that's why they can't act autonomously in an intelligent way. They just don't have those sorts of experiences.

But Open AI, Google, etc. all know this, as well. That's why the current direction of generative research is extending generative models through agent-based capabilities. That is to say, get the model to start interacting with the environment & making decisions, and learning from those decisions through reinforcement learning, network evolution, etc.

That's where AGI will ultimately be born, although I think we're still a decade away, at the minimum, both due to diminishing returns on computing hardware and because much still has to be figured out about how to scale agent-based learning.
 
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LuzinskiJ

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btw, I've been running deepseek today on some of the most complicated stuff I'm trying and it's pretty good. The inference speed is really good too. I think better than gpt-4o.

There has to be some desperation going on now at DC.

Kling AI is climbing up iOS App Store rankings

Qwen is really fast too.
Very impressed with Qwen and DeepSeek and ChatGPT. I find Claude, on the other hand, lacking in comparison. Too bad, I had high hopes for Claude.
 

LuzinskiJ

Junior Member
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One mitigation strategy I have seen wrt to unreliability issue is using multiple LLMs
I do that, too. Validation for me often involves send the same prompts to different LLMs, then follow up with similar prompts based on the initial output. Especially useful when the technology is somewhat niched.
 
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