Aircraft Carriers III

FORBIN

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
I have found very good infos for Queen Elisabeth :

Logistic :
Carry 8600 t of fuel : 5000 for ship + 3600 t for aircrafts, sadly no number for ammo !
Allow an endurance of 15 days in practice refueling all the 7 days and for CAW all the 5 days.

CAW
Elevator for 70 t max up to 2 F-35
CAW size: max 30 F-35B + 10 helos : 40 or usualy 12/15 F-35B few for a ship of this size, underemployed + helos.

Power :
A big ramp up for RN replace in fact the 3 Invincible which had about 30 Sea Harrier for 2023/25 possible deployed about 30 F-35B maybe a little more same number but more capable fighters despite that with these big CV a number of 60 F-35B ( on 138 planned ) is really better/logic make sense, in this case possible deployed 40/50, 3/4 sqns coz also eventualy the 2 can be used.

AAW : 3 Phalanx good vs missiles but few capable vs aircrafts : low elevation, short range, need to be escorted with at less 1 Daring, 2 in crisis/War time, RN can provide have 6.

But QE is a STOBAR CV clearly less good as CATOBAR coz yet STOBAR CV limit fighters weapons load to a max of 2/2.5 t or less internal fuel and range... and it is a problem especialy for A2G weapons the more heavier, for A2A combat less AAM lighter, remains also a problem for FT 1 t minimum...

For F-35B which is capable short takeoff built for it in contrary J-15, Su-33, Mig-29K adapated fighters STOBAR system it is not a problem but QE can carried with system only AEW helos much less efficient as a E-2C detection range less imporant, number of targets etc... so an anti air power less important especialy for CAP.


For comparison :
Charle de Gaulle : fuel av 3000 t, ammo av 600 t, fuel for escort 750 t
FORBIN said:
Interesting for get a better idea have several data and comparisons.

Nimitz are the more big combat ships never build but mainly have only two nuclears reactors allowing them to embark more ammunition/Fuel aviation that Enterprise which had 8 reactors and much more as CV Forrestal/Kitty Hawk which have need carry fuel for their own conventionnal propulsion :

Logistic qty :
Kitty Hawk : Ammo 2150 t, fuel av JP-5 5800 t, ship fuel 7800 t
Enterprise : 2500 t, 8500 t
Nimitz three first : 8500 t, 3000 t
Nimitz last : 9000 t, 3000 t a little more big seems hull higher draught 11,7 m vs 11,3 m
16 days air operations with it.

In more as Charles De Gaule presumably carry fuel for ships, CDG 1000 t very possible three times this for Nimitz.

Flight deck :
Nimitz : 22000 m2.
Enterprise : 18400
Kitty Hawk : 16/17000

Hangar :
Kitty Hawk : 225,5 x 30,8 x 7.6 : 6950 m2
Enterprise : 262.2 x 32.6 x 7.6 : 8500 m2
Nimitz : 275 x 33 x 7,6 : 9000 m2

Cats :
Nimitz/Enterprise : 4 x C-13 mod 1, 94.5 m
Kitty Hawk : also C-13, 90 m

Oblique track :
Nimitz : 237,7 x 25
Enterprise : 230
Kitty Hawk : 227
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Obi Wan Russell

Obi Wan Russell

Jedi Master
VIP Professional
QEC are STOVL not STOBAR, no arrestor wires installed. With regard to weight capacity of the lifts, remember aircraft only move to or from the hangar deck when empty/unrefuelled, unarmed. The empty weight of an F-35B was somewhere in the region of 13 tonnes (been a while since I checked, and it was in reply to a question as to whether they would fit on the Invincible class lifts. They do, it's a squeeze but they fit and have a capacity of 18 tonnes).
 
FORBIN

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
QEC are STOVL not STOBAR
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Ofc ! :rolleyes:
In fact I wanted to clarify the differences and lower capacities for no CATOBAR CV

Interesting you want say F-35B armed on the deck.
Historicaly, i don' t know for Invincible, USN "is the specialist" for armed fighters on the flight deck with in more " farm bombs ", weapons stored close island, during WWII all others navies do it in hangar and for Japanese to Midway ... !

Also for operations, planned RN/USMC F-35B do vertical takeoff only without weapons, with always short takeoff even in land base he is so loud, AV-8B do but few coz limit much the range vertical takeoff consumes much fuel.
 
Obi Wan Russell

Obi Wan Russell

Jedi Master
VIP Professional
British and American carrier practices have been identical since ww2, read any account of HMS Victorious being seconded to the US Pacific Fleet in 1943 as 'USS Robin' when much of the synchronisation of procedures took place. For instance RN Carriers have operated with a deck park since that time and do not have to accommodate all their aircraft in the hangar as is often stated. In fact the Illustrious class were the last RN carriers designed on the 'all in the hangar' principle for 36 aircraft. By the end of the war with deck parking they carried around 54 aircraft. The 'Hangar and a half' Implacables and Indomitable could carry closer to 84 compared to a design complement of around 48.

As I said it has certainly since the war and probably before been standard practice to fuel and arm aircraft on deck and not in the hangar, for obvious safety reasons. Nobody wants anything going Bang below decks in confined spaces. That's how we lost so many ships at Jutland, cordite inside the turrets being set off by enemy shells. Fuelling (and de-fuelling) stations on a carrier are located in the catwalk around the edge of the deck, and the bomb lifts come up from the magazines to the flight deck, not the hangar deck. Their trunks usually bypass the hangar deck completely in case of flashover. In the 60s the USN suffered a couple of catastrophic accidental fires aboard the carriers USS Forrestal and USS Enterprise, fortunately both happened on the flight deck. If fuelled and armed aircraft had been ignited in the hangar deck, both ships may well have been lost:12924424_870682506373465_3078077813656358371_n.jpg 1931250_814160558692327_7819581118002779222_n.jpg
 
Brumby

Brumby

Major
US Navy Deploys Most Carrier Strike Groups Since 2012
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WASHINGTON — For the first time in nearly four years, the US Navy has four aircraft carrier strike groups deployed at the same time. Two more carriers are carrying out local operations, making for six of the fleet’s ten active carriers underway — an unusually high percentage. And another is preparing to go.

The departure June 4 of the Ronald Reagan from Yokosuka, Japan, coupled with the June 1 deployment of the Dwight D. Eisenhower group from the US East Coast, doubled the number of deployed groups. The Harry S. Truman is in the eastern Mediterranean conducting combat strikes against ISIS targets in Syria and Iraq, and the John C. Stennis group is continuing operations in the South China Sea.
Closer to home, the Carl Vinson and George Washington are cruising off the West and East coasts, respectively, undergoing qualifications and training.

A seventh carrier, the Norfolk-based George H. W. Bush, is expected to be underway for training operations in June, preparing to deploy later this year.

The last time four strike groups were deployed simultaneously was over a nine-week period from late August 2012 to early November 2012, a Navy spokesman said. It’s not clear when the last time six or more carriers were underway.

The moves are not in response to a specific crisis. “It’s all been in the works for months as part of the Global Force Management program,” a Navy official said, referring to a joint Pentagon plan that guides major deployments of US military forces.

The level of flattop activity is noteworthy on two counts. Deployments were noticeably cut back starting in late 2012 and early 2013 in response to spending restrictions caused by mandated budget cuts under sequestration rules. The services are still struggling to build up operating funds — just last month, the Navy informed Congress of an $848 million shortfall in fleet-wide readiness accounts, $91 million of which was directly attributable to extending the Truman’s deployment an extra 30 days to operate in the Mediterranean.

But despite the cost, few military displays carry more symbolism than a carrier deployment. Navy officials have said since last year that carriers would spend more time in the Mediterranean Sixth Fleet region rather than simply passing through en route to Fifth Fleet operating areas in Central Command — an effort to counter the growth in Russian operations in the eastern Med off Syria. Truman, after leaving Norfolk in November, spent the bulk of her deployment in the Persian Gulf and Arabian Sea, but passed through the Suez Canal on June 2 to enter the Mediterranean.

In the Pacific, the Stennis has operated exclusively in the western Pacific since beginning its deployment in mid-January, a distinct change from recent WestPac tours that generally saw the carrier spend more operating time in the Indian Ocean/Arabian Sea/Persian Gulf region. But Stennis has spent far more time in the South China Sea, re-establishing a continuing presence as a counter to China’s extensive growth there.

Stennis and her escorts generally have not directly challenged Chinese territorial claims around artificial islands built up in the South China Sea, even as the warships’ presence sends a clear message of interest.

“We’re trying to not be too provocative,” acknowledged a US Navy official. “But we’re working to get used to operating in close proximity to a close competitor navy. It was an important learning experience for us to get used to operating in a competitive environment. The last time we did this was in the 1990s.

“We’ve learned a lot — what can you do and not do in this environment — and that goes into the planning factors. The entire strike group — carrier, air wing and escort ships – have all done very well. And by all anecdotes the Chinese have done well also. The communications have been professional. It’s been a learning experience for both navies.”

Both dual-carrier operations will provide prime photo opportunities for the US to display the kind of naval power it can still wield in the face of Chinese and Russian military buildups.

In each theater, the carriers are expected to double up and operate together. The Stennis and Reagan likely will cruise the South China Sea together for a time, before Stennis heads for Hawaii and the Rim of the Pacific (RIMPAC) exercises that get under way in early July.

Similarly, Eisenhower and Truman will probably cruise together at least for a time, before Truman heads home to Norfolk and Ike carries on to the Persian Gulf region.

Of the remaining carriers, the Nimitz is in overhaul at Bremerton, Washington; Theodore Roosevelt is in lower readiness at San Diego, having returned from deployment in November; and Abraham Lincoln is at Newport News, Virginia, in the later stages of a 3-year refueling overhaul.

Another carrier, the Gerald R. Ford, is completing at Newport News. When she joins the fleet later this year, the carrier force will be restored to its mandated 11-ship level.
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Air Force Brat

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
FORBIN said:
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thanks for posting great video bud, except all aircraft launch vids should have Kenny Loggins, "Highway to the Dangerzone" at least playing softly in the background!

I love the actual sounds, especially the announcement to "fire em UP!"

but I am going to have to go to U-tube now to listen to that stupid song, I used to hummm it sing it, and I really can't sing when I would wind that old 172 up to 150 mph and fly through the front yard at the farm on the deck. Not super low- but very low, kinda psyched me up. My old rule 2 passes, and two passes ONLY! Engine to full throttle as I passed through about 400 ft on my run in to target, no low altitude throttle ups, down slightly below the tree tops, a long fairly steep turn around the tree line, wings level then a hard pull over the electrical wires into a very steep climb out, about 3 to 4 gs on pull out.
 
Air Force Brat

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
FORBIN said:
LOL, seems really :) but don't forget, you don' t say hand on the stick, it is not a car haha

And you don' t appear on top poster list curious ! https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/topposters/
can be boring for you, pretty chicks don' t see you :eek: :D
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Yep that Naval Aviator is holding on to the "towel rack" as he launches, so that he doesn't inadvertently pull aft stick to soon, and auto pilot handles the cat launches quite well, you will notice they take their hand off the towel rack and grab the stick when the G-load subsides.

I am raising 18 year old twin daughters, on more year of HS, I work all I can to met their needs/desires, and I have a beautiful wife, and 7 gorgeous daughters, so yes the lack of beautiful women is a down side on SDF.

I am a Southern Baptist Preacher Bro, so not sposed to be looking??? LOL, but I nearly "wretched" when I saw some guy holding umbrellas for a racer at the Isle of Man, this is the work of SATAN! that wretched angel of death is going to kill us all with political correctness

Remember that our Great God and KING of KINGS, created woman after and from the Rib of the first Man, and SHE, is his crowning creation, nothing on the planet is quite as beautiful as a beautiful woman, no one more pleasant to be around and spend time with, yes I love each of my daughters, they are beautiful ladies. NO I DON"T Want them anywhere near COMBAT OR THE SELECTIVE SERVICE! another lie of SATAN to tempt the girly men to whine!
 
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