Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)

HMS Astute said:

I've a feeling like Putin is going to strike back at France in some ways as soon as he has the opportunity to do. He won't back down easily.

Click to expand...

Nothing dramatic will happen. Economic relations between France and Russia are already slowly drying up . Putin will use this as an opportunity to hammer home his message "we cannot trust West" , especially if France refuses to return money (and they are making moves in that direction) .

Militarily, Russia currently doesn't need and cannot afford aircraft carriers , even if they are relatively cheap like Mistral. Instead, they would pursue (in old Soviet tradition) weapon systems targeting opponent's CVBGs .

HMS Astute said:

I've a feeling like Putin is going to strike back at France in some ways as soon as he has the opportunity to do. He won't back down easily.

Click to expand...

Well we all know how that movie ended......just like the current situation, this will not end well for all parties envolved. Can't England utilize a vessel like this and have more commonality in NATO?

asif iqbal said:

Seriously?? France is asking Russian sailors to leave??

Click to expand...

Confirmed in French TV infos, hope no delivered don't like some Politic attitude...

My view on the Mistrals is that if the French can't sell those ships to someone else like NATO or India then the Russians will still get their ships with some delay. The French cannot afford having two Mistrals sitting idle and pay the fines to the Russians on top of that. It can potentially bankrupt the shipyard and the French economy is in a poor state these days.

Franklin said:

My view on the Mistrals is that if the French can't sell those ships to someone else like NATO or India then the Russians will still get their ships with some delay. The French cannot afford having two Mistrals sitting idle and pay the fines to the Russians on top of that. It can potentially bankrupt the shipyard and the French economy is in a poor state these days.

Click to expand...

I would agree with you few months ago, but since that time situation seems to be deteriorating . Chances of Russia getting those ships are really low now, and most likely they would be either included in Marine nationale, or sold to some country like Canada, maybe Singapore or even US . I don't think India would want to get them, because they plan further cooperation with Russia in military sphere .

Marine Forum's take:

18 December

RUSSIA (FRANCE)
Some 400 Russian sailors, crews for French-built MISTRAL class helicopter carriers, set to leave St. Nazaire and return home with training ship SMOLNIY (used as floating barracks) … probably return only once France has lifted moratorium on delivery.

Click to expand...

Miragedriver said:

Can't England utilize a vessel like this and have more commonality in NATO?

Click to expand...

No...extemely unlikely.

The UK has the HMS Ocean LPH now, but she was built to commercial standard to reduce costs...which also reduced her service life to twenty years. She was commissioned in 1998 and will be decommissioned around 2018. The Royal Navy is not planning on replacing her. They will use their Albion class LPDs.

They are already planning on the QEs being multi-role in the sense I expect they will use them to provide any OTH Air Assault capability to supplement the Albions when necessary.

IMHO, the UK should keep a couple of Ocean-like LPHs to augment their LPDs in any amhibious assault role...but they feel that they are maxed out in terms of expenditures with the QEs and intend to make dual use of them.

Miragedriver said:

Can't England utilize a vessel like this and have more commonality in NATO?

Click to expand...

Royal Navy doesn't build it's warships abroad.

Jeff Head said:

No...extemely unlikely.

The UK has the HMS Ocean LPH now, but she was built to commercial standard to reduce costs...which also reduced her service life to twenty years. She was commissioned in 1998 and will be decommissioned around 2018. The Royal Navy is not planning on replacing her. They will use their Albion class LPDs.

They are already planning on the QEs being multi-role in the sense I expect they will use them to provide any OTH Air Assault capability to supplement the Albions when necessary.

IMHO, the UK should keep a couple of Ocean-like LPHs to augment their LPDs in any amhibious assault role...but they feel that they are maxed out in terms of expenditures with the QEs and intend to make dual use of them.

Click to expand...

To compensate this future withdrawal mainly RN have need 2 Albion in service, right now 1 and 1 in reserve and QE can help a little embark about 200 troops but few number, Ocean embark 830 troops and 18 helos max.

Franklin said:

My view on the Mistrals is that if the French can't sell those ships to someone else like NATO or India then the Russians will still get their ships with some delay. The French cannot afford having two Mistrals sitting idle and pay the fines to the Russians on top of that. It can potentially bankrupt the shipyard and the French economy is in a poor state these days.

Click to expand...

A good point and could likely be the case, but first they delayed the ships and then they sent home the Russian sailors and now we are just waiting on the news

Could France go the distance here and actually stop giving it to Russia? France might be playing a dangerous game here as this is a pretty big deal, they just scrapped a LHD to Russia and Russia has or is in the stage of having over 100 naval helicopters manufactured of use with the Mistral Class no other Russian warships will be able to take those helos and Russia has over the years invested heavily in this project

A serious game and not to be taken lightly, plus with Russia being aggressive as they are and not known to be push overs France could get harmed in some way or another

Unless that is of all of the Western country's back France and help pay for those ships in some way, NATO comes up with the money or helps France market these ships to a 3rd nation

Question is the 3rd nation could end up being in the crosshairs of Putin if they purchased the LHD and probably won't go down well with Russia

It all depends on how big deal Russia makes this, they could make it big or just stay quite and wait patiently until things cool down and then get the ships