A statue of confucious in Tiananmen square!

O

Obcession

Junior Member
solarz said:
I don't think this has all that a huge impact. It does signify a few things, but it's things that have been happening for a long time now, and this statue is more like a belated "official endorsement" than a change in policy.

First of all, the statue, judging from the picture, is in front of a building. What is that building? Might not it be more appropriately said that the Confucius statue is placed in front of that building than in Tiananmen Square?

Secondly, China has been moving away from the radicalism of the Cultural Revolution for, what, 30+ years now? Most of the CCP leadership has been changed 2 or 3 times already. However, it seems that many people think the CCP still subscribes to Mao's philosophy, as if in the 30+ years of tremendous changes in China, the CCP had remained static. That is, of course, nonsense.

Finally, I am more inclined to view this as a renewed exploration into China's cultural history in order to meet modern-day challenges. I would not be surprised if the statue of Confucius was just the first of many other famous historical figures in the area of Tiananmen Square.
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That was the first thing I wondered: the location of the statue on Tiananmen. It's apparently infront of the China National Museum, on the north-east side of the Square. It could mean a lot less than some of us are assuming here. However the shift in governing paradigm is very real, shifting to a more Confucian, more responsible and more open to public opinion type of governance.

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Hendrik_2000

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
advill said:
It is a pleasant surprise to see the statute erected in the famous Tiananmen Square. Confucianism started in China (around 500 BC) and its philosophy (not a religion) spread to the Confucianist societies i.e. Japan, Korea, Vietnam, Taiwan and the Overseas Chinese. I doubt the CCP will give up its leadership, and Communism will still be around for some time to come, hopefully in a different form. It would be good if China adheres to the Confuscious principles of "Peace & Harmony" while it rises economically & militarily.
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i don't believe for once that CCP will stand for Chinese Confucian Party Why should they .After all the suffer ing the got rid of Static , Stifling and Outdated system that cannot keep pace with modern life. People should not idealized dysfunction system that bring misery to China with penchant for hair splitting and idolized scholar that do nothing practical but splitting hair like Liu Xiao Bo. Degradation of Woman. Too rigid society that put merchant on the bottom of social rank Abhor martial traditions. Yep all the good thing that make China weak!

For all the mistakes that Mao did. He did one thing right Revive the martial tradition of China like this hero
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For good or bad China and Chinese society has changed forever and no way they can turn the clock back. The truth is without CCP there is no modern China Imperfect as they may but for the first time in 200 years China is united! and can stand on its own 2 feet Ok instead of looking back look for the future with this song
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Finn McCool

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
This is very interesting. I've thought for quite sometime now that the Chinese system of government is much more reminiscent of the Imperial era than true communism. A technocratic bureaucracy runs the nation with direction from a leader whose power is technically absolute but in reality limited by various practical factors. The main national priorities include maintaining social "harmony" and economic prosperity. Foreign policy is based on gaining "respect" but is not expansionist. There is heavy state involvement in the economy but it is not a truly "statist" economy. The government has broad reaching legal powers and censors the flow of information throughout society but is not totalitarian and indeed these measures of political control have little effect on the daily lives of average Chinese. The government derives legitimacy from doing a good job; improving China's international standing, increasing prosperity, maintaining internal stability. These are parallels with the Confucian ideas, practices, etc. that drove decisions during the Imperial era that I have noticed.

I suppose China is finally acknowledging its true nature and dropping the Communist pretense. I think this will be a good thing, especially since China has clearly lost the Confucian mistrust of commerce/merchants and technology.
 
A

airsuperiority

Captain
Finn McCool said:
This is very interesting. I've thought for quite sometime now that the Chinese system of government is much more reminiscent of the Imperial era than true communism. A technocratic bureaucracy runs the nation with direction from a leader whose power is technically absolute but in reality limited by various practical factors. The main national priorities include maintaining social "harmony" and economic prosperity. Foreign policy is based on gaining "respect" but is not expansionist. There is heavy state involvement in the economy but it is not a truly "statist" economy. The government has broad reaching legal powers and censors the flow of information throughout society but is not totalitarian and indeed these measures of political control have little effect on the daily lives of average Chinese. The government derives legitimacy from doing a good job; improving China's international standing, increasing prosperity, maintaining internal stability. These are parallels with the Confucian ideas, practices, etc. that drove decisions during the Imperial era that I have noticed.

I suppose China is finally acknowledging its true nature and dropping the Communist pretense. I think this will be a good thing, especially since China has clearly lost the Confucian mistrust of commerce/merchants and technology.
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i agree. reminds me of qing dynasty's early years (working hard, yet still with public resentment, and in transitions of still developing the society)

hopefully, china will eventually transform into the glories of the tang and han in the future.

i also hope china will retain its core cultural values, such as collectivism, to prevent from being washed into being completely individualistic like the west, since collectivistic nature is an east asian thing. it's even possible the approaches will shine a path of the "chinese way" vs the american way
 
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bladerunner

bladerunner

Banned Idiot
Ive seen suggestions that the CCP now means "Confused Capatalist Party" Capitalist party for sure. Confused? I dont think so.
They know exactly where they would like to be at a given time.
 
A

advill

Junior Member
China has revived Confucianism because its philosophy is good and has also contributed to the successes of Confucianist Societies. The philosophy dwells on "Hard Work, Value of Education, Filial Piety etc", and has done well for the economic successes of S.Korea, Japan, Taiwan and other Confucianist Societies. The late (Father of Modern China) Deng knew this very well when he encouragesd China to open its markets in 1987. However, there are some unfavourable aspects of Confucianism like authoritarianism. Anyway, overall Confucianist philosphy is an encouraging practice to get ahead.
 
A

airsuperiority

Captain
advill said:
China has revived Confucianism because its philosophy is good and has also contributed to the successes of Confucianist Societies. The philosophy dwells on "Hard Work, Value of Education, Filial Piety etc", and has done well for the economic successes of S.Korea, Japan, Taiwan and other Confucianist Societies. The late (Father of Modern China) Deng knew this very well when he encouragesd China to open its markets in 1987. However, there are some unfavourable aspects of Confucianism like authoritarianism. Anyway, overall Confucianist philosphy is an encouraging practice to get ahead.
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I won't be surprised China will introduce a modern Confucianism, where they get rid some of the old while keeping some core values. Stuff like good work ethics, responsibilities are bound to stay, as well as traditional values like family and interpersonal relationship orientations. These can do a lot of good to the Chinese culture to be one oriented around collectivistic(harmony and prosperity) and modesty (arrogance leads to the doom of a nation. We will see that shortly)
 
solarz

solarz

Brigadier
Obcession said:
That was the first thing I wondered: the location of the statue on Tiananmen. It's apparently infront of the China National Museum, on the north-east side of the Square. It could mean a lot less than some of us are assuming here. However the shift in governing paradigm is very real, shifting to a more Confucian, more responsible and more open to public opinion type of governance.

Source:
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Click to expand...

The building is the National Museum? Then it's even less of an issue. It could mean that the current government is simply not opposed to confucianism anymore, instead of actually endorsing it.
 
R

Red Moon

Junior Member
Finn McCool said:
This is very interesting. I've thought for quite sometime now that the Chinese system of government is much more reminiscent of the Imperial era than true communism. A technocratic bureaucracy runs the nation with direction from a leader whose power is technically absolute but in reality limited by various practical factors. The main national priorities include maintaining social "harmony" and economic prosperity. Foreign policy is based on gaining "respect" but is not expansionist. There is heavy state involvement in the economy but it is not a truly "statist" economy. The government has broad reaching legal powers and censors the flow of information throughout society but is not totalitarian and indeed these measures of political control have little effect on the daily lives of average Chinese. The government derives legitimacy from doing a good job; improving China's international standing, increasing prosperity, maintaining internal stability. These are parallels with the Confucian ideas, practices, etc. that drove decisions during the Imperial era that I have noticed.

I suppose China is finally acknowledging its true nature and dropping the Communist pretense. I think this will be a good thing, especially since China has clearly lost the Confucian mistrust of commerce/merchants and technology.
Click to expand...

Well, I've thought for some time that the "Chinese system of government" resembles both Imperial China, and also the system that existed in the Soviet Union and of course, the system that existed in China before Deng. As to "true communism", frankly, I don't know what the hell you mean by that.
 
bluewater2012

bluewater2012

Junior Member
I think this is more a sign to combat the current socierty obsession with the capitalist greed at the moment, where everyone wants to get rich no matter the ethics. Also, didn't Hu's introduced some Confucian guideline/poicy a few years ago?
 
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