09III/09IV (093/094) Nuclear Submarine Thread

[ACuriousPLAFan]

They don't let you see all of them at the same time.

Isn't there a submarine tunnel in Sanya where nuclear submarines can hide inside?

 

[zbb]

They don't let you see all of them at the same time.

Aren't there only six 094s in total? If the North Sea Fleet has one 094 as mentioned above by @tphuang, then the five 094s in the picture are all of the 094s in the South Sea Fleet.

 

[tphuang]

Aren't there only six 094s in total? If the North Sea Fleet has one 094 as mentioned above by @tphuang, then the five 094s in the picture are all of the 094s in the South Sea Fleet.

I mean there is always the possibility they have more than 6.

I do wonder their plans though. They need a couple of 094s in NSF since that's their only way to threaten east coast.

 

[DaTang cavalry]

Take a closer look at the latest 093A images.

 

[ChengDrumman]

The dB level part is interesting

 

[BoraTas]

The dB level part is interesting

It is from @5unrise. It is informed speculation based on what we know about submarine tech and should be regarded as a reasonable guesstimate rather than a fact.

 

[by78]

This might be of some relevance here.

A procurement document from Huludao shipyard that seeks thermal insulation claddings (made of silicate composites?) for submarine steam turbine and other equipment. The claddings are to be fabricated according to engineering drawings. The total surface area to be covered is around 100 square meters of magnesium-steel alloy weighing some 800kg(?). The winner of the bid will also be responsible for installing the claddings.

 

[tamsen_ikard]

About the podcast of today by @Blitzo and Patch
It reinforces my beliefs about some stuff but it also refutes some


Reinforced beliefs:
- Sub vs sub combat will be pretty much non-existent considering how short ranged passive sonars are against modern subs.
- Ships and aircraft became really good at ASW. Subs are basically useless at ASW. Complete reversal of the cold war scheme.
- Torpedos are inherently short ranged weapons. A thick and non-oxidizing medium like water ensures that.
- Littorals, thus ECS and SCS are not really good for subs. Sonar performance degrades, and navigation becomes much harder.
- China is significantly ahead of what most people believe.
- Putting subs in the Taiwan strait is a very bad idea for China's adversaries.
- Quietness is already beyond the point of diminishing results.
- SSKs are bad for intense anti-surface ops.

New things I learned:
- I thought Soryu's were very hard opponents. It turns out they were not. Because you can preposition aircraft or ships to their base entry and exit routes, and use active sonar. Then they can't avoid you.
- SSKs are really really bad at offensive anti-surface because of their really low high-speed underwater endurance. They are area denial at best. You preposition them. Then if someone gets close enough they can torpedo them.
- Unless you can disrupt enemy ASW aircraft sorties, SSKs are not survivable. This leads to the first condition.
- Seawolfs are noisier than late-Virginias.

Implications of these:
- Anti-ship missiles are very beneficial for subs.
- SSKs need SAM capability. Congrats to the Germans.
- AIP is incredibly important for SSKs.
- HALE/MALE type ASW drones will be very useful because of their endurances.
- China will probably de-prioritize non-nuclear subs. They will continue to exist, but I believe they will make around 1/3-to-1/2 of the fleet in ~2050.

BONUS:
@Blitzo is a really nice person

Slightly off-topic: where is this podcast by Rick Joe and Patchwork located? I would really love to listen to it.

 

[Michaelsinodef]

Slightly off-topic: where is this podcast by Rick Joe and Patchwork located? I would really love to listen to it.

It got taken down by patchwork (was on his YouTube I believe), so basically just have to mostly scour this thread for the general/bigger points they said.

 

[ACuriousPLAFan]

Thanks to @tamsen_ikard's quoting, I had a quick look back to the posts discussing Patch and Rick's podcast from mid-December last year, and I would like to inquire on this:

1:10:00 Patch says J20 availability rates are 85-95% partially because they don't run their individual airframes as hard and partially because they have robust logistics. Segways into USA having an habit of overusing their airframes and submarines. Toaster mentions early VA boats are sent out for 6-9 months instead of the 4-6 during the Cold War resulting in the boat needing to be put in maintenance for 2-3 years after the deployment. Patch mentions PLA doesn't defer maintenance as much as the USA does and the PLA spreads hours between frames more evenly than the US. Toaster mentions USS Boise as an example; came back 2015 and has been in maintenance for 7+ years now.

Because it seems related to what I stumbled upon this photograph, which is posted by @西葛西造舰 just an hour ago:


Notice the top surface of the boat (likely a Virginia SSN).

Is this a normal occurrence on SSNs? Does this also happen to Chinese SSNs? Wouldn't deterioration of the tiles or coatings on this SSN's hull of such a massive degree be seriously detrimental to its stealth capability?

TBH, I'm genuinely shocked by the look of this.