075 LHD thread

[Blitzo]

I'm quite aware that this is a 22K export model. My comment is regarding its design features, not whether it represents the actual 075. I'm pretty sure none of these CGIs represent the actual 075.

Cool, just making sure that's clear.

 

[palejade]

This statement doesn't really make sense given each landing spot would be a standard size regardless of the particular geometry of the flight deck design. And if a pilot needs more landing space than what the deck of an LHD offers, that pilot should find another career.

Okay ... well ''steel is cheap and air is free'' so why make a thin ship when you can make a wide one?
I've landed on an Invincible class and a Nimitz, I know which felt the easiest, and I wasn't casting aspersions on the pilot's ability.
That said I agree that none of the three 'artistic' renderings are representative of what we will eventually see. Which is why I asked the question in the first place. I would imagine the beam of the design will be influenced by the size of the LCAC they will operate from it.
The export model looks too narrow to accommodate a large LCAC - but of course it's just a drawing, a good one, but still just an illustration of someones idea.

I'm quite aware that this is a 22K export model. My comment is regarding its design features, not whether it represents the actual 075. I'm pretty sure none of these CGIs represent the actual 075.

 

[jobjed]

From the 071 thread: alledged Type 075 model alongside Zubr.

I have my doubts because it resembles too much like the 20k tonne LHA design from IDEX 2013 that is virtually confirmed to be an export-only design.

The proportions are slightly different both on the hull and superstructure but the overall design and configuration are near identical. Who knows, maybe the export design is just a shortened version of the real 075 and they could be viewed as A318 vs A321. I'm going to reserve judgement on this new model for now.

 

[szbd]

Actually I don't think China is really building LHD/LHA. Look at helicopters, the Z18 is in initial production phase, Z18A is still developing, Z20 is not mature yet. The navy needs more Z18F for ASW. Build an LHD/LHA is a piece of cake for China now, but where are the helicopters?

 

[Blitzo]

Actually I don't think China is really building LHD/LHA. Look at helicopters, the Z18 is in initial production phase, Z18A is still developing, Z20 is not mature yet. The navy needs more Z18F for ASW. Build an LHD/LHA is a piece of cake for China now, but where are the helicopters?

Think about when 075 may enter service at the earliest. For the same of discussion, let's say hull 1 gets launched next year. It will take at least 2 years until it enters service (fit out, sea trials, handover). That's more than enough time for additional helicopters to be produced, and also let's remember that the ship probably won't get a full airwing of helicopters at the start of its service either.

Liaoning didn't take onboard anything near a full complement of J-15s when it was commissioned, and the 071s definitely didn't have anything near like enough LCACs to fully stock them as they entered service either. Instead, their J-15, helicopter and LCAC complements were built up over time.

I expect the same to be true for the 075's helicopter complement.



As for whether 075 is under construction or not, all the noises from the accepted big shrimps strongly indicate it is.

 

[Lethe]

All LHDs look more or less the same -- like floating bricks.

 

[MwRYum]

Actually I don't think China is really building LHD/LHA. Look at helicopters, the Z18 is in initial production phase, Z18A is still developing, Z20 is not mature yet. The navy needs more Z18F for ASW. Build an LHD/LHA is a piece of cake for China now, but where are the helicopters?

On the same token, they've the 071s still waiting for the LCACs to be in any meaningful numbers, which has been for a good part of a decade...now, if they seriously start construction on the 075 this year, with consideration of the testing / debugging naturally associated with lead ship of a new class (baby flattop is still new to Chinese shipyards, even if they possess the needed expertise to put one together, they've as yet really put one together for real), you're looking at a commission date in 2019 at the earliest but more realistically 2020. That means, 2 to 3 years for more helicopters to join the service.

 

[szbd]

Think about when 075 may enter service at the earliest. For the same of discussion, let's say hull 1 gets launched next year. It will take at least 2 years until it enters service (fit out, sea trials, handover). That's more than enough time for additional helicopters to be produced, and also let's remember that the ship probably won't get a full airwing of helicopters at the start of its service either.

Liaoning didn't take onboard anything near a full complement of J-15s when it was commissioned, and the 071s definitely didn't have anything near like enough LCACs to fully stock them as they entered service either. Instead, their J-15, helicopter and LCAC complements were built up over time.

I expect the same to be true for the 075's helicopter complement.



As for whether 075 is under construction or not, all the noises from the accepted big shrimps strongly indicate it is.

I'm talking about priority. J15 has the top priority. 071 can carry a lot of AAVs so wait for LCACs can be accepted. But everybody wants helicopters, army, navy, airforce, armed police. Navy needs more Z18F I think that is their top priority for helicopters. A baby flat top will take a whole CBG's airframes of Z18. Also the assult package Z18A and Z20 are not ready yet. When they are ready, army and airbone corps will have first picks.

 

[Blitzo]

I'm talking about priority. J15 has the top priority. 071 can carry a lot of AAVs so wait for LCACs can be accepted. But everybody wants helicopters, army, navy, airforce, armed police. Navy needs more Z18F I think that is their top priority for helicopters. A baby flat top will take a whole CBG's airframes of Z18. Also the assult package Z18A and Z20 are not ready yet. When they are ready, army and airbone corps will have first picks.

The Z-18F is too big for most navy ships, can only be deployed aboard carriers, and possibly 055 (though even that is looking doubtful).

As for 075, even if naval assault variants of Z-18 and Z-20 are not ready for 075 by the time it is commissioned, they still have older Z-8s and Z-9s they can use aboard it. I think it is better for them to have the ship ready and to wait for the full airwing, rather than the other way around.
Furthermore, if the Navy is committed to 075 then the Navy might get first picks or equal picks for Z-18 airframes as well, who knows.

But this is all academic. At the end of the day, what we know is that big shrimps strongly believe that 075 is under construction and will emerge in the relatively short term future. It is interesting to speculate about how many helicopters they may have ready for the first 075 by the time it is eventually commissioned, but I see no convincing argument to suggest that the Navy does not have an 075 under construction because of the state of helicopter production/service.

 

[MwRYum]

I'm talking about priority. J15 has the top priority. 071 can carry a lot of AAVs so wait for LCACs can be accepted. But everybody wants helicopters, army, navy, airforce, armed police. Navy needs more Z18F I think that is their top priority for helicopters. A baby flat top will take a whole CBG's airframes of Z18. Also the assult package Z18A and Z20 are not ready yet. When they are ready, army and airbone corps will have first picks.

China is just as used to having army helicopters operating from navy decks in joint ops and exercises, and form combined formation when a single outfit can't provide the needed number of helicopters on their own.

Nevertheless, the lack of news concerning Z-18 and Z-20 is frustrating, to say the least.