056 class FFL/corvette

kriss · Feb 27, 2017

Iron Man said:
Really? How about another corvette? Or a Houti-style shore-based ASCM attack? Or a couple sub-launched ASCMs? I think its current 8-round launcher is plenty enough to handle this level of threat. A 056 is not designed or intended to defend against a determined attack from multiple fighters or ships. If you send a 056 into an operating area where it could realistically face that level of threat, you have already failed in your planning. You could extend your reasoning and ask why only the HHQ-10 launcher and not a pair of full blown 730s or even 1130s instead of just those 30mm RWS? It could easily face a multi-axis attack. Why only 4 ASCMs on the 056? What if it has to face 8 enemy ships?

That's why I said "before it has chance for replenishment". So let's say you just intercepted like 3 incoming missiles with ease. Now what? Running back home or stand down waiting for reinforcement because you have only 2 SAM lift? Or you could continuing your mission be it patrolling or sweeping an area for a sub because you have 12 missiles left to face a possible second attack.

Why not 1130 or more ASCM? Because it's a small ship and there's not enough room. 1130 essentially has same role as HQ-10 and anti-ship is not 056's primary mission. But a 18 cell HQ-10 launcher take only a little larger deck space than a 8 cell one which can easily fit on a 056 and will considerably increase its endurance when conducting many of its designed mission in low tension situation.

Iron Man · Feb 27, 2017

kriss said:
That's why I said "before it has chance for replenishment". So let's say you just intercepted like 3 incoming missiles with ease. Now what? Running back home or stand down waiting for reinforcement because you have only 2 SAM lift? Or you could continuing your mission be it patrolling or sweeping an area for a sub because you have 12 missiles left to face a possible second attack.

Why not 1130 or more ASCM? Because it's a small ship and there's not enough room. 1130 essentially has same role as HQ-10 and anti-ship is not 056's primary mission. But a 18 cell HQ-10 launcher take only a little larger deck space than a 8 cell one which can easily fit on a 056 and will considerably increase its endurance when conducting many of its designed mission in low tension situation.

How many "low tension situation" do you know of where a 056 would be attacked repeatedly by multiple antiship missiles??? What you are describing is a full scale war with another country, and you are somehow expecting that a 1,500 ton ship can defend itself against multiple attacks with multiple salvos of missiles. That is not the mission of a 056, and that is why it doesn't carry 24 HHQ-10s.

kwaigonegin · Feb 28, 2017

8 is a low number. You don't really carry just enough.. You carry the absolute most you can. The 056 can certainly carry more so why limit it to 8? The pros far exceed the cons.

Iron Man · Feb 28, 2017

kwaigonegin said:
8 is a low number. You don't really carry just enough.. You carry the absolute most you can. The 056 can certainly carry more so why limit it to 8? The pros far exceed the cons.

LOL people weren't ever screaming for the 053H3 to carry more than 8 SAMs, and that class outdisplaces the 056 by 900 tons and easily has room for a reload box behind the HHQ-9 launcher (BTW those ships are also getting only 8 HHQ-10s with their refits). But all of a sudden it's somehow a problem when the 056 only carries 8. And no, you do in fact carry just enough for what you plan to need, not the absolute most you can. Because money IS actually involved, to speak nothing of role/mission, neither of which augur for >8 SAMs for a 056 class.

kwaigonegin · Feb 28, 2017

Iron Man said:
LOL people weren't ever screaming for the 053H3 to carry more than 8 SAMs, and that class outdisplaces the 056 by 900 tons and easily has room for a reload box behind the HHQ-9 launcher (BTW those ships are also getting only 8 HHQ-10s with their refits). But all of a sudden it's somehow a problem when the 056 only carries 8. And no, you do in fact carry just enough for what you plan to need, not the absolute most you can. Because money IS actually involved, to speak nothing of role/mission, neither of which augur for >8 SAMs for a 056 class.

Nah... While I agree that in principle that everything has be weighted against cost, I mean how much is a few more hq10 relative to the total cost of a 056?
As Kriss had mentioned above doubling does not add much real deficit in terms of the weight, seakeeping qualities etc of the vessel.

vincent · Feb 28, 2017

kriss said:
Whatever threat it is designed or expected to face, it would be highly likely to have more than four targets need to be taken care of before having chance to replenishment.

These ships are meant to be low cost ships that sail along the coastal region. Each additional missile add to the overall cost of the ship, plus they expire after a number of years

Iron Man · Feb 28, 2017

kwaigonegin said:
Nah... While I agree that in principle that everything has be weighted against cost, I mean how much is a few more hq10 relative to the total cost of a 056?
As Kriss had mentioned above doubling does not add much real deficit in terms of the weight, seakeeping qualities etc of the vessel.

How much more is 4 more slant launchers? How much more is 2 730s to replace the 30mm RWS? How much more is a hangar? These are all capabilities that could have been added to a 056 but weren't, probably both because of lack of perceived need and lack of desire to commit the extra funds. To be perfectly honest I would much rather have seen a hangar or 4 more slant launchers than 8 more HHQ-10s. That would give these ships a far more formidable ASW capability, something which the PLAN sorely needs, than slightly greater AAW capability (and only self-defense AAW capability at that), something which the PLAN and the 056 itself does not actually need.

schenkus · Feb 28, 2017

kriss said:
That's why I said "before it has chance for replenishment". So let's say you just intercepted like 3 incoming missiles with ease. Now what? Running back home or stand down waiting for reinforcement because you have only 2 SAM lift?

I think that is exactly what the 056 is supposed to do after such an attack: go home and bless their luck in having survived the attack unharmed. As it is operating close to home port, a replacement should take its place soon.

Quite likely if it's attacked with 4 missiles the HQ-10 won't be able to catch all of them and they will be lucky if they get away with minor damage.

steve_rolfe · Feb 28, 2017

The 056 Corvette is very well armed for such a small vessel, but its anti-air capability is not its strongest point. The most likely threat is an aerial attack, not a surface threat, in which the 056 has more than enough punch to take out a surface vessel many miles away, in an area which would more than likely be defended by Frigates and Destroyers. All we are saying is that it would seem wise to of had a slightly higher missile count for its anti-air armament..........better safe than sorry eh?

schenkus · Feb 28, 2017

steve_rolfe said:
The 056 Corvette is very well armed for such a small vessel, but its anti-air capability is not its strongest point. The most likely threat is an aerial attack, not a surface threat, in which the 056 has more than enough punch to take out a surface vessel many miles away, in an area which would more than likely be defended by Frigates and Destroyers. All we are saying is that it would seem wise to of had a slightly higher missile count for its anti-air armament..........better safe than sorry eh?

Do you mean anti-air as in shooting down attacking aircraft ?

As I understand it the small range (<10km) and ceiling (<5km) of the HQ-10 would mean that an attacking aircraft could use stand off weapons (laser guided bombs?) to stay out of reach.
The 056 could only try to shoot down the "arrows" not the "archer" and would need support to chase away the attacking aircraft.

056 class FFL/corvette

kriss

Junior Member

Iron Man

Major

kwaigonegin

Colonel

Iron Man

Major

kwaigonegin

Colonel

vincent

Grumpy Old Man

Iron Man

Major

schenkus

Junior Member

steve_rolfe

Junior Member

schenkus

Junior Member