054/A FFG Thread II
- Thread starter tphuang
- Start date
by78
General
- "The China Shipbuilding Trading Corporation (CSSC) has revealed a new trimaran-hulled frigate concept at the IDEX show held in Abu Dhabi, telling Jane's that a version was being built for China's People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN)..."
- "...With the design still to be finalized, You said he didn’t expect construction of the first PLAN trimaran frigate to begin before 2018..."
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by78
General
That's not the point of my post. My point is that, contrary to Tam's declaration that the trimaran had been 'rejected' by PLAN, it had in fact been picked up and slated for production.
In that regard I would love to be proven wrong, I think this ship has its merits. (LCS with the benefits but without the faults).
I do wonder how this ship will fit into the current force structure between 056A(or future B) and the 054A/B.
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
Wow is this the first time we have seen PLAN reloading VLS HQ-16?
Nice work, can this be done at sea ?
In the highly unlikely scenario where the Type 054A empty’s its entire VLS load during a fight
Nice work, can this be done at sea ?
In the highly unlikely scenario where the Type 054A empty’s its entire VLS load during a fight
I doubt it, there doesn't appear to be any cranes on the foc'sle so it won't be a 'moving' replenishment, suppose they could tie themselves to a replenishment vessel at sea and do it, if it's calm! Wonder what the shelf life is on the missiles guess they will need to be swapped out and checked periodically
by78
General
Good question. I'm curious as well. Disclaimer, what I think is not even educated guesses, more like novice speculation and gut feeling.
Factors, scenarios, and mission profiles to consider are:
- a. What impact the added ASW equipment on 054A+ might have compared to 054As.
- b. What kind of cooperative ASW capabilities they have in terms of coordinating attacks amongst themselves and other assets (e.g. 052C/Ds, 056As, 055, even Y-8 ASW varients, etc.)?.
- c. Are the frigates fighting alone (singly) or with other assets. Are they close to shore or in the far seas as a part of a carrier group?
A single 054A is:
- Equipped with one ASW Z-9C, which can carry two (?) torpedoes.
- Armed with 6 torpedoes.
- Unknown number of ASROCs.
Just off the top of my head, in accordance with 'see first, shoot first', I can think of the following scenarios, with the novice assumption of two ASROCs per target to ensure a high kill rate:
- 1) A 054A/A+ patrolling alone, without coordinating with external assets, has the its detection range limited by its onboard sensors and the sonar carried by the single Z-9C; and its ASW kill range is limited by the furtherest reach of Z-9C + torpedoes it carries, or the range of ASROCs in its VLS, whichever is practically greater. The six torpedoes onboard the ship itself form an inner ASW defense line. BTW, ASROCs might not outrange Z-9C carrying torpedoes, but they sure deliver payload to target a lot faster, which is another factor to consider.
- 2) 054A/A+, fighting jointly on ASW missions, whether be with fellow 054A/A+ or other assets, may have its ASW detection range extended enormously, provided there is a cooperative ASW engagement capability.
- 3) If a pair or three 054As are sailing as part of a carrier strike group, serving as its inner defense, then perhaps more cells can be freed up for ASROCs, since 052Ds and 055s will taken on the bulk of incoming aerial threats, leaving 054As to mop-up operations. However, since underwater threats can easily slip into the inner defense ring, I think 054As in this scenario would load more ASROCs just to make damn sure.
Anyhow, assuming, correctly or incorrectly, that two ASROCs are needed per target, I put forth these blind guesses:
- For scenario 1) from above, a minimum of two and a maximum of four to six ASROCs.
- For scenario 2), min. of four, max. of eight or perhaps more?
- For scenario 3), min. of six, max. of eight or more?
Disclaimers:
- I don't know the range and speed of the ASROCs.
- I don't know how many 054A/A+s the PLAN intends to accompany a carrier strike group.
- For all my guesses on the max. number of ASROCs, I assume the worst case scenario in which the frigate(s) are packing enough ASROCs to wage ASW alone, in case their communications and cooperative engagement capabilities are severely degraded from enemy action.
- Surely there are more scenarios or combinations of scenarios and available assets that affect ASW calculations.
- To simplify things, I didn't consider the onboard 240mm unguided anti-submarine rockets, as the effectiveness of these are rather limited by comparison.
- Finally, your guesses are as good as mine, really.
Please feel free to discuss and poke holes.
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