052C/052D Class Destroyers

newbird said:

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A little bit off topic. I know you like making models of combat ships. The guys in the attached video made truly awesome tank models, including Tigers and other WWII German Tanks. They pay so much attention to details. Hope one day they will also make models of 052D and J-20.

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GREAT video. I do love making ship and aircraft models. Mainly 1/72 scale aircraft and 1/350 scale ships. But static,. not R/C. These tank models are much larger, probably on the order of 1/12 or even 1/8 scale.

I too wish they, are someone else would do something like this for the Naval Vessels.

Here's a link from someone with a passion for 1/27 scale USS Enterprise nuclear carrier. A HUGE project.


These guys in the tank video have a great passion and they have acted on it and are producing a superior product.

I respect them greatly for this.

I will copy this onto the Real Life Thread and also use it to start off misc modeling thread.

GREAT stuff. Thanks!

no_name said:

The tiger tank was all-metal 1/6 scale and listed price is 59000, possibly RMB so it would almost cost 10k USD.
For hardcore model hobbyists I think.

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I set up a separate thread for this.

HERE - Large Static or Operating/Radio-controlled military modelshttp://www.sinodefenceforum.com/mem...ntrolled-military-models-7091.html#post312343

I will move your post there.

Take a look, I also posted a couple of other examples.

Jeff Head said:

Interesting.

I could see them carrying 8 SSMs, 48 LR AAMs, and 32 SR AAMs for escort duties too.

Gives a more layered defense.

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I think the above configuration mentioned by Jeff is a better one, considering HQ-16/A/B is a medium range class 50 km ... very powerful configuration. I believe HQ-16B is already in service with range >50km

asif iqbal said:

I hope new generation of FFG will have that, a 32 cell forward and 16 cell aft to total 48 cells for the Type 054B or even split them 24/24

Type 052C has a 48 cell VLS and Type 052D a 64 cell layout and I hope the Type 055 can top 128 cells now THAT would be awesome firepower

Type 054A forward 32 VLS (24 ship class has 768 total VLS)
Type 054B 48 VLS ( 8 ship class has 384 total VLS)
Type 052C 48 cell VLS ( 6 ship class has 288 total VLS)
Type 052D a 64 cell VLS (12 ship class has 576 total VLS)
Type 055 to have 128 cell VLS ( 6 ship class has 768 total VLS)

If they add more than 2 x Type 055 per fleet they could greatly enhance VLS to over 1,000

Total thus far based on above is 2,784 total VLS capability, we can see the power Type 055 can bring 10% ship strength but providing over 1/4 of the firepower

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Considering 052D and 055 VLS can be quad packed ... so the number VLS could be much higher

Jiangnan D5 & D6



Jiangnan D3 & D4

antiterror13 said:

I think the above configuration mentioned by Jeff is a better one, considering HQ-16/A/B is a medium range class 50 km ... very powerful configuration. I believe HQ-16B is already in service with range >50km

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It would be better for single ship deployments or small tasks groups where a single ship could provide multi-layed air defense.

For escort duties for the Liaoning and other future carriers, there will be plenty of 054As to carry the medium ranged HQ16s and hopefully quad packed SRAAMs, so it would make most sense for the 052s to focus on carrying more of the heavy long range missiles that other ships cannot.

I don't know if a naval HQ-16B exist, ground version being only under going development.

plawolf said:

For escort duties for the Liaoning and other future carriers, there will be plenty of 054As to carry the medium ranged HQ16s and hopefully quad packed SRAAMs, so it would make most sense for the 052s to focus on carrying more of the heavy long range missiles that other ships cannot.

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I disagree.

Having cells quad packed gives the 52D a level of fundamental flexibility that is critical in situations where a CSG is being protected.

Incoming missile against a CSG will most likely come in waves for any serious attacks.

The LR shooters will also need to protect themselves if they are out on a threat axis some distance away from the carrier...and they will be out there. An OPFOR will initially specifically try and take those vessels out as their successive waves of attack bore in on the carrier.

I expect Type 054A and Bs will also be out on the threat axis to defend against submarines threats. Having another vessel like a 52D close enough to also protect them will be helpful as well. An OPFOR will design their attack to exploit any weakness they are able to create by removing defenses from the outer rings in...either AAW or ASW. Keeping them in the game for as long as possible is critical. Them having layered defenses themselves will help them survive longer.

Then close in, you will have at least one 052D and/or a 055 to handle the home-plate defenses. They will also need to be flexible enough, IMHO, to add a layered defense close in, and to manage the battle space with enough of both types of missiles spread across enough different platforms to give them the maximum flexibility possible.

Anyhow, that's why I think a mix like this will be good in both the single area coverage scenario, or in the defense of a CSG.

I agree with Jeff, think it would be prudent for 052D to carry 4-8 cells of quad packed MR SAMs even in a taskforce.
In fact, any ship in a taskforce with the new universal VLS should carry a number of quad packed MR SAMs for limited mutual and self defence roles... once such a weapon is developed of course. I think DK-10 would be perfect, but its dimensions need to be brought within limits first.

Also we should remember that there will be 052Cs in service for quite a while which can only carry long range HHQ-9 SAMs, lightening the long range air defence needs of 052D a little.
Of course, I suspect 055 will be the main LR SAM carrier for taskgroups once it emerges. Though I'm sure it can spare 8-16 cells out of its expected 100+ for quad packed MR SAMs, AShMs, or VLASROCs.

I expect LACMs will only be carried prominently on 052Ds and 055s before they deploy for a specific contingency requiring such weapons. Any "standard loadout" for these ships would naturally try to find a balance between SAMs, LACMs, AShMs, and VLAs.

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Anyway, nice to see 052D #6 shaping up. It's been.. what, two months since #5 launched? Jiangnan really do work fast. And remember, this is all in one building hall. They can manage 2 hulls per year easily.
I wonder if they could double their production rate if both building halls were used...

According to Goodboy's Video, sections of the 7th 052D appeared in Jiangnan

[video]http://v.ifeng.com/mil/mainland/201411/017cfd03-a428-48b1-8d07-9a252e0c8d50.shtml[/video]