052/052B Class Destroyers

Bltizo said:

^ I think tphuang's said HQ-9 was effective against manouvering sea skimmers in past posts? And note HQ-9's slant range of 500m doesn't mean it's "effective altitude" (from previous discussions with numbers from sinodefence).

... And I'm not sure about that 50% number, but I wonder how that will translate to potential future anti AShBM defence...

But anyway, the point is that massive king sejong with 120+ VLS cells isn't quite necessary for the PLAN at the moment and building more, smaller DDGs might be more effective and flexible. Though I would like to see an AB flight iia peer from chinese shipyards soon.

And out of the US, how many countries will be able to mount waves after waves of attacks like such? I do not believe PLAN intends to use their carriers against the USN -- it will be for projecting power abroad, protecting interests in times of conflict where you need airpower... and it will be against smaller far less capable countries. A couple of 052Cs and 054As will be more than enough for security at that point... and if it comes down to a sh*tfest with the US then everyone's screwed anyway.

so I agree with kingsley, 052C at the moment is a good choice to mass produce. though the next class should be approaching cruiser size and be much more multi role.

Welcome to the forum to kingsley too.

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MwRYum said:

In terms of ammo/cell density, the system 052C uses is quite wasteful, but that's what you get with cold-launch system; the missile themselves ain't the primary issue but certainly hot-launch system is more preferable.

Besides, modular hot-launch system can load more than just SAM, cruise missiles like the US with the Mk41 / BGM-109 combo, not to mention VLS helps to make the vessel profile more stealth-oriented.

It's true that the current cruise missile, CJ-10 is too large for such, but if the news that Chinese success in a new kind of common VLS system is true, it shouldn't be long before they implement it.

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plawolf said:

Well, technically, the T45 has 48 VLS cells, but they can quad pack some of them with ESSM, which would allow for potentially many more missiles to be carried.

Having both long and medium ranged missiles on the T45 would also allow it to use the best missile for the job, so if something did managed to get within 30nm of a T45, they would not have to engage it with a 100nm ranged missile for example.

That is a very nice, but not critically important feature, and while I am sure the Chinese are working hard on their own common VLS as has been reported, in the meantime, in realistic scenarios, it would be extremely unlikely that an 052C would be operating in a warzone without the support of at least an 054A, so the 054A could take care of anything that gets close with their HQ16s while the 052C save the HQ9s for further away targets.

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tphuang said:

T45 can't quad pack anything. It can have a combination of 48 Aster 15/30 mssiles.

052C is more in the 5800 to 6500 ton in displacement, so it's really not that large. Having 48 HQ-9 missiles isn't that bad. The most important part is the quality of those MFRs and how good the combat/system and data sharing is.

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plawolf said:

Well, technically, the T45 has 48 VLS cells, but they can quad pack some of them with ESSM, which would allow for potentially many more missiles to be carried.

Having both long and medium ranged missiles on the T45 would also allow it to use the best missile for the job, so if something did managed to get within 30nm of a T45, they would not have to engage it with a 100nm ranged missile for example.

That is a very nice, but not critically important feature, and while I am sure the Chinese are working hard on their own common VLS as has been reported, in the meantime, in realistic scenarios, it would be extremely unlikely that an 052C would be operating in a warzone without the support of at least an 054A, so the 054A could take care of anything that gets close with their HQ16s while the 052C save the HQ9s for further away targets.

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Hyperwarp said:

I don't know about the Type-45 but the Sylver VLS family can :

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tphuang said:

sorry, I must be missing something, but I don't see where it shows in those links that it can.

052C can't have 4 HQ-10, because a whole host of reasons.

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Once targets are detected, BAE’s combat system will be able to call on the ship’s 48-cell Sylver A50 vertical launcher system (VLS). That means a mix of up to 48 missiles that can include medium range Aster-15s with a 30 km/ 18 mile reach; or the longer range, ballistic missile defense capable Aster-30s with an 80-100 km/ 50-60 mile range. Smaller Sylver A43/A35 launchers can quad-pack 4 short-range Crotale NG/VT-1 missiles per cell, but these weapons are not expected to be part of the Type 45’s armament.

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