Maintenance period is much shorter for conventional carrier and can be delayed if necessary. They can be put back into service fairly quickly when they are in maintenance as well. Readiness rate is higher too.
Last edited:
00X/004 future nuclear CATOBAR carrier thread
- Thread starter AETHER
- Start date
I don't expect to see a fighter jet with a combat radius equal to the width of the Pacific Ocean anytime within my lifetime.
but...
Is it possible between now and the next 20 years we'll see "Super Drones / Super Bombers" that:
1) weigh as much as a B-52 bomber
2) shaped like a B-2 stealth bomber
3) has an un-refueled combat radius equal to the distance between San Francisco and Shanghai
sure why not?
This is actually a very conservative engineering prediction since All the technologies that are necessary to build such an aircraft already exists Today. It is simply a matter of putting it all together.
I think carriers will play a less important military role in the future.
Maybe the future of Air power does not lie in building super fast maneuverable aircraft but instead slow moving long endurance aircraft with hypersonic missiles. We don't know which weapon system is going to underperform and which one will change the world as we know it. So I think the safest bet is to just build everything and we'll find out when WW3 happens.
You said "There will be at least six 19-class CVNs". Where did you get this number from?? How do you know after Fujian CV 18, CV 19 would be CVN??? What time frame you are talking about for future CVNs??
Some R&D personnel treat aircraft carriers as their children and use birth order as their nickname according to Chinese tradition. CV-18 is the third child, and CVN is the fourth child.
(The 800th post here. Woohoo!)
While the anticipation of China building several carriers at once in light of recent geopolitical developments, there is one important factor which I believe should be factored in - Crew Resources.
The thing is - While using the Forrestal-class as template of how China could've proceeded with their carrier program after CV-18 Fujian based on how more than one CVs can be built at the same time versus only one Nimitz-class can be built at any one time (and therefore, must be built sequentially) is certainly a good guide - The Forrestals were constructed in the 1950s.
The 1950s is - For sake of perspective - Within 10 to 15 years of the end of WW2.
By September 1945 (i.e. when WW2 formally ended in the Pacific), the US Navy had around 19 fleet carriers (CV), 8 light carriers (CVL), and 100+ escort carriers (CVE) in active service.
Needless to say, that huge fleet of flat-decks required a massive pool of sailors and officers to operate. From that pool of sailors and officers, there was a huge portion of the pool that got freed from their posts and duties as those CVEs and CVLs were rapidly decommissioned in the months and years immediately following the conclusion of WW2. This meant that if the US wants to build, say, 10 or 20 United States and/or Forrestal-classes of supercarriers in the 1950s, the amount of manpower required to fill up the posts on those supercarriers were pretty much readily available from the get-go.
In contrast, China basically had to start from scratch with Liaoning in the late-2000s and early-2010s. The PLAN didn't have a massive pool of sailors and officers from previous carriers to pull from, since there were none to begin with. Even with the 2nd carrier Shandong in active service since 2019, China still doesn't have a large enough carrier fleet to train and familiarize the necessary size of the pool of sailors and officers that would be operating on newer Chinese CVs and CVNs into the future.
Then, there're also tens of thousands designers, engineers, shipyard workers, naval base workers, etc etc required to design, construct, host, maintain, repair and refuel those CVs. Let alone the other type of warships and all the land-based facilities and infrastructures required for a larger CV fleet.
This constitutes as one of the major factors on why China hasn't embarked on a massive CV construction spree, even today. While I believe that we will see a surge of CV construction eventually, just that the surge isn't likely to be seen today, and likely not going to be the case for the foreseeable future until the late-2020s at the earliest.
While the anticipation of China building several carriers at once in light of recent geopolitical developments, there is one important factor which I believe should be factored in - Crew Resources.
The thing is - While using the Forrestal-class as template of how China could've proceeded with their carrier program after CV-18 Fujian based on how more than one CVs can be built at the same time versus only one Nimitz-class can be built at any one time (and therefore, must be built sequentially) is certainly a good guide - The Forrestals were constructed in the 1950s.
The 1950s is - For sake of perspective - Within 10 to 15 years of the end of WW2.
By September 1945 (i.e. when WW2 formally ended in the Pacific), the US Navy had around 19 fleet carriers (CV), 8 light carriers (CVL), and 100+ escort carriers (CVE) in active service.
Needless to say, that huge fleet of flat-decks required a massive pool of sailors and officers to operate. From that pool of sailors and officers, there was a huge portion of the pool that got freed from their posts and duties as those CVEs and CVLs were rapidly decommissioned in the months and years immediately following the conclusion of WW2. This meant that if the US wants to build, say, 10 or 20 United States and/or Forrestal-classes of supercarriers in the 1950s, the amount of manpower required to fill up the posts on those supercarriers were pretty much readily available from the get-go.
In contrast, China basically had to start from scratch with Liaoning in the late-2000s and early-2010s. The PLAN didn't have a massive pool of sailors and officers from previous carriers to pull from, since there were none to begin with. Even with the 2nd carrier Shandong in active service since 2019, China still doesn't have a large enough carrier fleet to train and familiarize the necessary size of the pool of sailors and officers that would be operating on newer Chinese CVs and CVNs into the future.
Then, there're also tens of thousands designers, engineers, shipyard workers, naval base workers, etc etc required to design, construct, host, maintain, repair and refuel those CVs. Let alone the other type of warships and all the land-based facilities and infrastructures required for a larger CV fleet.
This constitutes as one of the major factors on why China hasn't embarked on a massive CV construction spree, even today. While I believe that we will see a surge of CV construction eventually, just that the surge isn't likely to be seen today, and likely not going to be the case for the foreseeable future until the late-2020s at the earliest.
Last edited:
right now. Chinese shipbuilding industry have enough R&D base , engineers ,trained work force to embark the mission of building multiple super carriers. once type 003 satisfy PLAN you will see the speed.
Yes, I agree.
But, building them is one thing. Operating and maintaining them is another.
Here's the golden question - If, say, the Chinese CV construction spree is to start tomorrow, and that 5-7 new CATOBAR CVs (not including CV-18 Fujian) will enter service with the PLAN by December 2029/2030 - Will there be sufficient pool of officers, sailors and land-based personnel readily available to meet those 5-7 carriers by that deadline?
Last edited:
The staff training requirement is another reason why I think they should have built two conventional CATOBAR carriers instead of just one.
I would not be surprised if the hypothetical Type 004 nuclear CATOBAR class ends up being a single ship class as well. As any ship which is the first in its class it is likely to have issues with technology and integration. I think the serial production type will thus be some sort of Type 004A type.
I would not be surprised if the hypothetical Type 004 nuclear CATOBAR class ends up being a single ship class as well. As any ship which is the first in its class it is likely to have issues with technology and integration. I think the serial production type will thus be some sort of Type 004A type.