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Randomuser

Randomuser

Major
Registered Member
Seeing all these news with countries running to China kinda makes me feel diplomacy, discussion and negotiations all have their limits.

Not that long ago I recall so many countries talking crap to China and showing massive disrespect saying it's uncivilized, commie, no humans rights blah blah.

Now China is in a very strong position, suddenly all these countries including Japan and Korea are respectful now and want to engage China properly in dialogue? Get real. China hasn't changed to become more democratic or friendly/bootlicking. If anything it's more assertive now. Yet all the countries wanna talk to it now with a respectful tone lol.

Before you even negotiate, you have to assess how much bargaining power you have first to see where you can go from there. If you have none, no matter what you say, you're in huge trouble. That's why you have people like Zelensky of Ukraine demanding so much and Trump of all people has to remind him that he has no cards or bargaining power to have such a tone. People mock Trump for that but it seems many people don't even know negotiation 101.
 
Sardaukar20

Sardaukar20

Major
Registered Member
wuguanhui said:
I don't know why you guys are being so asinine about an African who wants to see Africa industrialise. It's a matter of national self respect. The biggest leverage they have is their natural resources so it's completely expected they offer that in return for factories.

Developing countries absolutely should have tariff barriers to promote industrialization. There's a big reason why many Africans are fans of the CCP, they want to learn from them. I find African commentators are a lot less delusional than Indians, they aren't fantasizing about supapowa 20xx.

That said, I predict that economies like Australia (exports raw materials/low manufacturing) are going to do a lot better than economies like Europe (few raw materials/strong manufacturing) because being primarily a raw materials exporter means you aren't in a hunger games manufacturing death match with Guangdong.
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I believe there is rising frustration at a number of these so-called nations of the global south. Some of these nations are stuck on that victimhood entitlement mentality. They think that because they have been screwed over by Western colonial powers, that the world owes them something.

China's rise was a breakthrough for them. For once, they get someone who can give them a more equal deal than the neo-colonial deals they have done with the West. Some of these nations were spoiled by China's generosity, seeing it as their privilege. They readily believe the NED lies that China is somehow a worse colonial power than the West, and then they flip flop between China and the West. Nations like the Philippines and Argentina casually flipped over to the West on a whim. They can so readily re-embrace Western neo-colonialism and turn on China. All for the ego of becoming honorary white people. Billions of Chinese investment and years of goodwill, forgotten overnight.

Then there are people from the global south who routinely complain that China is not doing enough for the Palestinians. At the same time these same people also went along with the West's Uighur genocide BS story. These people conveniently flip over to the West whenever they wish to advance the agenda of their own faith. Are these kinds of people worthy of China's trust?

Many global south politicians love to play the colonial victim card to divert attention from their failures. Just because you have won your independence from colonial powers doesn't mean you cannot suck at running your own nation. When these politicians squandered their Western FDI, they blame the West for their colonial legacy. When the same politicians squandered Chinese investments, they blame the Chinese for being the new colonial power. And the uneducated masses readily lap up the lies. This is why many nations in the global south stay in the global south.

Some global south nations want China to build them new infrastructure and factories. And then they also want the jobs and contracts to be given to their people first. Fine, but then most of their people are also not ready to build these infrastructures, or staff these factories to competitive standards. Instead of swallowing the bitter pill and working on self-improvement, they blame the Chinese again for neo colonialism. Then some of these Chinese investments were either suspended or seized outright. Should the Chinese not have a right to feel aggrieved?

Bottom line is, much of the global south have a tragic history, but that does not mean that they cannot be wrong. Some of them even display a similar level of victimhood entitlement as the Israelis. If they want to eff up their future, they cannot demand for China or anyone else to bail them out.
 
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Randomuser

Randomuser

Major
Registered Member
Sardaukar20 said:
I believe there is rising frustration at a number of these so-called nations of the global south. Some of these nations are stuck on that victimhood entitlement mentality. They think that because they have been screwed over by Western colonial powers, that the world owes them something.

China's rise was a breakthrough for them. For once, they get someone who can give them a more equal deal than the neo-colonial deals they have done with the West. Some of these nations were spoiled by China's generosity, seeing it as their privilege. They readily believe the NED lies that China is somehow a worse colonial power than the West, and then they flip flop between China and the West. Nations like the Philippines and Argentina casually flipped over to the West on a whim. They can so readily re-embrace Western neo-colonialism and turn on China. All for the ego of becoming honorary white people. Billions of Chinese investment and years of goodwill, forgotten overnight.

Then there are people from the global south who routinely complain that China is not doing enough for the Palestinians. At the same time these same people also went along with the West's Uighur genocide BS story. Then they also demand that China must give them more, or else they flip over to the West. Are these kinds of people worthy of China's trust?

Many peoples of the global south are still caught up in this victimhood mentality. Their politicians love to play with it to divert attention from their failures. Just because you have won your independence from colonial powers doesn't mean you cannot suck at running your own nation. When their politicians squandered Western FDI, they blame the West for their colonial legacy. When the same politicians squandered Chinese investments, they blame the Chinese for being the new colonial power. And the uneducated masses readily lap up the lies. This is why many nations in the global south stay in the global south.

Some global south nations want China to build them new infrastructure and factories. And then they also want the jobs and contracts to be given to their people first. Fine, but then most of their people are not also ready to build these infrastructures, or staff these factories to the competitive standards. Instead of swallowing the bitter pill and working on self-improvement, they blame the Chinese again for neo colonialism. Then some of these Chinese investments were either suspended or seized outright.

Bottom line is, much of the global south have a tragic history, but that does not mean that they cannot be wrong. Some of them even display a similar level of victimhood entitlement as the Israelis. If they want to eff up their future, they cannot demand for China or anyone else to bail them out.
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Reality is pretty cruel. There are those who fight hard and smart to stay alive and those who get left behind. That's pretty much it.

I think the world is becoming more nasty because people on the west no longer enjoy the power, wealth and status they once had as well as the rest of the world encountering more hardship.As a result people are no longer going to be a generous or throw around human rights lalaland stuff. People will now show how they really feel.

That said you still have idiots on reddit or Twitter still trying to spout these dead neoliberal talking points. I don't know if they are dumb or if USAID got more finding.
 
A

Africablack

Junior Member
Registered Member
Sardaukar20 said:
I believe there is rising frustration at a number of these so-called nations of the global south. Some of these nations are stuck on that victimhood entitlement mentality. They think that because they have been screwed over by Western colonial powers, that the world owes them something.

China's rise was a breakthrough for them. For once, they get someone who can give them a more equal deal than the neo-colonial deals they have done with the West. Some of these nations were spoiled by China's generosity, seeing it as their privilege. They readily believe the NED lies that China is somehow a worse colonial power than the West, and then they flip flop between China and the West. Nations like the Philippines and Argentina casually flipped over to the West on a whim. They can so readily re-embrace Western neo-colonialism and turn on China. All for the ego of becoming honorary white people. Billions of Chinese investment and years of goodwill, forgotten overnight.

Then there are people from the global south who routinely complain that China is not doing enough for the Palestinians. At the same time these same people also went along with the West's Uighur genocide BS story. These people conveniently flip over to the West whenever they wish to advance the agenda of their own faith. Are these kinds of people worthy of China's trust?

Many global south politicians love to play the colonial victim card to divert attention from their failures. Just because you have won your independence from colonial powers doesn't mean you cannot suck at running your own nation. When these politicians squandered their Western FDI, they blame the West for their colonial legacy. When the same politicians squandered Chinese investments, they blame the Chinese for being the new colonial power. And the uneducated masses readily lap up the lies. This is why many nations in the global south stay in the global south.

Some global south nations want China to build them new infrastructure and factories. And then they also want the jobs and contracts to be given to their people first. Fine, but then most of their people are also not ready to build these infrastructures, or staff these factories to competitive standards. Instead of swallowing the bitter pill and working on self-improvement, they blame the Chinese again for neo colonialism. Then some of these Chinese investments were either suspended or seized outright. Should the Chinese not have a right to feel aggrieved?

Bottom line is, much of the global south have a tragic history, but that does not mean that they cannot be wrong. Some of them even display a similar level of victimhood entitlement as the Israelis. If they want to eff up their future, they cannot demand for China or anyone else to bail them out.
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It's like someone calling China talking about it's century of humiliation a "victimhood mentality". Saying that African countries or global south countries have a right to industrialize is not "victimhood mentality". What you want is to maintain a system where you perpetually benefit at other's expense and when they call it out you say the world owes us something. There's nobody blaming China for anything, last I checked Africans and other members of the global south have been extremely complimentary towards China (remember the Kenyan President that said they get lectures from the west and get infrastructure from China?) so who's blaming who? Cut the stiff upper lip, China has done well for itself but don't let that get to your head, you of all people should know that nothing should be taken for granted. Don't end up like the monsters you deride.
 
J

jiajia99

Senior Member
Registered Member
fatzergling said:
Australia and New Zealand might be the two Anglo nations most insulated from the upcoming crisis, at the terrible cost of falling into the Chinese sphere. But I suppose with China's manufacturing, the conversion rate between NZ wool and Australia ore to manufactured goods will be high enough to ensure a comfortable life for both nations citizens.

Developing countries should co-plan their industrialization with China, so that China does not swallow their industries whole. China could even partition out several sectors that those nations would monopolize. Ultimately, if the goal for both China and the developing country is balanced trade, such a goal can only be accomplished via coordination.

Tbh, as the industry becomes more and more capital-intensive, and profit margins drop as a result, the ratio of raw materials to finished goods tilts in the factor of the raw material exporter, unless the owner of such industry chooses to monopolize those goods. The western countries often monopolize technology in order to keep the price artifically high, but in theory, a manufacturing economy should see its profits frittered away by heavy capital investment.
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Falling into Chinas orbit is a good thing as far as I am concerned. Besides who the hell whats to become the USA or Europe right now
Mmmeeeto said:
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1960032771943841950

Wolf warrior diplomacy vs kindergartener diplomacy
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Seriously listening to Gordon Chang, another out of touch idiot must’ve damaged what is left of his brain
 
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