Z-21/Z-X heavy attack helicopter

Another point I forgot to mention in my earlier post, which I seemingly can't edit, is that helicopters have proven to be quite suitable to deal with slow flying, long range drones. While not exclusively limited to attack helicopters per say, especially the Ka-52, Mi-8 and Mi-24 in Russian service, as well as the Mi-8 and Mi-24 in Ukrainian service, have proven to be quite useful in that role. Engaging such targets either with missiles or with their gun armaments.

I think this is quite a valid point to consider as well. Given that fast moving jets are quite unsuited for that task and interceptor drones have their own issues as well. It's just another, quite recent, addition to the portfolio of the helicopter, which are versatile machines through and through.

And I agree with @gelgoog that especially heavier helicopters will probably retain their niche for a long time, while lighter types could be more easily supplanted by drones or militarized versions of civilian helicopters (H145M for example). Heavy attack helos maximize the strengths of attack helicopters in the modern battlefield. Weapon range is definitely something many strife to increase, as well as enhancing the sensor suites further and further.

EmoBirb said:

The only thing that could effectively replace an attack helicopter is an unmanned drone of comparable range, with a comparable sensor suite and similar weapons payload. So basically an unmanned attack helicopter.

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I don't quite see it that way. To generalise trends from recent conflicts...

Big, detectable drones (e.g Bayraktar) are not very effective unless you have total control over the airspace. A attack helo sized drone is exactly that and is vulnerable in every way a AH will be, just minus the human casualty when it gets shot down.

EmoBirb said:

Russian helicopters like the Ka-52/Ka-52M and Mi-28/Mi-28NM have proven, that when deployed cautiously and more defensively, that they're able to inflict heavy casualties and stop opposing assaults. They didn't do that alone, but together with drones, infantry, artillery, fighter bombers and cleverly placed mine fields, but they have been vital assets. They were crucial in shattering the Ukrainian counter offensive and they have also heavily contributed to driving out the Ukrainians from Kursk. These instances had the helicopters operate under the cover of friendly air defense assets and being able to engage targets that were either entrenched our susceptible to attack by maneuvering. Their ability to loiter, respond quickly and carry significant amounts of ordnance and sensors with them makes them lethal platforms.

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As you mentioned, where the AH platform has been successful has been in cautious use, at standoff range, using it's mobility to plug lightly covered sectors.

However, putting all your sensor and missile eggs into one basket means you have a conflict between getting within sensor range and staying out of detection/shoot-down range. It isn't hard to have 50km NLOS type missiles on your AH platform - that kind of range can put your platform out of harms way from detection and return fire . You are, however, going to struggle to implement cost effective sensors to operate from that range in a safe, defensive posture.

My 2c.
If you have a sector properly covered with boots on the ground, it will be easy to have NLOS ground launchers and an airborne sensor platform to provide ISR for the shooters. An upgraded, VLO Orlan-30 style drone will be cheaper, harder to detect and bring down than a full sized AH UCAV.

If you need to rely on a AH style cavalry to cover large spans of lightly defended ground, then split the role into 2 platforms. A small VLO ISR platform that goes hunting for targets and a large "arsenal" platform hanging way back to sling missiles. No sense replicating the AH package when we acknowledge that that package has limitations.

A heavy attack helicopter like Ka-52M is much larger than the Bayraktar TB2. The problem with the TB2 is its weapons cannot out range the Tor SAM. It might be ok against older Strela systems or other IR guided weapons but not against radar guided systems.

gelgoog said:

A heavy attack helicopter like Ka-52M is much larger than the Bayraktar TB2. The problem with the TB2 is its weapons cannot out range the Tor SAM. It might be ok against older Strela systems or other IR guided weapons but not against radar guided systems.

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They couldn't (though just barely, and TB2s still exchanged alright with such SAMs). Now there's MAM-T and Kemankes in two variants.
But overall MALE drones don't do things manned low altitude platforms do.

The thing is the Soviets traditionally used a solid rocket propellant formulation which had much lower energy density than what NATO used. They did it because that formulation lasted longer in extreme cold conditions. Usually the Soviets compensated for this with larger missiles. Now imagine they switch the missile propellant. Which is what the Russians have been doing. Compare the ranges of Buk-M1 and M3.

One wonders if we will see MUM-T catch on with rotary-wing aviation the same way we are with fixed-wings.

Heliox said:

Big, detectable drones (e.g Bayraktar) are not very effective unless you have total control over the airspace. A attack helo sized drone is exactly that and is vulnerable in every way a AH will be, just minus the human casualty when it gets shot down.

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PLA is testing attack helos working with surveillance drones. The drones will survey the battlefield and lase targets and attack helos fire the missiles.

The following is just an example of cheap stealth drones.

Another sighting.

Zoomed in images of above.

Double fin?? What are those?