US Laser and Rail Gun Development News

Re: Naval Laser CIWS and Rail Gun Technology and Development News


Rail guns... On Tanks and IFV's.

Re: Naval Laser CIWS and Rail Gun Technology and Development News

TerraN_EmpirE said:

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Rail guns... On Tanks and IFV's.

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I don't think it's practical right now to put them on an IFV, or even a tank at this point. Maybe something like the M109 howitzer

Reason I say this is especially in the desert I feel this thing would produce so much heat, it would need to be cooled. And in the desert like Iraq and Afghanistan this would be tough. Better on ships were water can be pumped in.

Re: Naval Laser CIWS and Rail Gun Technology and Development News

Bernard said:

I don't think it's practical right now to put them on an IFV, or even a tank at this point. Maybe something like the M109 howitzer

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Reason I say this is especially in the desert I feel this thing would produce so much heat, it would need to be cooled. And in the desert like Iraq and Afghanistan this would be tough. Better on ships were water can be pumped in.

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The biggest issue I think right now is not cooling. A compressed jet of CO2 could do that. no it's power. The power requirements would be monstrous now options are emerging to make up for this the Hybrid drive system with it's batteries and multiple power packs for example. a Rail tank might have a primary power pack in the form of a conventional multi fuel V12 Engine with a second power pack perhaps a gas turbine engine to generate electricity specifically for the gun.

Re: US Navy DDG 1000 Zumwalt Class

Jeff Head said:

You are incorrect.

The Vietnam War ended in the early to mid 70s. The Iowa class were modernized again in the 1980s and used several times thereafter for shore bombardment. In fact one of the reasons to get the AGS with its capabilities on DD-21 which became DDG-1000 was a desire for the type of long range naval bombardment that the US Navy has lacked since the Iowa class was mothballed again.

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I did think of the USS Iowa but a quick check didn't turn up anything from Wiki. Thanks for that.

Jeff Head said:

The Zumwalts are serious multi-role capable DDGs. Originally with upwards of 30 planned, there would be no doubt as to them filling many missions.

Now, with three, the program will provide bombardment and defense capabilities for ARGs...but they will also be an investment in terms of bringing forward new, critical technologies.

You will see the rail guns on these vessels in the relative near term, and the experience we gain from that will be invaluable. Perhaps the same for the naval laser...but the rail gun will be the more valuable of those two IMHO.

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I do agree that the three ships are technology platform and test beds for something into the future and the story is probably less defined until we see some tangible development leveraging off it. Shore bombardment I suspect is a convenient story but is probably not the main story. The rail gun and Zumwalt at a conceptual level is not a secret but how these two converge at a test level is not something I have seen actively discussed. Do you think we will see the rail gun development moving onto the Zumwalt once the ship is commissioned or is there still a disconnect between the two in terms of timing?

Re: US Navy DDG 1000 Zumwalt Class

Brumby said:

The rail gun and Zumwalt at a conceptual level is not a secret but how these two converge at a test level is not something I have seen actively discussed. Do you think we will see the rail gun development moving onto the Zumwalt once the ship is commissioned or is there still a disconnect between the two in terms of timing?

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The issue is this:

They spent a LOT of money developing the AGS for the Zumwalt. Originally they thought they would have a goodly number of vessels at two guns per vessel. Now, they are going to have three and that means six guns...perhaps two or three more for spares, with no other platform in the foreseeable future.

I believe the rail gun is going to render the AGS largely obsolete...though there is a case to be made at first for HE, PGM, and AP, etc. rounds for the AGS over purely kinetic rounds for the rail gun...but then again there is nothing to keep them from developing all sorts of munitions for the rail gun either. And I believe they will.

The AGS will allow for longer range PGM, and will allow for strong anti-air capabilities.

So...yes, I believe the AGS will go onto the Zumwalts...and probably, if they have the power for it...a 127mm version for the Burkes as well.

When? Well we know that in 2016, they will place a working unit on one of the new Spearhead Class JHSV vessels, specifically, the USNS Millinocket (JHSV-3). My guess is that they will run live fire tests on that baby of all sorts over a year or more time and then they will come up with a schedule for implementation into the fleet.

I expect we will see the rail gun actually deployed in the early 2020s.

The Navy said the following about this early in 2014 when they announced the plan to implement the at sea tests:

US Navy said:

"The electromagnetic railgun represents an incredible new offensive capability for the U.S. Navy," said Rear Adm. Bryant Fuller, the Navy's chief engineer. "This capability will allow us to effectively counter a wide-range of threats at a relatively low cost, while keeping our ships and sailors safer by removing the need to carry as many high-explosive weapons."

"EM railgun technology will complement current weapons currently onboard surface combatants and offer a few specific advantages. Against specific threats, the cost per engagement is orders of magnitude less expensive than comparable missile engagements. The projectile itself is being designed to be common with some current powder guns, enabling the conservation of expensive missiles for use against more complex threats.

"Energetic weapons, such as EM railguns, are the future of naval combat," said Rear Adm. Matt Klunder, the chief of naval research. "The U.S. Navy is at the forefront of this game-changing technology."

"This demonstration is the latest in a series of technical maturation efforts designed to provide an operational railgun to the fleet. Since 2005, the Navy and its partners in industry and academia have been testing railgun technology at the Naval Surface Warfare Center in Dahlgren, Va., and the Naval Research Lab where the service has a number of prototype systems.

The final operational system will be capable of launching guided, multi-mission projectiles to a range of 110 nautical miles against a wide range of threats. The series of tests are designed to capture lessons for incorporation into a future tactical design and will allow the Navy to best understand needed ship modifications before fully integrating the technology.

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So, at first, we will probably see one AGS and one Rail Gun. Coupled with the missiles aboard and the other weapons, this will allow for a great deal of flexibility.

But make no mistake, the Rail Gun is viewed as a game changer. It will ultimately be used against land targets of all sorts, anti-shipping duties, anti-air duties, etc. I suspect that even more uses will develop.

for example, developing a small caliber, say a 30mm or 35mm weapon mounted on blisters underneath a vessel could make for an effective, super-cavitating defensive weapon against torpedoes. You read it here first.

Actually, if you ever read my Dragons Fury: World War against America and the West, World War III novel...you read it there first ten years ago.

They actually have already begun preparing the Millinocket for installation. I am not sue how far along they are, but in July 2014 they had late prototype weapons out to the ship and have begun making the alterations necessary.

See:

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NavyReco reviewed this at Sea Air Space 2014 with BAE Systems:


...and another good video regarding the same:

Re: Naval Laser CIWS and Rail Gun Technology and Development News

Re: Naval Laser CIWS and Rail Gun Technology and Development News

Janes is now reporting about the US Navy LaWS being unveiled and deployed on the USS Ponce which I posted on November 16th.



Here it is on my

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Re: US military news thread




This Is What Aircraft Mounted Laser Guns Could Look Like (From DARPA and Northrup Grumman).

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Naval Today said:

Boeing has been awarded a $29.5 million contract to design and develop a beam control system that could provide exceptional accuracy for laser weapons on U.S. Navy warships.

The company will begin to design a prototype High Power Beam Control Subsystem (HP BCSS) that’s compatible with High Energy Lasers (HEL) based on solid-state laser (SSL) technology.

Boeing’s solution will be compatible with systems other companies are designing for the Office of Naval Research’s (ONR) Solid State Laser Technology Maturation (SSL-TM) program.

The resulting beam control system will focus and hold a laser on a moving aimpoint long enough to disable the target. Doing that with a ship-based laser is particularly challenging, given the maritime environment and constant movement of an at-sea vessel.

Peggy Morse, vice president, Boeing Directed Energy & Strategic Systems (DESS), said:

"Boeing innovations in beam control and directed energy technologies are keys to understanding laser weapon system configurations that could yield a capability for the Navy in their maritime environment."

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This is good news and evidence that the weapon development is maturing. Probably based on the many tests, and now the deployment aboard the USS Ponce.

Updating a quiet thread. First, LAWS in action onboard USS Ponce.