Trade War with China

Status
Not open for further replies.

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
All Trump's trade war does is spur on Made in China 2025. It turns the nightmare into reality. The US bans just turns foreign corporations away from using their licensed products thus they make no money. China will create its own standard and US companies will lose out. Even if there's a trade agreement, China will definitely be going its own way. And let's not forget this all started during the Obama administration. The EU also criticized and worried that China would not be buying from them because of Made in China 2025. Trump is just carrying out the policies to stop it. Don't think this stops when Trump is out of office.
 

localizer

Colonel
Registered Member
All Trump's trade war does is spur on Made in China 2025. It turns the nightmare into reality. The US bans just turns foreign corporations away from using their licensed products thus they make no money. China will create its own standard and US companies will lose out. Even if there's a trade agreement, China will definitely be going its own way. And let's not forget this all started during the Obama administration. The EU also criticized and worried that China would not be buying from them because of Made in China 2025. Trump is just carrying out the policies to stop it. Don't think this stops when Trump is out of office.

He’s making the CCP look like Nostradamus
 

Just4Fun

Junior Member
Registered Member
Will Low RMB Exchange Rate Cause Imported Inflation in China?
How Low RMB Exchange Rate Becomes Trump's headache?

Someone has been fanning, in this thread, the misinformation that low RMB exchange rate will cause imported inflation in China, and has concluded, in a self-claimed authoritative way, that China is "between a rock of a hard place" because of low Yuan exchange rate, suggesting China is losing the trade war. But this guy knows nothing about economics.

There is no danger of imported inflation in current China no matter how low Yuan rate might go against the Dollar, unless China's economic fundamentals have changed.

US brokerage houses, Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan Chase in particular, have been urging their clients to prepare for a Yuan rate breaking 7, even breaking 8, for quite a while now. You can argue today's Yuan devaluation is a result of profit-driven speculation, or a politics-motivated speculation, or a monetary policy maneuver, or anything else, but no matter what the causes may be, the Yuan devaluation can't cause, and won't cause inflation in China. To have an inflation in China, you have to change China's economic fundamentals, including the mechanism of pricing in China.

To most of economies in the world, imported inflation is a fake topic. You may have an inflation, such as Germany after WWI, or Zimbabwe in the 1990s, but your inflation is unlikely to be an imported one unless (1) your currency is well accepted by foreign countries, so you can import foreign consumer goods and foreign services at your will; and (2) your import is so huge that imported goods and services dictate your domestic prices. Clearly there are only few countries can meet these criteria in history. Germany's high inflation from the 1920s to the 1930s was certainly not caused by importing too much foreign goods. As a defeated country of WWI, Germany had zero hard currencies to buy foreign goods at that time. A similar case happened to Zimbabwe in the 1990s. Its high inflation was caused by low domestic outputs, not high import. As poor as a beggar, what could Zimbabweans use to pay for the foreign goods they intent to buy? Nothing. If the Zimbabweans had nothing to pay for foreign goods, who was going to sell them anything? No one. Then, why is the term of imported inflation so popular in our daily life? Well, I guess this is because people misuse the conception of "imported inflation" for their own convenience.

Right now, there is only one country has the privilege to imported inflation. That's the US. For other economies in the world, sorry guys, you are not qualified to call your inflation an imported inflation because when you lose your own price stability, either you have little good money to buy foreign goods, or foreigners will sell you nothing due to concerns about your credit standing, or both. Without huge amount of foreign goods present in your country, how can you blame foreign goods and services for your inflation? Certainly you can't.

China has the strongest pricing mechanism in the world. China not only is the largest consumer goods producer in the world, but also is the most versatile merchandise producer worldwide. Therefore, China can set its domestic prices using its own products. No matter how much foreign goods China imports, it will always be insignificant in comparison to the huge amount goods produced domestically, thus impossible for imported goods to distort Chinese prices systematically. Most importantly, the Chinese economy is a hybrid one where SOEs control the most important parts of the economy, which sets the tone for prices. As long as the SOEs function normally, there is no way for foreign forces to destabilize China's pricing. No price instability, no inflation. Yuan rate, regardless how it fluctuates, will not change China's domestic pricing.

The good side of low Yuan exchange rate is that it can offset major negative effects brought by high US tariff. The most important reason that China keeps to make so much consumer goods to export even at very low profit margins is to keep migrant workers employed, so that China can continue its urbanization. As long as Chinese goods is price competitive in international markets, Chinese will be employed and Trump's trade war will have little impact to Chinese economy. After the great recession of 2008, China increasingly reviews the dollar is something of the past. Thus, trade surplus with the US is no longer what China chases after. In order to win the trade war against the US, China can even completely ignore the profit margins for the goods exported to the US, as unemployment is the chief casualty of any trade war. Of course China will have to resort to state subsides to the producers in this extreme case. Can the US complain about this practice? No more. If you can subsidize your soybean farmers, why can't I subsidize my appliance producers?

The bad side of low Yuan exchange rate is that it will inevitably discourage the Chinese to spend money outside the border. This will definitely slow down the speed of Yuan internationalization, which is considered as a set back for China's long term goals. This is why the People's Bank of China is unhappy when Yuan rate goes too low.

The ugly side of low Yuan exchange rate is that it encourages market speculation, which potentially causes financial market chaos. This is why the People's Bank of China will intervene when Yuan rate swing too violently. Most people who spread rumors and misinformation about Yuan rate are speculators. This explains why those people shout at highest volume to predict Yuan's next movement, because they are the ones who are most likely to profit from Yuan rate's big swings.
 
In the past it is often Chinese state media that fans and flares nationalistic emotions and try to make use of patriotism to fight foreign adversaries. Remember the burning of Japanese cars anyone? I think since then both the Chinese state and the Chinese people have grown a lot more mature on the topic of nationalism.

I have been observing Chinese propaganda and Chinese people's reactions on the trade war online for the past month since the trade talks broke apart, and I'm pleasantly surprised to say that this time around there isn't much irrational rhetoric coming from Beijing. Amid all those calls for unity there are always words that say "we must keep open our doors and embrace the rest of the world" and "innovation and technological independence does not mean re-inventing every wheel before us". Ren Zhengfei's words on these topics echoed and propelled such arguments as well.

The consensus now among the Chinese media and people seem to be this: the US is blocking us off and shutting its doors to us, but we can't be easily defeated and need to work harder to replace American technologies that's no longer accessible. However, at the same time, we need to work with the rest of the world and keep on open mind and do not let our emotions best us.

Many others are also mocking and making fun of the US and saying all these blocking of Huawei just shows a lack of confidence by the Americans.
to me the most interesting Propaganda move recently has been a new 'Long March' Monday at 8:57 PM
related to the last paragraph of the article posted right above:

I missed a recent "Long March" reference, apparently while this thread had been closed; based on searching Xinhua now, it appears to be
(Multimedia) Commentary: China fights U.S. trade bullying with "Long March" spirit
Xinhua| 2019-05-24 19:05:10
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


OK
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
to me the most interesting Propaganda move recently has been a new 'Long March' Monday at 8:57 PM

It is rallying cry for the people to toughen up and prepare for hardship If they can do the long march and they can face any hardship. So they are preparing for the long struggle

I don't see anything wrong or malicious to remind their reader of Long March which for modern Chinese history is a watershed moment when facing annihilation the rag tag peasant army decide to move to more defensible position in Yanan in Shenxi province

What they didn't know then is how harrowing march it become, overcoming swam, river and mountain,hunger and fatigue while at the same time pursued by the Kuomintang army.
Out of 100,000 soldier who start the march only 30000 left at the end of the march. It demand super human effort and mental strength to reach to their final destination . Prompting one of the general to say that most country has army of soldier but China has army of hero. If we can do this then we can do anything
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
Here what Mahatsir said to US and Japan. Accept the inevitability of China rise and live with it
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Haruka Nuga, Associated Press,Associated Press 52 minutes ago
ffe96e79ff4b4f6c90ce7538b0d1a677_original.jpg

Malaysia's Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad delivers a keynote speech at the special session of the International Conference on "The Future of Asia" Thursday, May 30, 2019, in Tokyo. (AP Photo/Eugene Hoshiko)


TOKYO (AP) -- Malaysian Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad on Thursday called for talks to resolve the ongoing trade dispute between Washington and Beijing and urged the world to accept China's technological prowess.

The U.S. cannot expect to always be at the top in technology, and countries need to talk to deal with a powerful China, Mahathir said at a conference in Tokyo. He also appeared to side with Chinese telecom giant Huawei, which the U.S. has put on a blacklist.

"We try to make use of their technology as much as possible," Mahathir told the Future of Asia conference, noting that Huawei has achieved a "tremendous advance over American technology."


"We have to accept that the U.S. cannot forever be the supreme nation in the world that can have the best technology in the world," he said.

For months, the world's two biggest economies have been locked in a standoff over trade balances and technology, including allegations that China uses unfair tactics, such as stealing trade secrets.

The Trump administration has imposed 25% tariffs on $250 billion in Chinese imports and is planning to tax another $300 billion in imports that have so far been spared. It escalated the stakes this month by effectively barring U.S. companies from supplying Huawei with computer chips, software and other components without government approval.

Mahathir said nations with differing ideologies must be able to get along.

"It is worth it to talk to each other and stop this confrontation," he said.

He warned that conflict between the U.S. and China would only lead to "greater destruction."

"We want to see reasonable, responsible countries sit down around a table and discuss problems. How do we deal with China, a strong China which is very rich because China has got money," he said.


Mahathir arrived in Tokyo on Wednesday and leaves Friday.

Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has meetings with Mahathir and leaders of six other Asian nations this week, part of his administration's policy of courting Europe, the U.S. and other nations in part to counter China's growing global influence.
 

KIENCHIN

Junior Member
Registered Member
Reports from Malaysia. Some restaurants and cafes has been offering discounts to Huawei users in Malaysia.

Granted, they could just be marketing their businesses, but this is reflecting the mood among the locals.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


Several restaurants and cafe are offering discounts for Huawei users in Malaysia

Huawei is facing some challenging times right now as the US government has
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
from doing business with the Chinese brand. To leverage on the current situation and perhaps to show solidarity, a couple of local F&B outlets are offering discounts to customers that use a Huawei device.

Churrz, Petaling Jaya
In Petaling Jaya,
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
, a cafe that serves Churros and Poke bowls are currently offering 10% discount on food items. All you’ll need to do is to show your smartphone to enjoy the discount.


TnR, Petaling Jaya
As reported by the
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
,
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
at SS2 is offering 20% discount on the total bill if you’re a Huawei user. This is a non-halal shop that’s popular for its char siew and Hakka noodles, and it’s valid from 27th to 29th May 2019.

In the MalayMail article, it was reported that the owners felt that the Huawei ban was unjust and it’s not fair for consumers. They reported that the response to the promotion was well received and they have been getting lots of enquiries.

Volcano Grill Cafe, Ipoh
Over at Ipoh,
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
has announced that they no longer serve USDA beef as a sign of support to Huawei. Customers that bring a Huawei product will get 10% off on their steak order. They have also posted a
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
to their suppliers that American made products are no longer accepted at their restaurant.
Hunan People Restaurant, Puchong
There’s also a
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
in Puchong that offers 20% off for Huawei smartphone users. For those that come in with a Huawei uniform will get a cup of herbal tea.

Thanks @
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
for the tip!

Have you seen any similar offers for Huawei customers? Let us know in the comments below.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Now one of the country’s major English language newspaper has followed up on the news, good publicity for Huawei.
 

SpicySichuan

Senior Member
Registered Member
All Trump's trade war does is spur on Made in China 2025. It turns the nightmare into reality. The US bans just turns foreign corporations away from using their licensed products thus they make no money. China will create its own standard and US companies will lose out. Even if there's a trade agreement, China will definitely be going its own way. And let's not forget this all started during the Obama administration. The EU also criticized and worried that China would not be buying from them because of Made in China 2025. Trump is just carrying out the policies to stop it. Don't think this stops when Trump is out of office.
That's why I have long suspected that the Trade War is not about trade, but about divorce. The U.S. cannot trust a strategic competitor that would potentially dominate the high tech industries of tomorrow. Therefore, Washington has to ensure that its allies would not be dependent on China for high-tech products like smartphones, the Internet, and other communication equipment.
 

Equation

Lieutenant General
Oh Boy. Fox just pulled the video, Guess the truth hurts too much, At least leave the comments or is it too embarrassing.

Soon. we will see malicious accusation of CCP censorship.

View attachment 52473

Liu Xin didn't even have to try hard to make Trish Reagan looks stupid. I wish Liu Xin should have bring out the big guns when it comes to intellectual property theft by US companies from past history. That would have get more people to research it on their own find China to be a lot more credible.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top