See my other reply to Jura. The doc is a forgery IMO.
Trade War with China
- Thread starter Ultra
- Start date
- Status
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
There are still large number of backyard pig farm in China and there are still many individual farm in mid west
China to US: We'll match your tariffs in 'scale' and 'intensity'
by Daniel Shane April 3, 2018: 7:21 AM ET
Current Time 0:27
/
Duration Time 1:48
US trade with China, explained
China says it will respond to any new trade tariffs by the United States with measures of the same scale and intensity.
The warning from China's ambassador to the United States, Cui Tiankai, came after Beijing including fruit, pork and steel pipes.
Those measures were in response to President Donald Trump's from China and other countries. But Trump has also announced plans to .
The flurry of tariffs and threats has fueled fears that the damage to trade between the world's two largest economies could get worse.
The new US measures are still taking shape. The Trump administration hasn't yet announced which specific Chinese products will be hit and is planning to take public comments for a period of weeks before putting the tariffs into effect.
When that happens, "we will certainly take countermeasures of the same proportion and of the same scale, same intensity," Cui said that aired Tuesday in Asia.
Trump's plan to impose tariffs on around $50 billion of Chinese goods follows a US government investigation into alleged . The probe the problem costs the US economy hundreds of billions of dollars every year.
Intellectual property theft nearly killed this American company
The Trump administration has said the planned tariffs will punish the Chinese aerospace, technology and machinery industries.
A spokesperson for the Chinese Foreign Ministry on Tuesday backed up the ambassador's comments, telling reporters at a regular news briefing that Beijing "will resolutely fight to the end" if it's forced into a trade war.
The spokesperson, Geng Shuang, signaled that China already has plenty more US products in mind for new sanctions if Trump goes ahead with another round of tariffs.
"The US has a list. China also will have a list," he said.
Experts have said Beijing could choose to target big US exports to China, such as soybeans and Boeing () airplanes, or put the squeeze on the operations of major American companies who do significant business in the country like Apple () and Intel ().
Geng said Beijing still hopes "to resolve the differences in trade with the United States through dialogue and consultation" But he warned that "should be done with mutual respect and fairness ... not with one side being condescending and coercive."
In the TV interview, Cui defended China's approach to protecting intellectual property, saying it has been "strengthening its efforts and our legal system." He added that China was "ready for international cooperation in this area."
Foreign companies and governments have for years complained about Chinese practices, such as requiring firms to hand over trade secrets in exchange for entry into the country's huge markets.
Trump has frequently accused Beijing of stealing American jobs through unfair trade. He has promised to bring down the United States' huge trade deficit in goods with China, .
Economists have cautioned that tariffs to achieve that goal and risk hurting economic growth instead.
-- CNN's Steven Jiang contributed to this report.
China to US: We'll match your tariffs in 'scale' and 'intensity'
by Daniel Shane April 3, 2018: 7:21 AM ET
Current Time 0:27
/
Duration Time 1:48
US trade with China, explained
China says it will respond to any new trade tariffs by the United States with measures of the same scale and intensity.
The warning from China's ambassador to the United States, Cui Tiankai, came after Beijing including fruit, pork and steel pipes.
Those measures were in response to President Donald Trump's from China and other countries. But Trump has also announced plans to .
The flurry of tariffs and threats has fueled fears that the damage to trade between the world's two largest economies could get worse.
The new US measures are still taking shape. The Trump administration hasn't yet announced which specific Chinese products will be hit and is planning to take public comments for a period of weeks before putting the tariffs into effect.
When that happens, "we will certainly take countermeasures of the same proportion and of the same scale, same intensity," Cui said that aired Tuesday in Asia.
Trump's plan to impose tariffs on around $50 billion of Chinese goods follows a US government investigation into alleged . The probe the problem costs the US economy hundreds of billions of dollars every year.
Intellectual property theft nearly killed this American company
The Trump administration has said the planned tariffs will punish the Chinese aerospace, technology and machinery industries.
A spokesperson for the Chinese Foreign Ministry on Tuesday backed up the ambassador's comments, telling reporters at a regular news briefing that Beijing "will resolutely fight to the end" if it's forced into a trade war.
The spokesperson, Geng Shuang, signaled that China already has plenty more US products in mind for new sanctions if Trump goes ahead with another round of tariffs.
"The US has a list. China also will have a list," he said.
Experts have said Beijing could choose to target big US exports to China, such as soybeans and Boeing () airplanes, or put the squeeze on the operations of major American companies who do significant business in the country like Apple () and Intel ().
Geng said Beijing still hopes "to resolve the differences in trade with the United States through dialogue and consultation" But he warned that "should be done with mutual respect and fairness ... not with one side being condescending and coercive."
In the TV interview, Cui defended China's approach to protecting intellectual property, saying it has been "strengthening its efforts and our legal system." He added that China was "ready for international cooperation in this area."
Foreign companies and governments have for years complained about Chinese practices, such as requiring firms to hand over trade secrets in exchange for entry into the country's huge markets.
Trump has frequently accused Beijing of stealing American jobs through unfair trade. He has promised to bring down the United States' huge trade deficit in goods with China, .
Economists have cautioned that tariffs to achieve that goal and risk hurting economic growth instead.
-- CNN's Steven Jiang contributed to this report.
CNN:
Am I out of track of the reality? China export aerospace products such as turbo jet engines and helicopters to U.S.? Helicopters maybe, small civilian ones. But Turbo jet engines? Anyone know something about it?
Is Trump telling China to aim at Boeing?
Am I out of track of the reality? China export aerospace products such as turbo jet engines and helicopters to U.S.? Helicopters maybe, small civilian ones. But Turbo jet engines? Anyone know something about it?
Is Trump telling China to aim at Boeing?
supercat
Major
No, you are not. As I said before, the U.S. is so worried about China's future high tech industries, they decide to close the U.S. market to China's future high tech products preemptively, using the trade war as an excuse. They also use the same excuse to prevent U.S. high tech companies, such as Boeing, from setting up shop in China, then importing their products back to the U.S. market, like Apple does.
BTW, there will be about 2 months of grace period for the tariffs to take effect, ample time for further negotiation.
Last edited:
plawolf
Lieutenant General
Isn’t Chinese firearms pretty much already banned in the US?
Turbojet engines are interesting, since almost all modern manned military and civilian jet aircraft use turbofans.
The only modern aircraft that still use turbojets are high-end model aircraft, and drones/UAVs.
These are not your typical recreational camera drones that China already dominates in, but larger commercial drones. And I think this is where Trump’s advisors are aiming at.
With a lot of big retainers looking at drone delivery, taxi drones and the like, it looks like America is trying to pre-empt China dominating the emerging commercial and industrial drone industry like it is currently is dominanting the recreational drone market.
Helicopters are probably for the same reason, as they will be classifying your non-jet prop drone as a helicopter for tarrifs.
AssassinsMace
Lieutenant General
Boeing has some facilities in China I believe that make parts so they would be subject to tariffs. Not a lot of actual products of Chinese brand names sold in the US. The most notable maybe DJI. So if Trump is aiming to get jobs back to the US, that would be the first step to make it cost more for American companies but then it can just be done another country just as well.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
The latest development plus Ambassador Cui Tiankai interview. I guess it is trade war bring it on about time. Let see who blink first China should not and could not back down!
The Latest: China's Commerce Ministry warns of retaliation
Published 3 Hours AgoThe Associated Press
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Latest on the Trump administration's proposed 25 percent tariffs on $50 billion in Chinese imports to protest Beijing's alleged theft of American technology. (all times local):
8 p.m.
China's Commerce Ministry says it "strongly condemns and firmly opposes" the proposed new U.S. tariffs and warns of retaliatory action.
"We will prepare equal measures for U.S. products with the same scale" according to regulations in Chinese trade law, a spokesman says in comments carried by the official Xinhua News Agency.
The ministry says "the U.S. has published these tariff proposals with disregard to China's solemn representations and without factual basis."
"This is typical of unilateralism and trade protection," it adds.
The statement says the U.S. move ignores the voices of industry in both countries and the interests of consumers and is not conducive to China, the U.S, and the world's economic interests. China intends to refer this to the WTO's trade dispute settlement mechanism, it says.
7:40 p.m.
The Information Technology and Innovation Foundation, a U.S. think tank for science and technology policy, is cautioning the Trump administration against imposing tariffs on Chinese goods that the foundation says support U.S. productivity.
"The Trump administration is right to push back against China's abuse of economic and trade policy," its president, Robert Atkinson, said in a statement. "The list of tariffs that USTR has proposed today would hurt companies in the U.S. by raising the prices and reducing consumption of the capital equipment they rely on to produce their goods and services.
Atkinson added:
"The focus should be on things that will create the most leverage over China without raising prices and dampening investment in the kinds of machinery, equipment, and other technology that drives innovation and productivity across the economy."
7:05 p.m.
The Chinese embassy in Washington says it "strongly condemns" the Trump administration's planned tariffs. In a statement, the embassy says the proposal "serves neither China's interest, not the U.S. interest, even less the interest of the global economy."
And it hinted that Beijing would retaliate with trade sanctions of its own: "As the Chinese saying goes, it is only polite to reciprocate."
The embassy said China would seek relief from the World Trade Organization and "take corresponding measures of equal scale and strength against U.S. products in accordance with Chinese law."
6:45 p.m.
The U.S.-China Business Council has long complained that China's policies have discriminated against U.S. technology companies. But the council argues that the latest proposed tariffs against Beijing are not the answer.
"Unilateral tariffs may do more harm than good and do little to address the problems in China (intellectual property) and tech transfer policies," said John Frisbie, president of the council.
5:54 p.m.
The Trump administration is recommending 25 percent tariffs on $50 billion in Chinese imports to protest Beijing's alleged theft of American technology.
The Office of the U.S. Trade Representative has issued a list targeting 1,300 Chinese products, including industrial robots and telecommunications equipment. But the proposed tariffs wouldn't take effect before a public comment period ends May 11.
The move is the latest in a series of aggressive actions the administration has taken to combat what it calls unfair trade practices by China and other countries. American businesses worry that the administration's moves will draw painful retaliatory sanctions.
Published 3 Hours AgoThe Associated Press
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Latest on the Trump administration's proposed 25 percent tariffs on $50 billion in Chinese imports to protest Beijing's alleged theft of American technology. (all times local):
8 p.m.
China's Commerce Ministry says it "strongly condemns and firmly opposes" the proposed new U.S. tariffs and warns of retaliatory action.
"We will prepare equal measures for U.S. products with the same scale" according to regulations in Chinese trade law, a spokesman says in comments carried by the official Xinhua News Agency.
The ministry says "the U.S. has published these tariff proposals with disregard to China's solemn representations and without factual basis."
"This is typical of unilateralism and trade protection," it adds.
The statement says the U.S. move ignores the voices of industry in both countries and the interests of consumers and is not conducive to China, the U.S, and the world's economic interests. China intends to refer this to the WTO's trade dispute settlement mechanism, it says.
7:40 p.m.
The Information Technology and Innovation Foundation, a U.S. think tank for science and technology policy, is cautioning the Trump administration against imposing tariffs on Chinese goods that the foundation says support U.S. productivity.
"The Trump administration is right to push back against China's abuse of economic and trade policy," its president, Robert Atkinson, said in a statement. "The list of tariffs that USTR has proposed today would hurt companies in the U.S. by raising the prices and reducing consumption of the capital equipment they rely on to produce their goods and services.
Atkinson added:
"The focus should be on things that will create the most leverage over China without raising prices and dampening investment in the kinds of machinery, equipment, and other technology that drives innovation and productivity across the economy."
7:05 p.m.
The Chinese embassy in Washington says it "strongly condemns" the Trump administration's planned tariffs. In a statement, the embassy says the proposal "serves neither China's interest, not the U.S. interest, even less the interest of the global economy."
And it hinted that Beijing would retaliate with trade sanctions of its own: "As the Chinese saying goes, it is only polite to reciprocate."
The embassy said China would seek relief from the World Trade Organization and "take corresponding measures of equal scale and strength against U.S. products in accordance with Chinese law."
6:45 p.m.
The U.S.-China Business Council has long complained that China's policies have discriminated against U.S. technology companies. But the council argues that the latest proposed tariffs against Beijing are not the answer.
"Unilateral tariffs may do more harm than good and do little to address the problems in China (intellectual property) and tech transfer policies," said John Frisbie, president of the council.
5:54 p.m.
The Trump administration is recommending 25 percent tariffs on $50 billion in Chinese imports to protest Beijing's alleged theft of American technology.
The Office of the U.S. Trade Representative has issued a list targeting 1,300 Chinese products, including industrial robots and telecommunications equipment. But the proposed tariffs wouldn't take effect before a public comment period ends May 11.
The move is the latest in a series of aggressive actions the administration has taken to combat what it calls unfair trade practices by China and other countries. American businesses worry that the administration's moves will draw painful retaliatory sanctions.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Here is the summary of the ambassador interview
Speaking with CNBC, ambassador to the said his country would strike back against U.S. measures "very soon."
"We will certainly respond accordingly," said ambassador Cui Tiankai. "We will resort to the dispute settlement mechanism, and we'll, in accordance with Chinese laws, take measures to fight back."
"We certainly don't want to have any trade war with anybody, but people have to understand who started all this," he subsequently told CNBC.
Cui's comments came after President Tuesday of Chinese imports the administration proposes to target as part of a crackdown on what the president deems unfair trade practices.
The world's second-largest economy will take steps against the new U.S. measures "maybe with the same intensity, the same scale," the ambassador said.
Sectors covered by the White House's proposed tariffs include products used for robotics, information technology, communication technology and aerospace.
Technology transfers
Officials in Washington and other countries accuse China of unfair trade practices, including a failure to protect intellectual property. An increasingly hot-button issue is practice of requiring foreign companies to hand over technological know-how in exchange for access to its domestic market.
Asked by CNBC about those allegations, the ambassador claimed the United States has failed to cite specific instances of when China has forced U.S. firms to hand over technology in order to do business in China.
China has been broadly accused by companies from outside the country of forcing them to undertake "technology transfers" in order to operate there. Beijing also forces many foreign companies into joint ventures with Chinese partners before allowing them access to its market.
Ting Shen | Xinhua | Getty Images
Chinese Ambassador to the United States Cui Tiankai speaks at a reception celebrating the 90th anniversary of the founding of the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) at the Chinese embassy in Washington D.C., the United States, on July 27, 2017.
Cui did not elaborate to CNBC about any specific details of what Beijing may do to counter the latest U.S. trade moves.
A White House official who declined to be named told CNBC that the government is discussing both preparations for potential Chinese retaliation and potential further action from the U.S.
The White House feels that China has to be held to account, the official said, emphasizing that Tuesday's actions were "targeted with a clear message."
The ambassador, however, questioned the efficacy of the U.S. trade approach.
"We have done the utmost to avoid this kind of situation, but if the other side makes the wrong choice, then we have no alternative but to fight back."-Cui Tiankai, China ambassador to the United States
"Such protectionism will not protect anybody. It will not protect American workers or American farmers. It will not protect American businesses or American consumers," Cui said. "It will hurt everybody including the U.S. economy itself."
The Chinese diplomat said the two economies "are so closely interconnected" that "any unilateral measures will hurt the other side, but the end result would be that it would hurt itself."
"We have done the utmost to avoid this kind of situation, but if the other side makes the wrong choice, then we have no alternative but to fight back," he added.
But even beyond the economic effects to the two countries, Cui warned of a broader fallout from the trade disputes.
"In today's global economy, almost everything is interconnected. So when people take some wrong measures, when people take some protectionist measure, it will hurt people's confidence in the overall prospects for the economy. It may hurt finance, it may hurt trade, it may hurt economic performance, it may hurt consumer confidence — everything," he said.
Still, the ambassador left the door open for a deescalation between the world's two largest economies: "We are always ready to continue and intensify our dialogue and communication with the U.S. side on any possible economic or trade issues, but we need reciprocity. Our goodwill has to be met by the same degree of goodwill."
—CNBC's Eamon Javers contributed to this report.
Speaking with CNBC, ambassador to the said his country would strike back against U.S. measures "very soon."
"We will certainly respond accordingly," said ambassador Cui Tiankai. "We will resort to the dispute settlement mechanism, and we'll, in accordance with Chinese laws, take measures to fight back."
"We certainly don't want to have any trade war with anybody, but people have to understand who started all this," he subsequently told CNBC.
Cui's comments came after President Tuesday of Chinese imports the administration proposes to target as part of a crackdown on what the president deems unfair trade practices.
The world's second-largest economy will take steps against the new U.S. measures "maybe with the same intensity, the same scale," the ambassador said.
Sectors covered by the White House's proposed tariffs include products used for robotics, information technology, communication technology and aerospace.
Technology transfers
Officials in Washington and other countries accuse China of unfair trade practices, including a failure to protect intellectual property. An increasingly hot-button issue is practice of requiring foreign companies to hand over technological know-how in exchange for access to its domestic market.
Asked by CNBC about those allegations, the ambassador claimed the United States has failed to cite specific instances of when China has forced U.S. firms to hand over technology in order to do business in China.
China has been broadly accused by companies from outside the country of forcing them to undertake "technology transfers" in order to operate there. Beijing also forces many foreign companies into joint ventures with Chinese partners before allowing them access to its market.
Ting Shen | Xinhua | Getty Images
Chinese Ambassador to the United States Cui Tiankai speaks at a reception celebrating the 90th anniversary of the founding of the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) at the Chinese embassy in Washington D.C., the United States, on July 27, 2017.
Cui did not elaborate to CNBC about any specific details of what Beijing may do to counter the latest U.S. trade moves.
A White House official who declined to be named told CNBC that the government is discussing both preparations for potential Chinese retaliation and potential further action from the U.S.
The White House feels that China has to be held to account, the official said, emphasizing that Tuesday's actions were "targeted with a clear message."
The ambassador, however, questioned the efficacy of the U.S. trade approach.
"We have done the utmost to avoid this kind of situation, but if the other side makes the wrong choice, then we have no alternative but to fight back."-Cui Tiankai, China ambassador to the United States
"Such protectionism will not protect anybody. It will not protect American workers or American farmers. It will not protect American businesses or American consumers," Cui said. "It will hurt everybody including the U.S. economy itself."
The Chinese diplomat said the two economies "are so closely interconnected" that "any unilateral measures will hurt the other side, but the end result would be that it would hurt itself."
"We have done the utmost to avoid this kind of situation, but if the other side makes the wrong choice, then we have no alternative but to fight back," he added.
But even beyond the economic effects to the two countries, Cui warned of a broader fallout from the trade disputes.
"In today's global economy, almost everything is interconnected. So when people take some wrong measures, when people take some protectionist measure, it will hurt people's confidence in the overall prospects for the economy. It may hurt finance, it may hurt trade, it may hurt economic performance, it may hurt consumer confidence — everything," he said.
Still, the ambassador left the door open for a deescalation between the world's two largest economies: "We are always ready to continue and intensify our dialogue and communication with the U.S. side on any possible economic or trade issues, but we need reciprocity. Our goodwill has to be met by the same degree of goodwill."
—CNBC's Eamon Javers contributed to this report.
Quickie
Colonel
If Boeing is going to build parts in India, Vietnam etc, would they be buying as many airliners from Boeing as China would? This goes for other products as well like cars, Iphones etc.
It's crazy how politicians would say they are doing this for economic reasons when their economic decision making process is heavily muddled by their heavy political mind-set.
Mulling over something.after reading postings on 5g in recent months and on how China wants to be a lead developer in this 5g roll out. The use of Chinese technology should result in China having to pay fewer royalties to foreign companies. I think Trump would find it an attractive area .to frustrate Chinese ambitions. What do you guys reckon?
- Status