Tiger Moms and their Kids

Equation

Lieutenant General
We're (Chinese and Asians in particular) #1...again! LOL...j/k, just having a little fun that's all!:eek:;)

No, don't ask me about how the US did, lets just say it needs improvement.:(

Shanghai teens top international education ranking, OECD says

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#1. Shanghai

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#2. Singapore

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#3. Hong Kong

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#4. Taiwan

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#5. South Korea

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#6. Finland

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#7. UK
 

Equation

Lieutenant General
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

Those kids in the other countries will still want to go US and study to get a degree.

True, but in the future after they graduated they could take their brains and professions somewhere else for jobs, if the job market here in the states stays stagnant or get worse.
 

kroko

Senior Member
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

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I wonder why did shanghai students get separated from the other chinese students in doing this tests. So that they could score a "first place" ? You cant cherrypick a nation´s students by city. Shanghai has only around 2% of the population of china. What matters is the nacional students, not by city. I wonder what was the classification of china as a whole in this PISA raking (if it even competed in this way at all)
 

kwaigonegin

Colonel
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

I wonder why did shanghai students get separated from the other chinese students in doing this tests. So that they could score a "first place" ? You cant cherrypick a nation´s students by city. Shanghai has only around 2% of the population of china. What matters is the nacional students, not by city. I wonder what was the classification of china as a whole in this PISA raking (if it even competed in this way at all)

Which is why it's reported as Shanghai and not China. I would assume if given a standardized test nationally than the ranking would likely be lower. I will go under the assumption that 'Shanghai kids' are 'smarter' than the average chinese kid primarily due to the socio economic levels of their parents and big cities typically has more resources available than some rural schools or in the Eastern parts of China etc.

With that being said I do not believe the PISA exams are given across the board to all states or cities in other countries either so the same argument can also be said about them. Even in the US, kids score differently amongst states and cities as well. MA students for ex. consistently score higher in math, science and reading than say kids from Alabama or Mississippi. I do not believe PISA exams were given to kids from the deep south, Appalachias etc which itself is scary because than the US would rank even lower LOL
 

solarz

Brigadier
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

I wonder why did shanghai students get separated from the other chinese students in doing this tests. So that they could score a "first place" ? You cant cherrypick a nation´s students by city. Shanghai has only around 2% of the population of china. What matters is the nacional students, not by city. I wonder what was the classification of china as a whole in this PISA raking (if it even competed in this way at all)

Which is why it's reported as Shanghai and not China. I would assume if given a standardized test nationally than the ranking would likely be lower. I will go under the assumption that 'Shanghai kids' are 'smarter' than the average chinese kid primarily due to the socio economic levels of their parents and big cities typically has more resources available than some rural schools or in the Eastern parts of China etc.

With that being said I do not believe the PISA exams are given across the board to all states or cities in other countries either so the same argument can also be said about them. Even in the US, kids score differently amongst states and cities as well. MA students for ex. consistently score higher in math, science and reading than say kids from Alabama or Mississippi. I do not believe PISA exams were given to kids from the deep south, Appalachias etc which itself is scary because than the US would rank even lower LOL

First of all, as Kwaigonegin has said, only Shanghai and Hong Kong participated in PISA, and so only Shanghai and Hong Kong got reported, not China as a nation. It is only the American media that is creating the "cherrypicking" strawman.

Secondly, from what I've heard, Shanghai students are lazy and mediocre students compared to other parts of the nation. So if we included results from other parts of China, it's quite possible that China as a whole would score higher than Shanghai alone.

In America, rich kids have, on average, better academic performance than poor kids. In China, poor kids study way harder than rich kids and tend to be among the best performing students.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

I wonder why did shanghai students get separated from the other chinese students in doing this tests. So that they could score a "first place" ? You cant cherrypick a nation´s students by city. Shanghai has only around 2% of the population of china. What matters is the nacional students, not by city. I wonder what was the classification of china as a whole in this PISA raking (if it even competed in this way at all)

PISA until now has only done rankings for shanghai, they will start to do so for the entire country by around 2015 I think. Of course, the fact that it is PISA and its system entailing only shanghai is compared rather than the entire nation seems to have escaped time magazine's writers, who have blatantly twisted it to show as if it were the government who was only revealing shanghai's scores or something just to look good.

Frankly it is a little disgusting that they are effectively politicising this comparison, you don't even have to read between the lines that well.
If anything it looks like sour grapes to me.


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China is Cheating the World Student Rankings System
Enough is enough: Beijing must supply national data to assessors and not simply the results of a small minority of elite students
By David Stout Dec. 04, 2013

The results from a global exam that evaluates students’ reading, science and math skills are in and, once again, Chinese students appear to be reigning supreme while American students continued to underperform.

But before you shake your head ruefully and scoff at the decline of Western-style education, take a look at how the data is organized.

The OECD’s Program for International Student Assessment (PISA) exams are held every three years. Coming first and third respectively in the 2012 exams are the Chinese cities of Shanghai and Hong Kong.

However, China is uniquely not listed as a country in the rankings — unlike the U.S., Russia, Germany, Australia and other nations judged on the basis of their country-wide performances. Instead, China only shares Shanghai’s score with PISA. (Hong Kong, a Special Autonomous Region of China, sends its own data.)

Shanghainese and Hong Kong students are much better educated than those elsewhere in China. Slate quoted the Brookings Institution’s Tom Loveless as saying that “About 84 percent of Shanghai high school graduates go to college, compared to 24 percent nationally.” In addition, Loveless points out that affluent Shanghainese parents will spend large sums on extra tuition for the children — paying fees that far exceed what an average worker makes in a year.

By not providing full national data, China is in effect cheating.

As Loveless noted earlier this year, Shanghai’s test scores “will be depicted, in much of the public discussion that follows, as the results for China.” He added: “that is wrong.”

All of a sudden, rote-learning doesn’t look like China’s secret weapon.

Read more: World Student Rankings: China Is Cheating the PISA System | TIME.com
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broadsword

Brigadier
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

Holy ....!

A world renown news magazine can't distinguish between Shanghai and China. What have they been up to? And they call it cheating. That's propaganda.
 
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stibyssip

New Member
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

Secondly, from what I've heard, Shanghai students are lazy and mediocre students compared to other parts of the nation. So if we included results from other parts of China, it's quite possible that China as a whole would score higher than Shanghai alone.

In America, rich kids have, on average, better academic performance than poor kids. In China, poor kids study way harder than rich kids and tend to be among the best performing students.

true, poor kids tend to be better students in china. this is a cultural phenomenon that stems from the days of the imperial exams, when the biggest factor for upward social mobility for poor peasants was scoring high on the exam and entering the bureaucratic class.
 

B.I.B.

Captain
Re: Chinese Daily Photos, Videos & News of 2013!!!

In my opinion Asian students are not smarter than any other students. Everyone has some measure of intelligence either high ,low or middle ground. It depends upon how a person uses their intelligence. And what many Asian students do have that gives them an edge is better parenting and school work ethic. Hench the do better in school.

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They also have Dragon mums
 
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