The War in the Ukraine

drowingfish

Junior Member
Registered Member
bloodiest battle so far...definitely the verdun of this war. both sides will need a little break in this sector. it does not look like ukraine's counter attack will carry on here, ran out of steam real quick after some initial gains. i am beginning to suspect that this rumored offensive will get cancelled altogether. a lot of the brigades reserved for that purpose was committed in bakhmut, air defense proven to be impotent, and large ammo storage went up in smoke, all of these would lead to postponement of an offensive.
 

Tam

Brigadier
Registered Member
Various Ukrainian vehicles destroyed by Lancets around the Zaporozhye region.


Russian ATGM hits a Ukrainian DRG using night vision at Zaporozhye.


Collection of Ukrainian FPV drone attacks on Russian vehicles. The problem of FPV is when the video feed is cut off, viewers may assume that a hit is made but there are reasons why it may not be so. So there's always some margin of unsurety about claimed kills on FPV attacks. The excess static you see in the videos can be a result of jamming.

 

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Oy vey where to begin with the whole possibility of European F-16's being given to Ukraine...

If Ukraine were getting blk 50/52 WITH Aim-120c7's, HARM Targeting System, AN/ALQ-131(V) EW pod, Maverick Missiles, and anti-ship capability then I'd be impressed because these Vipers would be able to conduct CAS and interdiction at the frontlines at high-ish altitude but it seems they are getting old F-16C's and these Vipers have Euro systems so I don't know if they'll have ability to link with Patriot batteries. They'll be armed with aim-120c5's which are outranged by a lot with what the Russians flankers are armed with not to mention the F-16c radar is way outdated. When Pakistani blk 52 Vipers took a shot at IAF MKI's they were armed with c5's and came way short and those Vipers had AWACS and EW aircraft for support.


I don't get Ukraine's fascination with getting F-16's what they should be asking for are USMC F-18C's that were just retired with plenty of hours still left in the airframe. Those Hornets carry GaN AESA and are aim-120D and all the air to ground weapons capable. Or even the USN F-18E's which are just as capable as USMC F-18C's. These would be more dangerous than blk 52 Vipers which Ukraine isn't even getting. It really has become silly how Ukraine wants F-16's which really won't make a difference especially the ones they are likely to get.
AIM-120C5 is not out sticked by R-77.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Those missiles have roughly similar range. 110 km for R-77-1 and 105 km for AIM-120C5.
R-77-1 is an upgraded variant of the R-77. It is slightly longer and heavier so it carries more fuel. It also has more modern electronics. It has more range than R-77.

But the Su-35 and MiG-31 can use the R-37M. Not just the R-77-1.
 

SolarWarden

Junior Member
Registered Member
Those missiles have roughly similar range. 110 km for R-77-1 and 105 km for AIM-120C5.
R-77-1 is an upgraded variant of the R-77. It is slightly longer and heavier so it carries more fuel. It also has more modern electronics. It has more range than R-77.

But the Su-35 and MiG-31 can use the R-37M. Not just the R-77-1.
The R-37M will be the real threat. I thought the r77-1 had a much longer range but was wrong however SU-35 will be able to detect F-16 at much further ranges and shoot first with R37M.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
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Ukraine's Depleted Uranium Blast: Europe on Brink of 'Environmental Disaster'​

...
Sputnik News spoke with Dr. Chris Busby, physical chemist and scientific secretary of the European Committee on Radiation Risk, about how the West’s decision to provide depleted uranium (DU) ammunition to Ukraine has potentially caused a continent-wide ecological disaster.
...

Recently, several web media outlets provided videos of an enormous explosion in the town of Khmelnitski, located to the West of Kiev, and about 200 km from the border with Poland. There were two major explosions which produced a massive roiling swirling fireball
...
So, what was it? It was suggested by several commentators that an arms depot that had been hit contained the Depleted Uranium (DU) weapons sent by the UK to the Ukraine for use in the British Challenger tanks as anti-tank penetrators. That the explosion was one involving the burning of the DU in the fireball.
...
Uranium 238, when it decays with its alpha emission, turns into Thorium-234 and Protoactinium-234m which then turns into Uranium 234. Thorium 234 is a beta and gamma emitter delivering 6% of its decay energy as a gamma ray. Thus, large clouds of DU particulate aerosol will be detectable by gamma detectors.
...
When I visited Iraq with Al Jazeera in 2000 I went to the south and examined the corpses of the tanks that had been hit by DU in the first Gulf War. Some of the A-10 DU penetrators were still lying around. They gave off an intense gamma ray signal, and the holes in the tanks were highly gamma ray active. So much for only an alpha emitter.
...
After Chernobyl, the European Union set up a Europe-wide gamma radiation detector system that used to give gamma readings in real time. I went to look. But astonishingly, all the data was blocked. The web- based system, administered from Germany, (EURDEP) would not provide the detector maps that are normally available. Luckily, there were some location maps on the web and some that had been already downloaded by colleagues of mine before the system stopped working. I obtained maps from Poland.
...
You will see that a very highly significant increase in gamma radiation occurred at this detector, north west of the explosion site almost exactly when it would be expected on the basis of a distance of 250km and a mean wind speed of 5km/h. The increase, from 60nSv/h to 90nSv/h was highly statistically significant about 50%. Other detectors all across Poland showed an increase*, as the plume passed over them, the increase being weaker the further away (due to dispersion of the plume).
...
So taken all together, what we see is a massive explosion which is thought to be DU, and reports of a spike in gamma radiation near the site. Uranium oxide is black, and the black plume moves north west slowly, the weather pattern is stable and the wind blows to Poland. The Polish EU detectors all show gamma radiation increases at the expected time of arrival of the plume.
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One final piece of evidence. We see videos on the internet of the Ukrainians clearing up the explosion site using Robot vehicles, not ordinary firemen. Why do they need Robot vehicles? The last times we saw Robot vehicles clearing up was in the ruins of Chernobyl and Fukushima.

If I am right, there has been an environmental disaster, and the DU particles will travel across Poland, Germany and Hungary, and will end up in the Baltics, probably later the whole of Europe including the UK (after all, the Chernobyl Uranium particles came to the UK).

They will deliver genetic damage and death like that seen in the Balkans and Iraq. Cancer, birth defects, miscarriage, infertility, lung damage, mental problems (Gulf War Syndrome) and so forth. The scientific and epidemiological evidence on this has been clear since the Gulf War. It is all there in the scientific literature—but the governments in the West and the military ignore it, deny it and cover it up.
 

tankphobia

Senior Member
Registered Member
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RUSI article about current Russian tactics compared to the beginning of the war, it highlights the adaptations that the Russian armed forces have made in light of the situation on the front.

Highlights based on the abstract:
  1. Engineers have setup elaborate fortifications on the front.
  2. Russian tanks have a lower loss rate now that they are content to sit back in concealment and used for indirect fire instead of breakthrough.
  3. Artillery have become more agile less concentrated due to HIMARS, Orlan-10 reduce kill chain to 3-5 minutes
  4. Ukraine is losing upwards of 10,000 UAVs a month, large number from EW which are at a density of 1 system per 10km
  5. AA setup has improved as positions are now static.
  6. Air situation haven't changed much except that guided FAB-500s are now used with some frequency at a range of up to 70km.
  7. Command has moved towards hardened locations to the rear due to presence of HIMARS.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
If they wanted ruggedness in planes, F18s would be perfect with their carrier rated landing gears. But of course they need those for China, so no can do.
Something like that was going to happen at the start of this war when the Poles were offering Mig-29s. The plan was to operate them from Polish bases.

Putin said if you do that, we will strike Poland and declare war on NATO. I doubt the Americans would start doing that now if they didn't a year ago.

Times have changed since then. NATO has been able to effectively salami slice Russia a lot and managed to get a much clearer picture of where their bottom lines are.

Also, back then the west were fully expecting sanctions to obliterate Russia’s economy, so would have been much more risk averse themselves. Since that has proven to a fantasy, and as economic reality starts to bite, it’s now NATO countries that are getting more desperate and willing to take increasing risks. But I guess we will see in due course.
 

tank3487

Junior Member
Registered Member
I think it is unlikely that "third world" countries will get modern weapons, as they do not have the capacity to operate or maintain them, but every now and then America starts one of its routine wars against a "second world" country. Here things can get complicated.
I would say the biggest change would be air defense sales. It would be much harder to conduct any operation for US in any country if there is risk to face modern AD systems.
 
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