The Q-5, J-7, J-8 and older PLAAF aircraft

Miragedriver

Miragedriver

Brigadier
Here’s hypocthetical question for all the aviation experts. The J-7 production line in now closed. However, we can not deny that the J-7 (specifically the J-7G) is an excelent little dogfighter. Given that the J7 has short legs, and a small nose to house a decent radar to take advantage of the new BVR missles; all of this meaning you needs lots of them to get good coverage.

Do any of you see a future for a fighter version of the JL-9 for air patrol and as a secondary fighter for some third world nations. Many of these countries still use the Mig-21 and J-7 so there would be a cominality of parts. If used in conjunction with AEW&C aircraft it could pose a threat.

Recently in the Cruzex 2006 multinational war games, a Brazilian F-5M made simulated kills on two French Dassault Mirage 2000C and one Mirage 2000N aircraft; achieved using the Derby BVR missile and information relayed from an AEW&C aircraft, the Embraer R-99. In the Cruzex 2010, two Brazilian F-5EMs made simulated kills on two French Rafale aircraft. The F-5EMs approached with their radars off, instead using the infra-red seeker on the Python IV for target acquisition.

It’s just something to think about.
 
R

RedMercury

Junior Member
I doubt it would make economic sense. Probably better overall to try to sell the FC-17. Meanwhile, I think maybe old J-7s (esp the ones with the double delta wing) can be auctioned to private enthusiasts.
 
siegecrossbow

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Miragedriver said:
Here’s hypocthetical question for all the aviation experts. The J-7 production line in now closed. However, we can not deny that the J-7 (specifically the J-7G) is an excelent little dogfighter. Given that the J7 has short legs, and a small nose to house a decent radar to take advantage of the new BVR missles; all of this meaning you needs lots of them to get good coverage.

Do any of you see a future for a fighter version of the JL-9 for air patrol and as a secondary fighter for some third world nations. Many of these countries still use the Mig-21 and J-7 so there would be a cominality of parts. If used in conjunction with AEW&C aircraft it could pose a threat.

Recently in the Cruzex 2006 multinational war games, a Brazilian F-5M made simulated kills on two French Dassault Mirage 2000C and one Mirage 2000N aircraft; achieved using the Derby BVR missile and information relayed from an AEW&C aircraft, the Embraer R-99. In the Cruzex 2010, two Brazilian F-5EMs made simulated kills on two French Rafale aircraft. The F-5EMs approached with their radars off, instead using the infra-red seeker on the Python IV for target acquisition.

It’s just something to think about.
Click to expand...

Older J-7s make better point defence interceptors than dogfighters. The delta wings tend to bleed energy in a turn. They are still more maneuverable than Mig-21 Bison, however.

---------- Post added at 09:32 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:32 AM ----------
Miragedriver said:
Here’s hypocthetical question for all the aviation experts. The J-7 production line in now closed. However, we can not deny that the J-7 (specifically the J-7G) is an excelent little dogfighter. Given that the J7 has short legs, and a small nose to house a decent radar to take advantage of the new BVR missles; all of this meaning you needs lots of them to get good coverage.

Do any of you see a future for a fighter version of the JL-9 for air patrol and as a secondary fighter for some third world nations. Many of these countries still use the Mig-21 and J-7 so there would be a cominality of parts. If used in conjunction with AEW&C aircraft it could pose a threat.

Recently in the Cruzex 2006 multinational war games, a Brazilian F-5M made simulated kills on two French Dassault Mirage 2000C and one Mirage 2000N aircraft; achieved using the Derby BVR missile and information relayed from an AEW&C aircraft, the Embraer R-99. In the Cruzex 2010, two Brazilian F-5EMs made simulated kills on two French Rafale aircraft. The F-5EMs approached with their radars off, instead using the infra-red seeker on the Python IV for target acquisition.

It’s just something to think about.
Click to expand...

Older J-7s make better point defence interceptors than dogfighters. The delta wings tend to bleed energy in a turn. They are still more maneuverable than Mig-21 Bison, however.
 
Miragedriver

Miragedriver

Brigadier
Thank you. What I meant to say was point defense, but as you mentioned the cost of producing a JL-9 (with the J-7G wings) with a decent radar and electronic equipment makes it on par (economically) with the JF-17 (which is more potent and modern aircraft) and therefore results in any such possibility as economically unfeasible.
 
H

hmmwv

Junior Member
Even with modern equipment the JL9 is still significantly cheaper than a FC1 due to its 100% domestically sourced components, otherwise PLAAF might as well just go for a twin seat FC1 as its advanced trainer. Having said that, a single seat fighter version of JL9 is still just a J7 with bigger radar, if I'm using a J7 right now I'd rather spend more money upgrading to a fundamentally superior fighter such as the FC1 than a half ass upgrade to a JL9.
 
Deino

Deino

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Just another - maybe stupid - question .... but does anyone know the Chinese designation for the early J-7's radar/rangefinder ???

As far as I know, the first version, that got a "real" radar was the J-7E ... :confused:

Deino
 
I

i.e.

Senior Member
Deino said:
Just another - maybe stupid - question .... but does anyone know the Chinese designation for the early J-7's radar/rangefinder ???

As far as I know, the first version, that got a "real" radar was the J-7E ... :confused:

Deino
Click to expand...

It was copy of Mig-21F-13's range finder.

The first one (time wise) that got a "real radar" is J-7III with JL-7

will dig it up when I get a chance.

---------- Post added at 01:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:12 PM ----------
hmmwv said:
Even with modern equipment the JL9 is still significantly cheaper than a FC1 due to its 100% domestically sourced components, otherwise PLAAF might as well just go for a twin seat FC1 as its advanced trainer. Having said that, a single seat fighter version of JL9 is still just a J7 with bigger radar, if I'm using a J7 right now I'd rather spend more money upgrading to a fundamentally superior fighter such as the FC1 than a half ass upgrade to a JL9.
Click to expand...

You forgot L-15.

also trainers have a fundamentally different structure design requirement.
its life cycles requirements are much more, (longer hours) than a fighter, thus making airplane structually heavier.

you can't put a 2nd seat into a FC-1 and call it a day,

to be truly cost effective as an advanced trainer the structure has to be redesigned ,
which means $$$$$$$ $
 
Deino

Deino

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
i.e. said:
It was copy of Mig-21F-13's range finder.

The first one (time wise) that got a "real radar" is J-7III with JL-7

will dig it up when I get a chance.
Click to expand...



Oh, YES, how coul I missed that !:)

But do You know the Chinee designation for the licenced range finder ??? :confused:

Deino
 
I

i.e.

Senior Member
Deino said:
Oh, YES, how coul I missed that !:)

But do You know the Chinee designation for the licenced range finder ??? :confused:

Deino
Click to expand...

Its called Type 222 radar range finder a copy of СРД-5МК range finder on the original Mig21-F-13.
Equiped vanilla version of J-7I and J-7II.
 
navyreco

navyreco

Senior Member
j-7g10.jpg


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2011-12-14 (China Military News cited from strategypage.com) -- China has officially withdrawn its MiG-21 clone (the J-7) from first line service. This comes as no surprise. In the last four years, China has more than doubled the number of modern combat aircraft (J-10, J-11, Su-27, Su-30 and J-8F) from 500 to over 1,200. Four years ago, China relied mainly on some 2,000 locally built copies of Russian MiG-19s (J-6) and MiG-21 (J-7). There are still several hundred bombers, mostly Russian knockoffs. Normally, the actual number of Chinese aircraft is a state secret. However, thanks to the ability of Chinese to move freely throughout the country, and access to the Internet, it's possible to locate and count all the air force units in the country. That shows a current force that is rapidly changing from one that is mostly MiG-21s and MiG-19s, to one composed of much more capable aircraft. China is buying and building a lot of the Russian Su-27s and Su-30s (the latter an upgrade of the former.) But new, home grown designs, like the J-20 are also showing up.
 
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