The Kashmir conflict 2025.

Han Patriot

Junior Member
Registered Member
I think this has been discussed several dozen times before, I will answer you once again.

First, we know that PL-15E is about 4 meters in length, the one in the photo above is only about 2 meters. Warhead lost, what can you do with the engine and fuel compartment? At the worst case, India recovers the warhead of that missile, it's a PL-15E, the export version of PL-15. Do you think that everything in the export version is the same as the domestic version? In case India wants reverse engineered the PL-15E, I'd suggest them to do that with Meteor which is considered more advanced.

Conclusion: India didn't lose to J-10C or PL-15E but lost to its pilot training, hardware maintenance and combat doctrine. Not a few words can describe all.

PS. The truce is so fragile, and the two nations will not ceasefire that easily. More violations to the truce are on the way, more fighting expected. Just not sure how things may happen.
They have the meteor a supposedly more superior misile, and then what? Do they have the tech base requird to digest the technology? Just as ASML said, even if we gave China the blueprints for the EUV, you still wouldn't be able to build it. But they were wrong because we have the industrial base for it.
 

didklmyself

Junior Member
Registered Member
Explain this. Many say it's shot down by Indian air defense. The incident is already reported in previous posts in this thread.

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It occurred all way close to the border with China. Unlikely to have been downed by air defence systems, also you can see some pictures of the crash site - doesn't look like it was downed.

Additionally, it was a civilian helicopter and heli services have been active there for years. A weather alert too was issued there, so I can confidently say no.

There have been accidents there before as shared by @xyz4321 .
 

Ringsword

Junior Member
Registered Member
Just thought of a very simple explanation; whether SPECTRA can recognize LPI mode of J-10c radar itself?
LPI isn't magical, but again - Spectra is advanced 1990s solution. Frequency hopping of much later radar(together with seekers) could leave pilots without warning; the question of course is what ground and AWACS operators were doing in this case.

What was the weather and cloud cover in the area; is it possible that bombing rafales were simply below overcast for their UV sensors to spot launch signatures(Rafale has no radar maws)?
I was actually quite concerned that the Spectra EWsuite which was touted as making the Rafale an equal to full 5th gen jets like F22/F35 and of course the Chinese J20.It's sales pitch to the Indians was akin to buying a Romulan Cloaking Device which will make the IAF all but invincible and shoot down PAF/PLAAF jets like swatting flies-apparently the damn thing didn't even get activated and IAF"Godzilla -3"only saw his wingman explode into a fireball before he knew it,Wow,well done China(and PAF)-imagine a flight of same number of full-house J20's with PLAAF PL15's/PL12's in that aerial battle-the slaughter would be immense.Hopefully now Modi would be more reasonable and less bellicose.
 

sequ

Colonel
Registered Member
I don't understand the whole hype about Rafale's EW suite. How can it be any more advanced compared to the many AN/ALQ variants that the US Teen series have? There is a whole plethora of these US origin EW self protection systems that have been continuously updated for decades and I doubt they are less capable than the Spectra. As a matter of fact, I would prefer the more recent AN/ALQ systems of the F-16 and F-15 above the Spectra any time of the day.

Talk about overhyped PR nonsense.
 

LCR34

Junior Member
Registered Member
I was actually quite concerned that the Spectra EWsuite which was touted as making the Rafale an equal to full 5th gen jets like F22/F35 and of course the Chinese J20.It's sales pitch to the Indians was akin to buying a Romulan Cloaking Device which will make the IAF all but invincible and shoot down PAF/PLAAF jets like swatting flies-apparently the damn thing didn't even get activated and IAF"Godzilla -3"only saw his wingman explode into a fireball before he knew it,Wow,well done China(and PAF)-imagine a flight of same number of full-house J20's with PLAAF PL15's/PL12's in that aerial battle-the slaughter would be immense.Hopefully now Modi would be more reasonable and less bellicose.
SPECTRA is supposed to work like noise cancellation headset, by sending out waves to cancel incoming radar waves. I think Indians bought into the marketing as if its some wunderwaffe.
 

xyz4321

Junior Member
Registered Member
It occurred all way close to the border with China. Unlikely to have been downed by air defence systems, also you can see some pictures of the crash site - doesn't look like it was downed.

Additionally, it was a civilian helicopter and heli services have been active there for years. A weather alert too was issued there, so I can confidently say no.

There have been accidents there before as shared by @xyz4321 .
The accident i shared is the same one, from last Thursday. Civilian helicopter flying near NOTAM restricted areas is senseless precisely for this reason - it can be shot down accidentally. I saw for couple days that there are a few civilian helis flying in the region where all other air traffic is restricted and wondered wtf they were doing. Just by curiosity I searched it up ("Dehradun / Uttarakhand helicopter") and sure enough the first results were of a helicopter crash.

Dehradun isn't too far from the war-active sites. And being closer to China would further give weight to the suspicion of the accident being shot down.
 

NakaRT

New Member
Registered Member
I don't understand the whole hype about Rafale's EW suite. How can it be any more advanced compared to the many AN/ALQ variants that the US Teen series have? There is a whole plethora of these US origin EW self protection systems that have been continuously updated for decades and I doubt they are less capable than the Spectra. As a matter of fact, I would prefer the more recent AN/ALQ systems of the F-16 and F-15 above the Spectra any time of the day.

Talk about overhyped PR nonsense.
Simple: Rafale's EW suit is already the best thing Europe can manufacture.

And to be fair, even though it might no the best, it still pretty good.
 

siegecrossbow

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Infamous aviations “expert” and pro Western shill ZWZ, who went as far as doctor PHD papers to prove that Western designs are aerodynamically superior to Chinese and Russian ones, briefly became a Chaihind before becoming very quiet.

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Dude might be in a coma due to the
 
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