Sino-Pak frigate deal discussed by Musharraf in Shanghai

tphuang said:

C-802A is AShM, not LACM.

What are you hoping for exactly in the navy? Something in the shtil range or S-300 range? You need to be a little realistic here. It took generous loans from China to even make this deal happen. PN has no hope of matching up in surface combatants against IN. You have to realize that. The Pakistani military obviously has realized that already.

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Quite simply an air defense vessel for the navy.

Don't get me wrong i'm not saying that the frigates have anything wrong
with them , it's just that the PN seems to be ignoring air defence.

I mean even the Oliver Perry's will have air defence systems removed

FreeAsia2000 said:

Quite simply an air defense vessel for the navy.

Don't get me wrong i'm not saying that the frigates have anything wrong
with them , it's just that the PN seems to be ignoring air defence.

I mean even the Oliver Perry's will have air defence systems removed

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They are not ignoring them, they can't afford them. These things are expensive and they are hard to develop. People aren't willing to sell them.

Looking at recent news regarding Pakistan's navy. It appears they are addressing the Navy after it had been neglected under previous governments for many years. They are purchasing around 8 Frigates mayeb more and are looking into Marlin/U boats from Germany. These are big purchases and couldn't have come sooner. One expects Pakistan to address the air defence problem once they have procured vessels worth protecting!

Regards

Black jack said:

Looking at recent news regarding Pakistan's navy. It appears they are addressing the Navy after it had been neglected under previous governments for many years. They are purchasing around 8 Frigates mayeb more and are looking into Marlin/U boats from Germany. These are big purchases and couldn't have come sooner. One expects Pakistan to address the air defence problem once they have procured vessels worth protecting!

Regards

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Well I would not agree...

They are joust replacing old surface ships whit new ones at cheep prices. Two modern AAW frigates cost more then all 8 frigates Pakistan is buying. PN was always more focused on submarines then on big surface combatants and if we are realistic that was good choice considering whit who they have to compete...

isthvan said:

Well I would not agree... They are joust replacing old surface ships whit new ones at cheep prices.

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Isn't that the idea considering the budget? It's the right move considering the circumstances...you have to do the best with what you have.

Two modern AAW frigates cost more then all 8 frigates Pakistan is buying. PN was always more focused on submarines then on big surface combatants and if we are realistic that was good choice considering whit who they have to compete...

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I see what you mean. But i believe your comment regarding modern more high tech frigates was/is being considered...I'm referring to Pakistan's interest in 2 OHP's. Unfortunatly i don't know of the extent of the interest.

Pakistan just needs a decently sized and capable navy to protect it's relatively small coastline. The way i see it, and i'm sure you'll agree...they are addressing it the best way possible given the resources at hand. As far as i can see, this is just the beginning for the PNavy's "modernisation". Also, i'm not sure about the Chinese frigates, but the Elli's aren't all that bad. Although they are not upgraded like the other ones, Maybe Pakistan will put them through an upgrade.

Well have to see. I just remembered, I have seen a recent pic of the Chinese F22P version and the "Pakistani" F22P version, It appears there have been some pretty significant changes on it and looks to be "taylor made" to Pakistans requirements, whatever that is. Unfortunatly the writing was in Chinese and thats as far as i know.

Well compared to currant ships Ex. Greek Kortnaer class is quite improvement and F22p are actually quite capable for that price. But problem is that without decent air defenses thous ships must stay near coast if they wont to survive, and if they are bought for coastal defenses PN would be better buying corvettes...

I think that PN made right decision focusing on modern submarines and somewhat neglecting surface combatants and I think that they will do that in the future too...

As for OHP class IIRC USN striped Mk 13 launchers from all remaining Perry's... So they don t carry either SAM nor SSM. Even if they have Mk13 they are not answer for PN lack of air defenses... They could be modified for limited fleet air defense role if PN would modified them to carry Mk41 VLS and ESSM but even that comes whit quite big price tag...

Yes i fully agree. And the F22P's are an extremely good purchase with thanks to China. I'm confident that the vulnerability of the PN which you highlighted will be addressed in the near future. I rememeber one of the main Pak officials saying that the Navy's needs would be met and we are seeing those promises bear fruit. So i think these issues will be addressed in due course, whether thats when more funds are available or when it is next in line as part of the modernisation. I think the Pakistani's do find finance for where it's needed most, take the recent AWAC's deal. I think after the induction of the coming 8 Frigates together with the 3 Agosta 90B's and a further 3-5 Marlin/U-boats together with the problem in the air addressed well find a pretty good navy with regard to its purpose.

well here budget is the main problem.
they want to get cheap platform but quite good in term of technology.thats what they could afford.
for me its good enough for pn to buy f-22p with cheap price,they can get z-9,c-802 n hq-7 although it is point defence missile.

They say this is the F-22P for Pakistan