Sino-India conflict

Indianfighter said:

according to China's own designation, not India's.
According to India's designation, it is an autonomous region of China not an integral part of China.

I repeat : India still claims Aksai Chin from Tibet. Since Tibet is under the occupation of China (not integral, but autonomous), India claims Aksai Chin from China.

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Hmmm

Interacting with media persons, Ambassador Sun said a joint declaration made during then Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee's visit to China in 2003 had resolved the Tibet issue by recognising it "as an integral part of China".

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would you accept the point now ?

Even the Dalai Lama agree's that Tibet is an integral part of China

ZJ: The Chinese government has repeatedly stated three conditions for your
return to Tibet. One is, what they call, to stop the pursuit of
independence and what they call "splittist activities," which they mainly
refer to your visits to foreign countries and meeting with political leaders
around the world. They also want you to declare that Tibet is an integral
part of China. Thirdly, that Taiwan is a province of China. Which ones of
these conditions can you or can't you accept?

DL: Essentially, I think all these conditions, essentially, I agree. The
first one, we always persuade Tibetan outside Tibet we should look for a
mutually agreeable solution, rather than independence. And then, even from
our own viewpoint of our own interest, as far as economic development is
concerned, if we remain within the People's Republic of China, we might get
greater benefit, provided the Chinese central government respects Tibetan
culture, the Tibetan environment, and these things. So, therefore, I think
of the two conditions, already, essentially, our goal is that way.

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how about now ?

June 22 - Vajpayee is in China. India concedes that Tibet is an integral part of China. China agrees to recognise Sikkim's accession to India.

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Indianfighter said:

It also in no way implies that the region cannot be sovereign again.

Example of Kashmir. Till the time it is resolved, it remains under autonomy within India (I am talking of Indian Kashmir).

Similarly, till the time Tibet is resolved, it remains under autonomy of China (China provides administration/defence, currency etc.).

Now autonomy of Buenos Aires is different. It just means that it doesnt come under a province/state and has its own municipality and other federal administration.
It is more like the Union Territories of India like Andaman Islands and Lakshadweep Islands of India or Falkland Islands of UK. Thats not "pure" autonomy.

Hence Buenos Aires is a Union Territory of Argentina and not an autonomous region.

Some Indian cities are also union territories like Chandigarh, and Pondicherry (which are inside Indian mainland).

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what made you think tibet is any different in china's case. over half of china's territory is part of an autonomous region or another, doesn't mean they want to split off and form a little country of their own. what about the North West territories of canada?? do you see it want to separate?? of course not.. it's quebec that wants to separate all the time. the term autonomous region just means they can make some decisions that's usually determined by the central government to make governmnet more efficient.

what made you think tibet is any different in china's case. over half of china's territory is part of an autonomous region or another, doesn't mean they want to split off and form a little country of their own.

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As mentioned by me, they are more similar to Union territories like Falkland Islands of UK or the Goa state of India (Goa was a U.T. till 1987, after which it was declared a state).

It may be mentioned, that the Naga rebels in India are making demands to declare the state of Nagaland as an autonomous region, because they dont believe it is a part of India. Indian government has turned down their demand.

Mr. FreeAsia2000, Chinese diplomats are notorious for making false statements.
India NEVER recognized Tibet as an integral part of China. You may do your own research on Indian media reports or Independent Tibet websites.

Example : In 2003, a Chinese minister of IT declared that Chinese IT exports exceeded India's exports. Later his statement was found to be false by a few billion dollars.

indianfighter.. how do YOU know that tibet is more like Goa politically than let say bueno aires. does china follow indian's definition of autonomous region?? of course not, they follow china's definition. and china's definition is autonomous region = province , and that's pretty much end of story.

never say never, india wants to develop relations with china right now and vice versa. but one of the things india have to do in order to have better relations with china is to publicly declare that tibet is an integral part of china and always will be.

"Example : In 2003, a Chinese minister of IT declared that Chinese IT exports exceeded India's exports. Later his statement was found to be false by a few billion dollars."

that's pretty damned funny, because the INDIAN IT minister was caught with a few lies just recently too. By the way, China doesn't have an IT minister.

I guess some indians just like to talk about stuff they have ABSOLUTELY no clue about, like airplanes and politics.

And talking about the Indian media...they are mostly pieces of shit written by half baked journalists that, again, share the same characteristics our dear indian members here so frequently demonstrate, something put up nicely with the Indian adage: half bottle of vinegar.

by the way, I might point out that one of the sources is actually the Hindustan Times, a very.....flavorful Indian paper.

oh, and before any mods attempt to edit this post, please do note that Indianfighter has thrown all of his credibilities, if he really had any in the first place, out the window with his previous post.

The man in question was the IT minister/secretary/ in the Communist government of China, just like Jiang Zemin is now the Defence minister/secretary (I dont know the exact designation, but I hope members understand my point).

Chinese media also, I'm afraid presents false reports. Infact it cant be blamed because it is bound by the orders of its communist party leaders.

another post from our grossly misinformed Indian friend.

Please, Indianfighter, bringing out names you barely know does not add to your credibility. On the contrary, in the case of a mistake, for example, this instance, it detracts greatly from your already batter reputation. Jiang Ze Ming is now retired. Hu Jin Tao is currently the head of the CMC. You're about a year late, or is that the norm in India?

The official reports from China are very reliable. Whatever the CCP allows the media to publish is almost always true. Unlike some nation, CCP realizes that a lie, if discovered, detracts greatly from the party's reputation, thus the primary method of thought control is the with-holding of information rather than outright lie or gross misunderstanding, like our neighbor to the east tends to demonstrate from time to time in the so called "free" media. Yes, with-holding information is also a form of misinformation, but at the very least, we're not bombarded with the type of rabidly stupid op-eds found in....some other nation's media. Also, it presents us with a very clearly depiction of what we're interested in, mostly in the lack of certain information, and we can arrive relatively close to the truth with logical deductions. Of course, this has presented to be quite a challenge for certain members.

PiSigma said:

never say never, india wants to develop relations with china right now and vice versa. but one of the things india have to do in order to have better relations with china is to publicly declare that tibet is an integral part of china and always will be.

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May be once China would change its stance on Kashmir issue and publicly declare Kashmir as an intergral part of India.

Even the Dalai Lama is saying Tibet is an integral part of China.
I've shown you the link

IndianFighter are you saying that the Indian government's position
on Tibet is more pro-autonomous than that of the Dalai Lama ?

Yaar I really respect your knowledge but nobody in this world is
right all the time.

pappu said:

May be once China would change its stance on Kashmir issue and publicly declare Kashmir as an intergral part of India.

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I don't see that happening in the near future, since remember china and india have a border disagreement in kashmir too. also pakistan is one of the closests friends china have, so china is not going to go piss off pakistan to make india happy.

ff anywayz we are all getting offtopic.. ff