Russia's Military Modernizes

BLUEJACKET just when do you see the Russian Navy returning to it's former glory? 1 year? 2 years? 5 years? Just when? And how many deployable subs do the Russians have at this moment in time????

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It's hard to tell, as it depends on their economic strength- and Russia being oil & gas exporter is volnurable to energy price fluctuations. The number of "deployable subs" is probably classified, and I don't have anyway of determining it. As of 2005,

Currently, Russia has no more than 20 SSBNs, according to a recent (March 2005) statement of Chief of the Navy Vladimir Kuroyedov, but most experts believe that the number of operational SSBNs does not exceed 12-14 and is likely to contract further. ..The core of the attack nuclear submarine fleet consists of Project 971 Shchuka B (NATO name Akula) submarines—a smaller multipurpose development of Project 945 (Nato name Sierra). Project 971 began in the mid-1970s and the first submarine in that class was launched in 1984. A total of 13 these SSNs have been built, the latest, Vepr, was launched in 1996. Project 971 SSNs are widely known as the quietest, fastest, most modern submarines in Russia and are widely reported to be on par with the most advanced U.S. attack submarines. Reportedly, Russia plans to build several more submarines of this class, completing vessels whose construction was frozen in the 1990s due to the lack of funding. Another "core class" of SSNs are Projects 949 Granit and 949A Antey (NATO names Oscar I and II); 13 of these submarines have been built. ..Diesel submarines number about 20 and are represented by reasonably advanced Project 877 Varshavyanka (NATO name Kilo) class submarines of various modifications, which entered service in late 1980s. A submarine of the latest modification entered service in 2000.

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This table gives you an idea of current/future numbers- cut it by half and there's your guestimate-
If you got some $ to spare, contact , maybe he can provide you with better data.


IMO Russia doesn't need to restore her global /blue water presence- the littorals are more important now. In the Far East, China will pick up the slack; the Indian Ocean is for Indians to police; Arctic, Baltic, Atlantic, and the Med. will see occasional or increased RN deployments as situations warrant.
They will be lucky to maintain modern units in the fleet with slow production of new ones- for themslves and for export.

how is russia's relationship with china as of now? do they consider them a threat? or are they still good friends, Cinsidering the ASAT tests, etc., is russia going to gradually down arms sales to China?

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Russia needs China for a number of geopolitical & economic reasons, but there are some in the elite who fear about the "Yellow Peril" to their Far Eastern provinces that were taken piece by piece from the Ching Dynasty China. as I said in another post, they would be better off selling them back before it's too late! As for arms sales, they don't allow the latest systems to China, but they do need $$$ to revitalise their heavy industry.


"Russia's Upcoming Revised Military Doctrine"

Missile Defense Briefing Report No. 217, February 26, 2007
American Foreign Policy Council, Washington, DC
Editor: Ilan Berman

EUROPE’S CHOICE...
The Bush administration is moving closer to making a European leg for its missile defense system a reality. The Associated Press (February 13) reports that the government of Prime Minister Jaroslaw Kaczynski in Poland is close to reaching a domestic consensus over hosting ten proposed interceptors for the U.S. missile defense shield. According to the Polish premier, just one of the country’s eight major political parties remains hesitant about signing on to the Bush administration’s anti-missile effort. Kaczynski’s government, however, is already preparing itself for participation. According to the Xinhua news agency (February 22), officials in Warsaw have expressed hopes that negotiations with the United States over basing could be concluded as soon as possible.

The Czech Republic appears to be following suit. In recent days, Prague has initiated serious discussions with the White House about housing a complimentary X-band radar array, Czech President Vaclav Klaus has revealed in comments carried by Moscow’s Itar-TASS news agency on February 14th. According to Klaus, the possible deployment of ABM components on Czech soil has become viewed as his country’s “contribution to the consolidation of defenses of the whole of the NATO territory.”

...AND RUSSIA’S RESPONSE
News of this newfound enthusiasm for missile defense has sent shockwaves through the Kremlin, with Russian officials warning that Eastern European countries could risk becoming Moscow’s targets. “[T]he countries that accept to deploy... should be worried about ecological and other consequences," Russian air force chief Vladimir Mikhailov has told reporters in comments carried by the Agence France Presse (February 14).

Nor has Russia’s response been limited to rhetoric. The New York Times (February 7) reports that Russia’s defense ministry has unveiled an “ambitious” new $190 billion, eight-year defense plan aimed at preserving and reinforcing the country’s strategic arsenal. The plan’s major initiatives are said to include the acquisition of 17 new ballistic missiles this year, as well as the deployment of 34 new Topol-M ICBMs capable of “penetrat[ing] prospective missiles defenses.” Russian officials similarly have signaled their readiness to withdraw from the Intermediate Nuclear Forces (INF) Treaty signed between President Ronald Reagan and Soviet General Secretary Mikhail Gorbachev in 1987 – a move that would pave the way for Moscow to resume the development and deployment of intermediate range ballistic missiles capable of threatening Europe.

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The backbone of Russia's defense is RVSN, and .

BLUEJACKET said:

Will the UK risk confrontation by closing Gibraltar to the RN carrier?

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Not if it wants to transit. If it were going to be based in the Med, who knows. The Russians wouldn't stand for a NATO carrier to be based in the Black Sea, Baltic, etc.

The Russians (and others) been involved in the Spanish civil war without rolling across Europe.

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If you haven't noticed, Spain isn't in a state of civil war, nor is there any chance of it falling into such a state. So that's irrelevant.

Besides, the FSB and/or GRU may do something to stop tourists from coming - costing millions in lost revenue-in addition to attacking military targets there.

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You have to be joking, right? Who would care about a loss of tourism if security issues required action?

With long-range CMs/IRBMs Russia could target USN/NATO carriers and other forces from its own territory, the Black/Baltic Seas, (and perhaps from their ally Serbia as well!)

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I doubt that tactic would work, and the Serbs would be very stupid to get dragged into such a conflict.

Look this "Russian Mediterranian Breakthrough" talk is just a redux of Cold War wargames. The Soviet Navy had to have enough power to bust through its chokepoints (GIUK gap, Bosphorus, Baltic Sea entrance) It never had that power. Why? It didn't have the amphibious capability. In order to overcome that problem, the Voyenno-Morskoy Flot would have to have enough power to land in European Turkey, Denmark and maybe Iceland in rapid succession or simaltaeneously.

Nowadays the North Sea exits and Baltic Sea exits are not as important. But what Russia still needs is a force of LHAs, LPDs and other longer range amphibious ships in the Black Sea Fleet to give it the ability to get by the Bosphourus and or project power into the Mediteranean in order to get access to the strategic Middle East. Russia has never had a satisfactory Marine Corps. After the Black Sea Fleet the Far East Fleet should recieve amphib upgrades to allow it to bypass chokepoints at the Sea of Japan exit to reach the water off China and the open Pacfic. And TU-160 regiments to provide the ASM fire power to back up the Navy. Forget about all this WWIII talk. It's about power projection.

sorry, just wondering, though: how is russia's relationship with china as of now? do they consider them a threat? or are they still good friends, Cinsidering the ASAT tests, etc.,

is russia going to gradually down arms sales to China?

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I think Russia is anxious about China. It's why they've been trying so hard to court them.

Russia probably won't decrease arms sales, but look for increasingly nationalist Chinese politicians to talk about "self-reliance" in the military and cut down on Russian arms shipments.

Russia probably won't decrease arms sales, but look for increasingly nationalist Chinese politicians to talk about "self-reliance" in the military and cut down on Russian arms shipments.[/QUOTE]

thats bad for Russia since they need all the money they can get and the only customer to buy a lot of weapons from Russia is china. but now they are being more self-reliant, Russia will have to sell the weapons some were else such as Iran or North Korea. :coffee:

FuManChu said:

The Russians wouldn't stand for a NATO carrier to be based in the Black Sea, Baltic, etc.
If you haven't noticed, Spain isn't in a state of civil war, nor is there any chance of it falling into such a state. So that's irrelevant.
I doubt that tactic would work, and the Serbs would be very stupid to get dragged into such a conflict.

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There can't be any land-attack carriers in the Black Sea, as per old international agreement. I mentioned their civil war to pint out the fact that the distance didn't prevent Russia's participation in it- and Spain is eager to get Gibraltar back. If the Serbs conclude that htey have more to gain by siding with Russia, than they'll provide assistance in accessing the Med.
I failed to mention that, although that strait can be blocked, Turkey may not block Bosporus- it has it's own disputes with NATO members, furthermore, by the same token, Russia may close the Suez by grounding a few large commercial ships and/or attacking NATO warships there- then NATO navies and merchant ships will have to go around Africa to reach the Persian Gulf, while her own trade can go over land & via the Caspian Sea and Iran!
I do agree that Russia has rather small , but maybe they don't need it much. The Army soldiers can be given extra training (the already have a lot in common with the marines) & augment the MC. With modern weaponry, closing the choke points won't change much in Russia's case due to her location- while for NATO it will make life miserable!

Russia to create new super weapon that provides air, missile and space protection

"The 20th-century concept of unacceptable damage, defining a second-strike deterrent capability and once being calculated in percentage points of losses in population and economic resources, has shrunk to a single nuclear explosion on the American soil,” he said. “And neither a sudden attack on the enemy’s nuclear weapon facilities nor an anti-ballistic missile shield can guarantee, at least up to 2050, that a single second-strike missile armed with a nuclear warhead does not reach the United States".
Goltz pointed to North Korea, where even the unverified notion of this country having one or two nuclear charges effectively deters possible U.S. attack.

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thats bad for Russia since they need all the money they can get and the only customer to buy a lot of weapons from Russia is china. but now they are being more self-reliant, Russia will have to sell the weapons some were else such as Iran or North Korea.

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India is buying more from Russia than China. Venezuela is also looking to make a big deal with Russia on military equipment. Syria too is looking to expand its arsenal. Hell, even Saudi Arabia is talking about buying weapons from Russia.

Here are two articles on Russian micro UAVs and gel body armor. Pretty cool stuff 'cuz both technologies are small, lightweight, and highly flexible. Now, the real question is, will this stuff be any good on the battlefield?

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DATE:13/07/07
SOURCE:Flight International
Russian micro UAVs demonstrate swarming capability
By Peter La Franchi

The little-known Russian A-Level Aerosystems company has demonstrated swarming capabilities using micro unmanned air vehicles with repeated flight displays at this year's ParcAberporth UAV airshow at West Wales airport.

Two ZALA 421-08 flying wing UAVs and a single portable ground station were used in the demonstrations, with the air vehicles keeping formation using A-Level Systems' own GPS-based autopilot and navigation system.

A-Level Systems managing director Nikita Zakharov says the micro UAV type has been flying for two years with deliveries of operational systems under way to Russian's Ministry of Interior Affairs.

The ParcAberporth flights, the first by Russian UAVs in UK airspace, also included demonstration of voice-based reporting by the air vehicle, including location reports, airspeed and communications link status. Zakharov says voice-based mission planning and re-planning capability is currently in development for the system.

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Russian scientists developed liquid armour
From:

Russian scientists in Yekaterinburg have used nanotechnology to protect people by developing so-called liquid armour, which is like gel and is applied on the metal or clothe. The surface becomes bullet-proof in a sharp impact.

Nikolai Victorov, one of the authors of the discovery says: “A metallic surface, for one a door of a vehicle or clothe is filled with liquid armour. When a bullet hits the surface or it is subjected to an attack by knife the nano-particles are being pressed and collected in a cluster and liquid becomes a hard composite. It takes only milliseconds to turn from liquid state to hard. However, the hard material turns into liquid only after some time. The transition period depend on the concrete incident and lies between five minutes and an hour.

This is quite light armour. An ordinary bulletproof car weighs between 2 and 3 tons but if the special gel is used the car’s normal weight increases slightly. For one, a bullet-proof jacket filled with gel weighs 2 or 3 kg.

Another important factor is that liquid armour is flexible. According to Nikolai Victorov, this effect is achieved by the use of gel. If gel is applied on a shirt and when a person wears it he does not feel uncomfortable in his movements. This makes it possible to protect the body effectively. The movements of a person have no impact on the behavior of nano-particles. If the shirt is tied into a knot nothing will happen since the pressure on it is insignificant.
Scientists in Yekaterinburg insist that liquid armour could be used in many areas from defence to space industry. Gel could be used in automobile industry. When bumper is filled with gel the safety of passengers is upgraded.

03.04.2007
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Outside View: S-400 missile system delays

by Andrei Kislyakov

Moscow (UPI) May 22, 2008

The Russian Topol strategic missile launchers that rolled through Red Square on May 9 were impressive to the eye, though I hope there is no intention to use these weapons.
Meanwhile the "density" of armed conflicts across the world keeps growing, and the main role in these conflicts is played by conventional yet precision weapons.

The missile defense system being set up by the Americans, incorporating ground, naval and space components tightly integrated with air defense systems, is an effort to protect themselves not only against strategic nuclear missiles but also against the whole spectrum of precision weapons.

While the pragmatic Americans, who figured out early that to integrate all aerospace defense would mean putting it in one bundle, have been working on this program for a long time already, Russia's government only developed a similar program and started its implementation as late as the end of April.

As Sergei Ivanov, until this week first deputy prime minister, pointed out, the range of measures involves creating a multi-service system of defenses against precision weapons, including unified control and information systems, to protect Russia's armed forces, economy and infrastructure.

Sergei Ivanov, who also put in a long tour of service as Russia's defense minister, stressed that today's Russian army and navy are equipped with air defense missile systems developed in the 1960s and '70s.

Ivanov's comments imply a quick retooling of the Russian armed forces with modern air defense weapons capable of repulsing airspace attacks. This mainly concerns the S-400 Triumph air-defense and theater anti-missile weapon -- North Atlantic Treaty Organization reporting name SA-21 Growler -- that proved highly capable in tests held in July 2007.

This system is a really good one. Unlike its predecessor, the S-300, the S-400/SA-21 interceptor missile is capable of engaging targets not only in the air but also in outer space. It could potentially become the backbone of both Russia's unified aerospace defense system and a European non-strategic missile defense.

Unfortunately, however, the new weapons are being deployed far too slowly, and in too small numbers, to have any effect. The sole S-400 battalion is deployed in the vicinity of the Moscow region town of Elektrostal.

Speaking on the creation of an integral air defense missile system and preparations for its serial production, Ivanov noted a number of problems impeding the process, primarily inadequate financing and coordination, lack of manufacturing capacities for mass production and poor quality of component parts produced.

These problems not only are hampering defense production but also are a scourge of the entire national economy. In addition, the defense industry lately has developed a harmful habit of exporting the bulk of its latest and most sophisticated hardware, ignoring the requirements of the national armed forces. The S-400 interceptor missile system is no exception, and its export record is predetermined.

In other words, the Russian armed forces are still a long way from deploying a dependable air defense system capable of reliably protecting all vital infrastructures within the Russian territory. By that time, the S-400 Triumph would be obsolete and helpless against new, modernized guided precision weapons, and its capability would not match its name.

Yet missiles are not the only means of countering modern precision weapons. Precision weapons are a means of destruction comprising guidance or automatic homing devices. So it is possible to defend a location either by destroying the bomb or missile, or by hindering its homing mechanisms. The latter option envisages creating effective countermeasures.

Modern foreign precision weapons use automatic homing devices operating within the visible, infrared and radar spectra. With its homing system "blinded," a cruise missile is virtually useless.

The Russian military already has developed a relatively cheap way of protecting a large area without deploying air-defense missile systems. The idea is to use remote-detonated munitions to build up a high-altitude barrage, lowering the target contrast in all three spectra and disorienting the incoming precision weapon.

It is clear that one shouldn't rely solely upon this method of countering precision-guided munitions. But any means of protection are good in today's world with its avalanche-like pace of developing new weapons systems.

(Andrei Kislyakov is a political commentator for RIA Novosti. This article is reprinted by permission of RIA Novosti. The opinions expressed in this article are the author's and do not necessarily represent those of RIA Novosti.)

(United Press International's "Outside View" commentaries are written by outside contributors who specialize in a variety of important issues. The views expressed do not necessarily reflect those of United Press International. In the interests of creating an open forum, original submissions are invited.)

It seems after some problems lately with their Bulava, they now make some progress.

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Russia Test Fires New-Gen Strategic Missile: Reports

MOSCOW - A Russian submarine on Sept. 18 test-fired a Bulava strategic multiple warhead missile designed to overcome missile defenses, news agencies reported, citing the defense ministry. [...]

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