Possible U.K. evac from Lebanon

SampanViking said:

A potentially interesting situation for Europeans then. Technically we are all citizens of the EU and that would suggest a not unreasonable expectation of assistance from the armed forces of all and any other EU member state.

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Yes I can just see the French forces helping the Brits...

King Arthur: Can we come up and have a look?
French Soldier: Of course not. You're English types.
King Arthur: What are you then?
French Soldier: I'm French. Why do you think I have this outrageous accent, you silly king?
Sir Galahad: What are you doing in England?
French Soldier: Mind your own business.

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Monty Python...

However our wonderful prime minister is not exactly helping matters
in lebanon with his stupid off the record comments...

I wonder how the Lebanese feel about this comment

"She's going,'' Bush told Blair. "Condi's going to go pretty soon.''

Shortly after, Blair remarked, "See if she goes out there she's got to succeed as it were, whereas I can just go out and talk.''

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shades of Suez...

Two British warships have arrived already, apparently - HMS Gloucester and HMS York (Type 42 Destroyers). HMS Illustrious (Carrier), HMS Bulwark (LPD), HMS St Albans (Type 23 Frigate) and RFA Fort Victoria (Aux) will arrive by noon Thursday.

And someone was saying something about the Israeli naval blockade interfering with an evac......

Oh, and apparently 40 British kids and people with long-term illness were air-lifted to Cyprus when the FCO's "rapid reaction team" flew in.

FuManChu said:

So what is the embassy supposed to do? Please enlighten us. I'm guessing there is:

a) No Canadian military support of much use in the area.
b) No private transportation it can use.

So what's it supposed to do? Ask Dr Who to pop over in the TARDIS and whisk everyone inside and to safety? I think you're being a bit harsh on your government. It doesn't have the military resources of the UK, let alone the US.

Of course if you're willing to fund and campaign for a big tax hike to pay for a better Canadian military........

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Well, we could negotiate with the Americans, that's for sure. Any kind of rescue effort would probably involve the joint effort of NATO countries or maybe just Australia, Britain, Canada and USA. Either way, consider how much of the Canadian service serves with the Americans, we would need American help for any kind of large operation. It's too bad our C-17s are just purchased. Until then, the C-130s would have to do the transportation. And also, you can use some commercial airline planes too. But much of this, you would need the Beirut airport repaired and running.

tphuang said:

Well, we could negotiate with the Americans, that's for sure. Any kind of rescue effort would probably involve the joint effort of NATO countries or maybe just Australia, Britain, Canada and USA.

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I am quite sure that is exactly what they are trying to do right now. After all, countries are going to prioritise their own citizens first, which is why Canada will need to talk things over to ensure it doesn't have to wait until everyone else is evacuated first.

Bd popeye, the U.S. has now come up with an evacuation plan. They're going to use the cruise ship Orient queen. She's heading for Lebanon now, escorted by a destroyer. Theres also details of other international evac plans in this article, as well as the one I just mentioned:



FuManChu, a foreign evacuation has to take place with the permission of the Israeli government, since the blcokade is Israeli led. The British and other foreign goverments will have to negotiate with Israel first before a massive evacuation can take place. And then of course, there is a possibility Hezbollah could try to disrupt the evcuation.

DPRKPTboat said:

FuManChu, a foreign evacuation has to take place with the permission of the Israeli government, since the blcokade is Israeli led. The British and other foreign goverments will have to negotiate with Israel first before a massive evacuation can take place. And then of course, there is a possibility Hezbollah could try to disrupt the evcuation.

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It depends what you meant by "negotiate". For one thing, Israel doesn't have the authority to establish the blockade in the first place.

I would say it is quite obvious Tel Aviv will be contacted to ensure the evacuation will go as smoothly as possible, but there is no way the Israelis can actually stop it happening if we feel we have to go ahead anyway - e.g. if the situation deteriorates further.

Besides I doubt very much that they even would object to an evacuation if they felt they could get block it - they will want the foreign nationals out ASAP.

Popeye, how is the USN going to use that cruise ship. The port is destroyed. How is everyone going to get on the ship?

Here's how I would do it-

Get Israel to stop bombing the airport, put the word out for all Americans to make their way to the tarmac where they will be picked up by helicopter and transported to the Iwo Jima. Bam.

Finn McCool said:

Popeye, how is the USN going to use that cruise ship. The port is destroyed. How is everyone going to get on the ship?

Here's how I would do it-

Get Israel to stop bombing the airport, put the word out for all Americans to make their way to the tarmac where they will be picked up by helicopter and transported to the Iwo Jima. Bam.

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There probally is somewhere the ship can dock. The US State dept. website says plans are in the works for an evacuation.

Italian citizens are evacuated on an Italian navy warship in Beirut port, 17 July 2006, on the sixth consecutive day of the Israeli bombardement on Lebanon. France and Italy have mobilised evacuation plans to bring thousands of their nationals to safety in Cyprus, while Britain, Canada and the United States are preparing to use the island as a staging post. AFP PHOTO ERIC FEFERBERG (Photo credit should read ERIC FEFERBERG/AFP/Getty Images)

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Beirut port looks ok to me... Joust seen the news on TV and they showed UK Chinooks evacuating UK citizens...

One of the problems the US faces in any sort of evacuation is where it's large deck ships are.



Ships Underway

Carriers:
USS Kitty Hawk (CV 63) - Pacific Ocean
USS Enterprise (CVN 65) - East China Sea
USS Abraham Lincoln (CVN 72) - Pacific Ocean
USS George Washington (CVN 73) - Atlantic Ocean
USS John C. Stennis (CVN 74) - Pacific Ocean

Hospital Ships
USNS Mercy (T-AH 19) - port visit, Nias Island, Indonesia

Peleliu Expeditionary Strike Group (ESG):
USS Peleliu (LHA 5) - port visit, Phuket, Thailand
USS Ogden (LPD 5) - port visit, Phuket, Thailand
USS Germantown (LSD 42) - port visit, Phuket, Thailand

Iwo Jima Expeditionary Strike Group (ESG):
USS Iwo Jima (LHD 7) - Red Sea
USS Nashville (LPD 13) - Red Sea
USS Whidbey Island (LSD 41) - Red Sea

Amphibious Warfare Ships:
USS Boxer (LHD 4) - Pacific Ocean
USS Bonhomme Richard (LHD 6) - Pacific Ocean
USS Cleveland (LPD 7) - Pacific Ocean
USS Dubuque (LPD 8) - Pacific Ocean
USS Denver (LPD 9) - Pacific Ocean
USS Trenton (LPD 14) - Red Sea
USS Comstock (LSD 45) - Pacific Ocean
USS Tortuga (LSD 46) - port visit, Sarabaya, Indonesia
USS Rushmore (LSD 47) - Pacific Ocean
USS Harpers Ferry (LSD 49) - port visit, Yokosuka, Japan
USS Carter Hall (LSD 50) - Atlantic Ocean

There are no CVN's or LHD's in the Medterrian. The closest is the Iwo Jima in the Red Sea. I guess there are some plans to use USMC & USN helos to shuttle those that desire to leave Lebanon to the island of Cyprus to catch commerical charter flights back to the US. There are 25,000 US citizens in Lebanon but about 18,000 of them are residents of that country. the rest are tourist, visitors students ETC...

We will all have to wait and see what happens.