PLAN Carrier Strike Group and Airwing

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Jeff Head said:

As to the Migs, it is clear that originally the Soviets werre planning a fairly diverse and mixed airwing, including the Migs. I believe the Russians were also going to use the SU-25 Frogfoot (sort of the Russian equivalent of the A-10) as an attack aircraft off of her too. In fact, I believe they still have a t least one squardron of them in their naval air arm.

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The naval Frogfoots (Su-25UTGs) were just built as trainers. They were unable to operate a fully laden Su-25 (armament pluss enough fuel to give it a decent range) of the carrier's deck.
10 UTGs were built, 5 for Ukraine, and 5 for Russia. Russia lost one of them in a training accident, and does now only have 4 (last time I checked, the Bort numbers were "8", "11", "14" and "16". All of them (with the Flanker-Ds and UBs) operate from an airfield just east of Severmorsk called "Malyavr".

Due to bad visibility for the rear seat instructor on the UTG, the Russian Fleet Air Arm decided to built Su-27KUB/Su-33UB as new primary trainer (and later plans, strike aircraft) for the Su-33 pilots. It features a side-by side cockpit which were though to be the best for both trainee and instructor. 3 prototypes were probarly built, with only one flying. Bort number "21".

They also had plans for a prop driven AEW aircraft.

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That would be the Yak-44. A russian look a like of the E-2C Hawkeye. After the initial plan of using An-71 Madcaps are carrier-born aircraft they tried designing the Yak-44, but unfortunatly, I dont belive it left the drawingboard.


Oh, and btw...LOVELY SITE!

PS: once again, if you have a slightest interest in the Kuznetsov carrier and its airwing, I suggest you download the rar file I packed full of pictures related to it.

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Gauntlet said:

The naval Frogfoots (Su-25UTGs) were just built as trainers. That would be the Yak-44. A russian look a like of the E-2C Hawkeye. After the initial plan of using An-71 Madcaps are carrier-born aircraft they tried designing the Yak-44, but unfortunatly, I dont belive it left the drawingboard.

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When it all bolis down to it, the USSR and now the Russians just do not have the resource...the money...to do all that was necessary to develop full blown carriers with a full blown, diverse wing of aircraft. I believe the PRC, because it is cash rich right now, will be able to invest the resources to do it...but it will take a lot of time.

Just look at the diversity, even on todays US aircraft carriers...the Hawkeye, the Prowlers, the Hornets, the Vikings, (are any of them left abooard?), the Seahawks. They all play together and play pivotal roles. Without any of them, the capaility is just so much reduced.

Gauntlet said:

Oh, and btw...LOVELY SITE!

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Thanks...I hope people find it useful. I will download that tar file and check it out. Thanks.

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Jeff Head said:

When it all bolis down to it, the USSR and now the Russians just do not have the resource...the money...to do all that was necessary to develop full blown carriers with a full blown, diverse wing of aircraft. I believe the PRC, because it is cash rich right now, will be able to invest the resources to do it...but it will take a lot of time.

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Yeah. Well, the biggest problem with the Varyag would probarly be the lack of hangar space enough to operate a full mixed fixed wing airwing. I mean, even the Kuznetsov dont have room for 2 full squadrons of Flanker-Ds.

But then again, what if the Varyag is beeing modified to remove the Shipwreck launchers, and extend the hangar deck all the way up front. IMO, that would be an abselutly genious modification, allowing the Varyag to opereate a large and possibly varied airwing.

Just look at the diversity, even on todays US aircraft carriers...the Hawkeye, the Prowlers, the Hornets, the Vikings, (are any of them left abooard?), the Seahawks. They all play together and play pivotal roles. Without any of them, the capaility is just so much reduced.

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I belive the Viking would be all phased out of carrier service by 2008 or '09. Its ASW role is taken over by the Seahawk, and tanker role by buddy-to-buddy refueling F-18s, as you probarly know.

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Gauntlet said:

I belive the Viking would be all phased out of carrier service by 2008 or '09. Its ASW role is taken over by the Seahawk, and tanker role by buddy-to-buddy refueling F-18s, as you probarly know.

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I still think it a mistake to get rid of the Vikings. They have long legs, can carry a LOT more ordinance, and are packed with a BUNCH of electronics. A slightly smaller P-3. Maybe the V-22 will be modified for that role.

The Seahwaks are great...they just aren't a Viking.

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

J-11 for carriers ?? I think J-11 plus Su-33s from Russia with folding wings will be a good bet.

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Su-27 Pilot said:

J-11 for carriers ?? I think J-11 plus Su-33s from Russia with folding wings will be a good bet.

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I agree. I believe the PLAN and the PRC is capable of making the same type of conversions to their SU-27's or J-11' that the Russians made to theirs to produce the SU-33. I think it is likely they wioll do so when the time comes, if they haven's started already.

Re: My trip to the US Navy Reserve Fleet in Bremerton, WA

Anyway, I do hope to put new carriers up there as they start construction...like the new UK carriers as soon as they start, and the CVN-21, which I view as a new class.

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Well Jeff have you seen this Northrop-Grumman page?



Great drawings of CVN-78 and pics of the steel cutting. Glad I live in the US where this type of info is readily available. And not some big secrect.

CVN-21 is the program. CVN-78 will be the hull number. I don't know why.

Re: My trip to the US Navy Reserve Fleet in Bremerton, WA

bd popeye said:

Well Jeff have you seen this Northrop-Grumman page?

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

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Thanks popeye! Here is the link I have been using for the CVN-21 program on my site:



But I like yours better and will change to that one!

Yes, it's good to live in a free society where this information is available to all.

Re: My trip to the US Navy Reserve Fleet in Bremerton, WA

say, Jeff.

If I buy your books from Amazon.co.uk, will you get any profit from it?



Are your book some of the same genre as Tom Clancy's "Red Storm Rising"?

I just love that book...

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

Jeff Head said:

I agree. I believe the PLAN and the PRC is capable of making the same type of conversions to their SU-27's or J-11' that the Russians made to theirs to produce the SU-33. I think it is likely they wioll do so when the time comes, if they haven's started already.

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Perhaps they could. I wonder if Russia would just sell them the SU-33's outright. I doubt they would, but I'm sure the PLAN could upgrade their own Sukhoi's to be navalized and carrier capable. I really like the Su-30 MKK's and wonder if they can be navalized in this way.