PLA Strategy in a Taiwan Contingency

tankphobia

Senior Member
Registered Member
I'm not sure how much of an advantage specifically shaped stealth antiship missiles are. Cruise missiles have very low RCS already and stealth against ships matters most if it actually reduces detection distance within the ships radar horizon.

A clean F-16 has far more 90 degree retroreflectors due to large size and many flight control surfaces, yet has only a 1 m2 X band average RCS. What really increases RCS is exposed compressor and external mounted munitions creating more corner retroreflectors.

A regular cruise missile is geometrically a simple tube with wings. Random guess: even something like the Harpoon would be just 1/10 the RCS of a clean F-16.

In addition, a sea skimmer would only be visible on radar within 10-15 km. The RCS reduction has to be sufficient such that it isn't detectable by radar even within essentially visual range.
I wouldn't count stealthy cruise missiles out just yet, storm shadows seem to be having some success getting past Russia air defenses for the moment, although that's on land and there will be nothing to hide behind in the sea. The complex EW environment in a true fleet vs fleet combat may complicate detection however.
 

Biscuits

Colonel
Registered Member
that's why I used the word "inconvenience" in regard to international warrants and sanctions that may be served on President Xi.
still, what happened to Ms. Meng WanZhou in Canada should serve as an example of how low the US and its western cronies can stoop to demonize China and its leader.
when it comes to hypocritical tricks and traps, no one can beat the US at its game.
For most cases like that, China has the luxury of escalatory dominance though.

Many US oligarchs have to personally visit China, while most of China’s industry leaders do not need to travel to America or its client states.

When America kidnapped a Chinese citizen, advantages in intelligence operations allowed China to arrest more important targets.

I don't think US would try that again after receiving a relative humiliation the last time.
 

Biscuits

Colonel
Registered Member
People say that, but I don't see how he could have done anything differently. The relationship with the west broke down because of Trump, not because of Xi. He just made the best out of a bad situation. The West was always going to challenge China at around this time, simply because Chinese power is now approaching American power and given current growth rates, is set to eclipse it soon.

Of course there are things that Xi could have done better or earlier, nobody is perfect, but did he actually make a mistake?
Xi is one of the better for the west. Realistically, there would never be anyone that is "nice" to them, as long as their aggression levels increase.

At least Xi is willing to talk, has walked back on opportunities to punish USA and scaled back defensive activities.

Let's not forget Xi has personally shown worrying tendencies to pro-Americanism. He visited America as a student and let his daughter spend some time there. However, Xi is obviously restrained by the party center on how pro-American his policies will be.

There is simply no realistic or logical reason why the number 1 would bow down to number 2. The most Chinese leaders can do for America is to keep the door open for talks and let them save face. Which is what Xi does.

USA might think that by resorting to martial threats and "covert influence" they can cower China. That is a very stupid idea. Just ask how Putin how trying take all of the EU using only Russia works for him. If not for being backed by the no1 economy, Russia would be dead.
 

Michaelsinodef

Senior Member
Registered Member
Xi is one of the better for the west. Realistically, there would never be anyone that is "nice" to them, as long as their aggression levels increase.

At least Xi is willing to talk, has walked back on opportunities to punish USA and scaled back defensive activities.

Let's not forget Xi has personally shown worrying tendencies to pro-Americanism. He visited America as a student and let his daughter spend some time there. However, Xi is obviously restrained by the party center on how pro-American his policies will be.

There is simply no realistic or logical reason why the number 1 would bow down to number 2. The most Chinese leaders can do for America is to keep the door open for talks and let them save face. Which is what Xi does.

USA might think that by resorting to martial threats and "covert influence" they can cower China. That is a very stupid idea. Just ask how Putin how trying take all of the EU using only Russia works for him. If not for being backed by the no1 economy, Russia would be dead.
Piece of advice, be less confident and assertive when talking about topics and things you clearly don't have a good grasp on.

Xi having tendies for 'pro-Americanism'? Xi being restrained by the party to not implement more 'pro-American' policies? LMAO.
 

Biscuits

Colonel
Registered Member
Piece of advice, be less confident and assertive when talking about topics and things you clearly don't have a good grasp on.

Xi having tendies for 'pro-Americanism'? Xi being restrained by the party to not implement more 'pro-American' policies? LMAO.
What else would you call allowing his daughter to take courses in America and himself visiting America as a student as???

What would it say about for example Biden's character if Biden sent his son to China or maybe Iran for studies? Would that not show at least a slight pro-China or pro-Iran bent? What if there was a picture of a young smiling Biden next to some Iranian Mullah's family?

I didn't defintely say that Xi being restrained from US-friendly approach is the exact case inside the government, it was just a theory. Either way, we can deduce that Xi had in the past ties with US, but nowadays, the government conducts itself responsibly and adequately against it's enemies, although maybe not with great fervor. And whether if that is because Xi is restrained or because Xi eventually changed his views is up to anyone's speculation.
 

tankphobia

Senior Member
Registered Member
The music haven't stop yet, there is little point in following along after every provocation and playing right into the US's rhetoric, real life data doesn't lie. Despite the fencing match going on at the diplomatic level the trade value between the two countries have only been increasing, for now peace is in everyone's interest. Until Taiwan moves towards unilaterally declaring independence, there is still value in maintaining some semblance of diplomacy and restraint. The US media will bash China regardless of any response so why not choose the outcome that best benefit the country, the chance of successful reunification only increases with time.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
I wouldn't count stealthy cruise missiles out just yet, storm shadows seem to be having some success getting past Russia air defenses for the moment, although that's on land and there will be nothing to hide behind in the sea. The complex EW environment in a true fleet vs fleet combat may complicate detection however.
yep, that's both on land, and Russian Kalibrs have gotten past Ukrainian air defenses with longer range, heavier payload and likely lower cost.
 

Michaelsinodef

Senior Member
Registered Member
What else would you call allowing his daughter to take courses in America and himself visiting America as a student as???
Disregarding his daughter for now (also because little is known besides her going to study in Harward for some time), Xi himself going to US to study for some time, really doesn't mean much. What was he studying? Where?

Well, a quick search shows that he never studied there, well not as a student like university students in say Harward. He went there on a agricultural study visit trip as an official.
So already here you're quite off and wrong lol.
What would it say about for example Biden's character if Biden sent his son to China or maybe Iran for studies? Would that not show at least a slight pro-China or pro-Iran bent? What if there was a picture of a young smiling Biden next to some Iranian Mullah's family?

I didn't defintely say that Xi being restrained from US-friendly approach is the exact case inside the government, it was just a theory. Either way, we can deduce that Xi had in the past ties with US, but nowadays, the government conducts itself responsibly and adequately against it's enemies, although maybe not with great fervor. And whether if that is because Xi is restrained or because Xi eventually changed his views is up to anyone's speculation.
Rather than trying to peddle Xi as being some 'pro-American', it's probably more correct to say that he hasn't been aggressive or active in doing stuff against US and somewhat rather willing to 'take some small steps back' or concessions, although that actually follows Deng's 'Hide your strength, bide your time'.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
I wouldn't count stealthy cruise missiles out just yet, storm shadows seem to be having some success getting past Russia air defenses for the moment, although that's on land and there will be nothing to hide behind in the sea. The complex EW environment in a true fleet vs fleet combat may complicate detection however.
If the Storm Shadow's stealth worked that well against Russian air defenses, they would not be sending the MALD with them to increase their chances of passing through. Initial successful strikes can be more attributed by the Russian air defenses not having its signature on their target library at the time, but the Russians quickly changed that in just a couple of days. While it still passes through and hits targets, their performance was heavily degraded.
 

Minm

Junior Member
Registered Member
Well, this is just regurgitation think tank points.

This Decade of Concern argument fails to justify itself when you look at actual facts. It is more of a cultural meme caused by Americans perceiving the successes of foreign countries as a result of America being distracted, trickery, cheating, etc... There are two questions that should be asked:

Which side has been introducing new platforms faster? China. In many categories, China managed to develop and field competitive platforms and, in some cases like the 055, it outright surpassed Americans. We saw even new platforms such as J-16 and J-20 getting multiple upgrades and a new J-20 variant is about to emerge. So, unlike what could be argued 5 years ago, the rapid iterative development is not limited to catch-up.

Which side is getting equipment faster? China. Even in the fighter jet department, which is among America's shining successes, PLA is getting aircraft as fast as the US Armed Forces does. All of the USN fleet plans of the last 20 years failed while PLAN added hundreds of thousands of tons every year.

So no, there is no window of danger. It is getting worse for the US every year. You said NGAD. What about 1000+ J-20's that will be available by then? What about the H-20? What about the 095, sino 6th gen, DF-27 and vast investment in air defenses that will happen until then?

You said LRASM successor. Again what about Chinese investment in air defense and PLAN ships that actually have the equivalent of LRASM successor now? I don't know what else shows better than this that Chinese tech introduction is not limited to catch-up.
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Japan and Anglosphere were lost causes but European-Chinese relations could be handled better. I am not sure about India.
Exactly, ten years from now China will be so much further ahead economically and industrially as well that the US really can't compete anymore. The terrible 20s just mean that the inflection point is coming even earlier.


The main problems for Chinese foreign policy have been Trump, COVID and the Ukraine war. None of these has been started by Xi. Maybe he didn't handle them as well as possible, but the overall direction of Chinese foreign policy has been dictated by these events from outside the government's control
 
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