PLA Small arms
- Thread starter Vanguard1688
- Start date
5.8*21 is ditched , replaced by 9*19(at least for new guns),the whole PDW thing is bullshit TBH
I want to bring back the SMG vs carbine debate again because this image is a pretty good example I think. Are these frontline troops or something else because if they are, what good would an SMG do in this case? Lots of open land and high mountains, sounds like a minimum of a carbine is needed.
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
It seems like some weapons that are in the 5.8x21mm don’t have a 9x19mm equivalent on the way. The scout knife for example.
This reminds me of the 1998 Kirt Russell movie Soldier. Where during an action montage of Todd 3465’s early combat missions you see him in combat vs Russian troops with an MP5.
Kinda, the latest shows show them having seemingly adopted 9x19mm parabelum for their new weapons. Though given the size of the PLA it’s likely that it will be a few years before they have finalized the transition.
PDW’s role is still valid but the objectives have to be realistic. P90, MP7A1 offer compact single handed weapons that when used properly are more effective to degrees vs SMGs and even carbines. But only in specific areas. Vs the SMG it’s generally double the effective range, vs the carbine it’s generally much lighter and easier to carry. But for this they also have trades off. Vs the SMG and carbine, the specialized rounds mean more for logistics to deal with, specialized retraining and magazines. The PLA seem to have tried to follow the FN57/P90 partnership idea but from a realistic perspective for general military purposes PDW have really struggled. Because you can get similar results from a carbine and pistol.
Effective range for a SMG is generally 100m or <.
Effective range for a PDW is generally 150m or >.
Effective range for a short barrel carbine (mk18) is generally 300m or <.
Effective range for an infantry carbine (M4) is generally 400m or >.
Effective range for a Battle rifle (SR25/FN FAL, FN Scar, XM5) is generally between 600m or >.
Now I commented a number of times that the SBR is generally superior to the SMG and clearly in the above example it should be. In open terrain manouvers like that pictured infantry should have at least a infantry length carbine. That is to say an assault rifle with an intermediate caliber cartridge and a barrel length between 12.5 and 16.5 inches depending on cartridges this would give you an effective range of about 400m. Even a SBR class carbine should have a 300m range.
We have argued over and over on is there any reason why an SMG might be the better choice. The only possible situation I can come to is very compact weapon for specialists whom will not for whatever reasons be issued a carbine. Which I scratch my head about. Or as a special mission weapon. a Suppressed weapon for raids and CQB.
In the later I point out that to general knowledge the Chinese military doesn’t have an equivalent to the 9x39mm or 7.62x35mm (.300blk) calibers.
These offer a scary quiet weapon with an effective range out to 400m.
NATO states lacked a Vintorez equivalent until .300blk began being adopted individually by members in 2015. When western forces wanted to go quiet before that the general solution was either a Suppressor on a modified carbine (like the HK416 that was used to ice OBL) or a suppressor on a SMG like the legendary HK MP5SD series . The former was louder as intermediate caliber especially small caliber high velocity ammunition like 5.56, 5.45 and 5.8 are super sonic by default as well as longer in general due to a larger host weapon and generally larger suppressor combination yet has a longer range. The latter was quieter but shorter range with a generally heavier weight penalty due to most SMGs being blowback recoil operated.
I thought those are also called QJB-201? Are these two similar but different guns or just different nomenclatures for the same thingThe rarely seen QJS-161 in the wild.
by78
General
QJS-161 is chambered for 5.8mm, and QJB-201 is chambered for 7.62mm. QJS-161 is more like a the Chinese equivalent of SAW, whereas QJB-201 is a general purpose machine gun.
QJY-201 is the one chambered in 7.62mm
