PLA Small arms

hsinchong said:

I can't believe PLA is using imported American optic brands such as Sig Sauer, EoTech, from sig's: twitter.com/sig8492

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hsinchong said:

I can't believe PLA is using imported American optic brands such as Sig Sauer, EoTech, from sig's: twitter.com/sig8492

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What can't you believe? This is normal.

Aniah said:

What can't you believe? This is normal.

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The user is saying that the PLA is importing American optics and equipment although that isn't true. Chinese SWAT teams do that. Im not too sure about the PAP though. Regardless, the PLA infantry and SOF always field equipment from domestic sources.

LawLeadsToPeace said:

The user is saying that the PLA is importing American optics and equipment although that isn't true. Chinese SWAT teams do that. Im not too sure about the PAP though. Regardless, the PLA infantry and SOF always field equipment from domestic sources.

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PAP has imported Russian-made high-power sniper rifles as well, so it's no surprise. (they also operate on the "Public Security Spending" budget criteria in the overall public spendings, instead of the "National Defence Spending" budget criteria.)

Does anyone know if these are legit Team Wendy Exfil's, Aimpoint Comp M4, Steiner DBAL's, Manta Strobe & Crye Tropic held by the PAP? I wonder if they are copies.

hsinchong said:

Does anyone know if these are legit Team Wendy Exfil's, Aimpoint Comp M4, Steiner DBAL's, Manta Strobe & Crye Tropic held by the PAP? I wonder if they are copies.

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Are these guys PAP?

hsinchong said:

I can't believe PLA is using imported American optic brands such as Sig Sauer, EoTech, from sig's: twitter.com/sig8492

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I do think if Type 95 have detachable handguard option to enable keymod handguard as well as option for custom pistol grip will make the weapon much more user friendly.

Ulick said:

Are these guys PAP?

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There is no confirmation of that. Those guys are taking part in a training session hosted by a training company who have former PAP officers as instructors. Because of that, they theoretically can be PAP officers who got approval from the higher ups to take part in the course. But I highly doubt that. They are most likely SWAT officers.

hsinchong said:

Does anyone know if these are legit Team Wendy Exfil's, Aimpoint Comp M4, Steiner DBAL's, Manta Strobe & Crye Tropic held by the PAP? I wonder if they are copies.

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There have been pictures of PAP and pre-reform officers using equipment that looks reminscent of Western equipment (check the other related threads for that), but definitely not Team Wendy Exfils and Crye Tropic clothing.

LCR34 said:

I do think if Type 95 have detachable handguard option to enable keymod handguard as well as option for custom pistol grip will make the weapon much more user friendly.

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The QBZ 95's handguard is split between the upper and lower receivers, and its pistol grip is part of the lower receiver and can't be detached. If you want those parts to be replaceable, significant modifications have to be done to accommodate those changes to the point in which the entire assembly procedure and equipment have to change. You might as well make a new rifle.

LawLeadsToPeace said:

There is no confirmation of that. Those guys are taking part in a training session hosted by a training company who have former PAP officers as instructors. Because of that, they theoretically can be PAP officers who got approval from the higher ups to take part in the course. But I highly doubt that. They are most likely SWAT officers.

There have been pictures of PAP and pre-reform officers using equipment that looks reminscent of Western equipment (check the other related threads for that), but definitely not Team Wendy Exfils and Crye Tropic clothing.

The QBZ 95's handguard is split between the upper and lower receivers, and its pistol grip is part of the lower receiver and can't be detached. If you want those parts to be replaceable, significant modifications have to be done to accommodate those changes to the point in which the entire assembly procedure and equipment have to change. You might as well make a new rifle.

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Can be done, just look at how AK family make do with handguard. Just skeletonize the front part then place keymod sleeve over. Same for the pistol grip. No need to design new rifle. Just change the injection mould.

LCR34 said:

I do think if Type 95 have detachable handguard option to enable keymod handguard as well as option for custom pistol grip will make the weapon much more user friendly.

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We have whole pages on that idea, however generally it seems that the BIG Army of the PLA don’t seem interested. The QBZ97 civil modifications show what could have been don’t to the system. If the PLA brass had decided to introduce a third major redesign.
Yet it seem the modernization concept the PLA decided on favors a clean sheet in the form of the QBZ191.

LCR34 said:

Can be done, just look at how AK family make do with handguard. Just skeletonize the front part then place keymod sleeve over. Same for the pistol grip. No need to design new rifle. Just change the injection mould.

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The AK still has a ton of issues on adding rails. In the case of the QBZ95 though the main body is almost completely one or two pieces of polymer. It would have required a major redesign.

To be fair when QBZ95 was designed the History of the M1913 rail system was in its exceptionally early development stages too. The two programs really both start in 1989, they both really launch by 1992. Which was a dramatically different time period.
The Internet wasn’t a big thing yet. Cell phones were the size of Bricks and the Cold War had thawed Iraq was . For a rifle of the 1980’s QBZ95 would have been fine. For the early 1990s it was fine. At that point in time only a hand full of National armies used optics. The British Susat and American ACOG started about 1988, the Aimpoints were around but not combat rifles yet. The most proven combat sights in those days were on sniper rifles or old school occluded eye sights which were in very specialized use on military rifles since the 1970s. Laser Products Corporation was a just starting in the 1980s and mounting an AR15 with a laser sight was well… Yeah that was still fairly new technology. In 1991 though things started to change. Laser products would become Surefire and the huge set up above became more like an a flashlight.
Trijicon optics were being trialed by Socom By 1993 SF teams are using optics in limited types, By 1994 the “Picatinny rail” has been developed by ARMS from the Weiver rail for the SOPMOD program. With M4 starting to field well in China QBZ95 is almost ready for initial production. By 1997 The first appearance on the world stage for the QBZ95 in the hand over of Hong Kong. The Norinco had apparently made provisions for mounting an optic down the road. But in 97 with the G36 you suddenly had a hard showing that optics were going to be the norm along with rail systems. I mean it came out with not one optic but two a fixed power 3x with a dot over the top.
9/11 happened and the US DOD rapidly went from irons to optics, hand guard to RIS.
The PLA made updates but other kit and gear needed updates and the Planed updates only get so much attention and industry base. Not to mention other things like digitization, the rise of the armored infantry, and more. The PLA gave the QBZ95 upgrades and updates but the want was to standardize on the 5.8mm and phase out residual 7.62x39mm in the largest army in the world.
The QBZ95 was designed for an army that was banking on moving to a mounted infantry centric force. The PLA it seems like mostly saw optics and accessories as stuff for Asymmetric fighting. The PRC didn’t have the industrial base yet for it. So they were taking a wait and see. By 2010 they decided to start a major upgrade series with the QBZ95-1 to address concerns about the ammunition and selector switch as well as some other improvements yet it doesn’t seem to go system wide. That might just be as the PLA even with size reduction is still titanic and giant organizations move slowly.
Keymod pops up in about 2012 but… it’s a failure. In testing and industry M-Lok had a longer development time between 2007-2014 and has taken the industry. By 2014 Norinco and the like are starting work on what became the QBZ191.