PLA Next Generation Main Battle Tank

RichardGao

Junior Member
Registered Member
According to the Weibo poster, the PLA is actively exploring man-machine interfaces that greatly increase tank crews' situational awareness. Helmet-mounted displays are also being looked into.
49802510227_abbb064623_o_d.jpg
From a declassified paper. I remember it was about full-electric transmission testing or some sort. I don't remember things well.
 

RichardGao

Junior Member
Registered Member
201 Institute is exploring the possibilities of a seven roadwheel testbed with hydraulic suspensions. Probably used on a lighter-weight chassis of the 4th gen. (well below 50 tons compared to 99A's 55.) The testbed, should be the one mentioned above. Also certain CG concepts of the 4th gen have also been released on a 201-institute-owned magazine, revealling a seven roadwheel chassis and 2 crew members. IMO the 7 roadwheeler is still just a concept and doesn't necessarily mean that the eventual 4th gen would really be so. Same goes for 2 crew members.
 

RichardGao

Junior Member
Registered Member
The tracks on the 7 wheel test bed shown above seems fairly narrow. This suggest the vehicle is lighter than might be expected of a 60+ ton main battle tank, unless the Chinese are going light with their next generation tank.
Lightweight has always been an important factor of Chinese tank design. Since we have such complicated terrain (mountainous regions in the south and especially Taiwan, muddy rice-fieldy terrain in the east, high altitude plateaus in war-active places like tibet and deserts in the north.) Chief designers of Type 15 and 99A 李春明 and 毛明 have both emphasized the need for weight reduction when designing tanks. After all lightweight improves both tactical and strategic mobility, awa better transport capacity and the ability to fight with ease in difficult terrain, as tanks were designed to do. Quicker deployment has always turned out to be quite important. Making supertanks like the Maus or IS-7 after all turns out to be both not necessary and not useful, the rule of which still fits modern tanks. Plus lighter weight also means a lighter burden for the suspension, which has always been China's weakpoint. (for eg. the 99A which uses a self-invented semi-active hydraulic-torsion bar suspension and is not so reliable. The type 15 uses an improved design of the concept and because it is also lightweight, quite reliable.) Another quote from Type 99's chief designer 祝榆生, (I have to say this he is a very respectable old man) "技术先敌应用,系统取胜,功能覆盖", which is basically "Use new technologies before the enemy, win through system, and cover multiple functions." On 99 these refer respectively to the laser sight suppression system, using both the 99 and the 96 to fulfill varied tactical needs, and the ability to anti-tank with large caliber HE frag. IMO the design of the 4th gen is still correctly following these rules.
 

free_6ix9ine

Junior Member
Registered Member
Lightweight has always been an important factor of Chinese tank design. Since we have such complicated terrain (mountainous regions in the south and especially Taiwan, muddy rice-fieldy terrain in the east, high altitude plateaus in war-active places like tibet and deserts in the north.) Chief designers of Type 15 and 99A 李春明 and 毛明 have both emphasized the need for weight reduction when designing tanks. After all lightweight improves both tactical and strategic mobility, awa better transport capacity and the ability to fight with ease in difficult terrain, as tanks were designed to do. Quicker deployment has always turned out to be quite important. Making supertanks like the Maus or IS-7 after all turns out to be both not necessary and not useful, the rule of which still fits modern tanks. Plus lighter weight also means a lighter burden for the suspension, which has always been China's weakpoint. (for eg. the 99A which uses a self-invented semi-active hydraulic-torsion bar suspension and is not so reliable. The type 15 uses an improved design of the concept and because it is also lightweight, quite reliable.) Another quote from Type 99's chief designer 祝榆生, (I have to say this he is a very respectable old man) "技术先敌应用,系统取胜,功能覆盖", which is basically "Use new technologies before the enemy, win through system, and cover multiple functions." On 99 these refer respectively to the laser sight suppression system, using both the 99 and the 96 to fulfill varied tactical needs, and the ability to anti-tank with large caliber HE frag. IMO the design of the 4th gen is still correctly following these rules.

Better question to ask, are tanks all that relevant for China? Any scenario of war with the US will be some sort of naval or air engagement or missile attack. We should invest our resources into developing even faster hypersonic+ (mach 50) missiles, 6th gen aircraft, better jet engines, and deadly unmanned attack submarines. The type 99 and 96 tanks are sufficient for the foreseeable future.
 

RichardGao

Junior Member
Registered Member
Better question to ask, are tanks all that relevant for China? Any scenario of war with the US will be some sort of naval or air engagement or missile attack. We should invest our resources into developing even faster hypersonic+ (mach 50) missiles, 6th gen aircraft, better jet engines, and deadly unmanned attack submarines. The type 99 and 96 tanks are sufficient for the foreseeable future.
Why do all wars of China be necessarily with the US? Does it mean we can just use strategic forces if in conflict with India or taking down Taiwan? Tanks are obviously a necessity for China, as for any country else.
 

RichardGao

Junior Member
Registered Member
Better question to ask, are tanks all that relevant for China? Any scenario of war with the US will be some sort of naval or air engagement or missile attack. We should invest our resources into developing even faster hypersonic+ (mach 50) missiles, 6th gen aircraft, better jet engines, and deadly unmanned attack submarines. The type 99 and 96 tanks are sufficient for the foreseeable future.
BTW Mach 50 is basically impossible.
 

RichardGao

Junior Member
Registered Member
Better question to ask, are tanks all that relevant for China? Any scenario of war with the US will be some sort of naval or air engagement or missile attack. We should invest our resources into developing even faster hypersonic+ (mach 50) missiles, 6th gen aircraft, better jet engines, and deadly unmanned attack submarines. The type 99 and 96 tanks are sufficient for the foreseeable future.
And, no they aren't sufficient. Both Europe and America are developing their own new 4th gen tanks and who knows who might buy them. Plus if India is smart enough they might even purchase Armatas in a couple of years. If we don't make new tanks, we still might lose. Aft all no war at present is so big, they're more local and the conflict is smaller instead in a US-China war scenario. (Which is basically impossible, leaders of both sides aren't that reckless.) Taking down Taiwan is still a very important mission for China and we should always be prepared for Unification by Force. Tanks will then be of great use.
 

Skywatcher

Captain
Lightweight has always been an important factor of Chinese tank design. Since we have such complicated terrain (mountainous regions in the south and especially Taiwan, muddy rice-fieldy terrain in the east, high altitude plateaus in war-active places like tibet and deserts in the north.) Chief designers of Type 15 and 99A 李春明 and 毛明 have both emphasized the need for weight reduction when designing tanks. After all lightweight improves both tactical and strategic mobility, awa better transport capacity and the ability to fight with ease in difficult terrain, as tanks were designed to do. Quicker deployment has always turned out to be quite important. Making supertanks like the Maus or IS-7 after all turns out to be both not necessary and not useful, the rule of which still fits modern tanks. Plus lighter weight also means a lighter burden for the suspension, which has always been China's weakpoint. (for eg. the 99A which uses a self-invented semi-active hydraulic-torsion bar suspension and is not so reliable. The type 15 uses an improved design of the concept and because it is also lightweight, quite reliable.) Another quote from Type 99's chief designer 祝榆生, (I have to say this he is a very respectable old man) "技术先敌应用,系统取胜,功能覆盖", which is basically "Use new technologies before the enemy, win through system, and cover multiple functions." On 99 these refer respectively to the laser sight suppression system, using both the 99 and the 96 to fulfill varied tactical needs, and the ability to anti-tank with large caliber HE frag. IMO the design of the 4th gen is still correctly following these rules.
The tank could be designed to have capacity for increases in protection as needed (an additional 20-25% in add on armor).
 

RichardGao

Junior Member
Registered Member
The tank could be designed to have capacity for increases in protection as needed (an additional 20-25% in add on armor).
Indeed. But not as much as 20% IMO, probably more like 3 tons as of the Type 15's basic and reinforced version. I'm quite confident that China can make the 4th gen as well protected frontally as 99A with a weight of roughly 40 tons. Then only side protection needs to be strengthened. (Probably frontal protection still needs to be upgraded after all we need roughly 850KE to be fully immune against munitions at that time)
 

free_6ix9ine

Junior Member
Registered Member
And, no they aren't sufficient. Both Europe and America are developing their own new 4th gen tanks and who knows who might buy them. Plus if India is smart enough they might even purchase Armatas in a couple of years. If we don't make new tanks, we still might lose. Aft all no war at present is so big, they're more local and the conflict is smaller instead in a US-China war scenario. (Which is basically impossible, leaders of both sides aren't that reckless.) Taking down Taiwan is still a very important mission for China and we should always be prepared for Unification by Force. Tanks will then be of great use.

Tanks for mountain combat in the Himalayas? I think we should make peace with India. Because the US is our most dangerous adversary. Besides, airpower will nullify any advantages in tank technology. Instead of developing 4th gen tanks we should continuously upgrade our current inventory.

I'm passionate about hypersonic missiles and even scramjet powered space planes is that it's the type of technology that acts as a massive force multiplier.

A space plane powered by a combination scram jet and conventional turbine engine could accurately bombard enemy positions at hypersonic speeds, which makes it impervious to enemy air defense and outrun US a2a missiles which means the F-35 is completely useless against such an aircraft.

This is a much larger force multiplier than 4th gen tanks. If we dominate the air, we dominate the battle space.
 
Top