PLA Next Generation Main Battle Tank

Builder said:

In the case of a 105 mm gun, hopefully not a standaard/conventional one because newer western tanks evolve even to 130 mm! So what I want to say is let this 105 mm gun use new technology such as electromagnetic or something else.

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I'm not actually sure where the 105mm myth even comes from, it doesn't make much sense even if 105mm can reach 125/120mm penetration numbers. Tanks these days rarely fight against other tanks hence what is more important is anti-infrastructure, anti-infantry and anti-IFV/light vehicles etc, all of these requires HE/MP shells with high amount of explosive filler which require large caliber shells. Most likely not anything like 130mm/140mm but no reason to change from 125mm.

00CuriousObserver said:

Some rumours on the MBT:

Unmanned turret, two-person crew, hybrid chassis, suspected 105mm gun, almost no armor—relies on active protection, highly digitized, strong situational awareness

This thing is indeed quite outrageous, but based on its current state, it hasn't reached the prototype installation phase yet and is still in the testing stage. The full system is expected to be similar to the U.S. Army's FCS (Future Combat Systems), integrating tanks, infantry fighting vehicles, self-propelled artillery, and other army equipment onto a unified chassis platform. Once the whole system enters service, it will bring major changes to the existing ground strike systems of both the army and even the marine corps.

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I'm really tired of fighting 120mm APFSDS

I honestly think that HEAT and .50 MGs from different types and orientations are the most common threats to vehicles on the battlefield.

Of course, being able to survive after MK258 is a bonus if possible.

All the fancy "active defence" measures will be for nought in the face of an old school sustained 155mm bombardment. Shell fragments will damage all the optics and electronics such measures rely on.

Maikeru said:

All the fancy "active defence" measures will be for nought in the face of an old school sustained 155mm bombardment. Shell fragments will damage all the optics and electronics such measures rely on.

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The same is true for current MBTs with thicker armor. Indirect 105mm shells can also damage their APS

We are all viewing it as a platform.

But if you read carefully, whats being talked about is a whole new system.

105mm is just one vehicle part of a larger overall system. There could be dedicated long range ATGM firing vehicles and so on. Dedicated APS vehicles, all supported by multiple drones of various sizes etc.

We are focusing on one platform, which is going to be part of overall next gen system, that will include many other vehicles, unmanned armed and unarmed vehicles and UAVs, armed and unarmed

Tomboy said:

I'm not actually sure where the 105mm myth even comes from, it doesn't make much sense even if 105mm can reach 125/120mm penetration numbers. Tanks these days rarely fight against other tanks hence what is more important is anti-infrastructure, anti-infantry and anti-IFV/light vehicles etc, all of these requires HE/MP shells with high amount of explosive filler which require large caliber shells. Most likely not anything like 130mm/140mm but no reason to change from 125mm.

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A benefit I can think of is that you can hold more ammo now. Future artillery and other vehicles may handle the big gun roles where they can safely fire and store enough ammo without running out in 20 or less shots. a 105mm HE will still destroy most things. 125mm HE may be overkill and wasteful if you're just trying to shoot a light armored vehicle or some dude behind a wall that a 105 can handle already. It's not like a 125mm HE will somehow destroy 5 vehicles in one shot. Might as well stick to the 105mm that can fulfill the same role but store more ammo.

Ok guys, you made your point. But if tank vs tank battles are rare in the near future, why then do the Germans in Europe decide to move to 130 mm tank gun? That’s an awesome firepower! The only way to make 105 mm more competitive is by using a new kind of technology I.e. electromagnetic or etc gun tech, then you can store more ammo and have good firepower!

Builder said:

Ok guys, you made your point. But if tank vs tank battles are rare in the near future, why then do the Germans in Europe decide to move to 130 mm tank gun? That’s an awesome firepower! The only way to make 105 mm more competitive is by using a new kind of technology I.e. electromagnetic or etc gun tech, then you can store more ammo and have good firepower!

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1. Germany, or whatever other European nation, has its war doctrine that suits themselves. China will do what's best suited for China.
2. If the rumor that the new tank is a unifying platform, then a future higher caliber cannon will most likely exist.
3. It was also rumored a couple of years ago that the new tank would use ETC. I also saw some articles regarding electromagnetic as well, but that's not conclusive.

Builder said:

Ok guys, you made your point. But if tank vs tank battles are rare in the near future, why then do the Germans in Europe decide to move to 130 mm tank gun? That’s an awesome firepower! The only way to make 105 mm more competitive is by using a new kind of technology I.e. electromagnetic or etc gun tech, then you can store more ammo and have good firepower!

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Here's my thoughts. Europeans have different requirements for their tanks and different doctrines. They aim to fight the Russians who currently are using T-90Ms and "theoretically" the T14 Armata, both of which are pretty heavily armored. So atleast in the short term, they need something that can punch through these things. I think they started going for the 130 and 140mm before Ukraine showed the world how important drones really were. They also have the space to use big guns. Look at the 140mm Leclerc or the Panther KF51. They're massive and weigh almost 60 tons (and they STILL hold less than 20 rounds). But they don't need to care too much about weight since they plan on operating on the flat terrain between them and Russia.

From what I know China doesn't plan on fighting expeditionary wars on other continents. Their tanks are mainly for defence of the mainland (which probably has the most tank-unfriendly terrain on earth unless you count the northern and western borders which don't have any hostile enemies at the moment) and possibly fighting on pacific islands. These tanks MUST be light. It's not possible to viably fit a massive gun on a small tank and have enough ammo to be viable.

China is probably the only country on the planet that can legitimately fart out a million drones like it's your average Tuesday. That and their very strong artillery regiments, huge amounts of ATGMs, and scary terrain is already more than enough to deal with enemy tanks. Honestly, this probably makes China the most hostile place to tanks on Earth.

Also, I remember reading somewhere in this thread that the 105mm could be an ETC gun that'll boost the 105 to 125 levels of penetration.

Thanks for your comments Guys. I really appreciate. The only thing I can say is we Will see what will come in the very near future!