From the sound of it, don't sound like a real fight. If this is a real fight, blue would have won the day. The H-6s would be all shot down before it could launch the SEAD mission and destroy the SAMs...10 minutes later., HQ-9 already has a lock on them for god sakes.
PLA AEW&C, SIGINT, EW and MPA thread
- Thread starter Sczepan
- Start date
From the sound of it, don't sound like a real fight. If this is a real fight, blue would have won the day. The H-6s would be all shot down before it could launch the SEAD mission and destroy the SAMs...10 minutes later., HQ-9 already has a lock on them for god sakes.
plawolf
Lieutenant General
I think you misunderstood. The commentor said that 10 minutes after taking out the SAM site, the flight came under EW attack. That 10 minutes had nothing to do with how long it took them to respond to the SAM threat.
Although it was worrying that they relied on the AWACS to detect the SAM site, as you would have hoped that the planes would be carrying EW suits able to do that from analysing the radar emissions from the SAMs. But from the pictures, those looked like pretty old H6s, so its not really a surprise they had not been equipped with the latest electronics.
ladioussupp
Junior Member
The round the clock training broke multiple PLAAF AWACS records in range, operation intensity, and endurance time.
thunderchief
Senior Member
SAM crew supposed to be trained to keep their emissions to a minimum until enemy gets into the range . You would turn on your EW observation radar(s) occasionally to get broad picture , and keep your tracking radars off until the last minute . You could setup cheap decoy emitters to fool enemy SEAD&DEAD forces .
HQ-9 is very advanced (and expensive
) SAM system , it would be very unfortunate to lose them in real war in such a manner described here .
plawolf
Lieutenant General
SAM crew supposed to be trained to keep their emissions to a minimum until enemy gets into the range . You would turn on your EW observation radar(s) occasionally to get broad picture , and keep your tracking radars off until the last minute . You could setup cheap decoy emitters to fool enemy SEAD&DEAD forces .
HQ-9 is very advanced (and expensive
Well, they might have shown HQ9s, but CCTV is not known for its accuracy and consistency when it comes to what it uses to illustrate the message. They might have had a camera crew at the air base to get some shots, but I seriously doubt they bothered to send someone hundreds of miles away to get a 5 second shot of SAMs for a 90 second clip.
Looking at the aircraft type (early H6 bombers) and the escort (a single Flanker for a dozen bombers), this was very much a second, maybe even third tier bomber unit. The whole exercise seemed more geared to giving them a taste of integrated ops with fighter and AWACS support rather than trying to be realistic. It would be pretty bad for moral if the unit kept getting obliterated without any chance to do much about it, as would almost certainly happen if they tries to penetrate a HQ9 defence perimeter against a competent crew.
To give you an idea of how outdated the bombers were, the AWACS had to pass on the targeting info to ground control to relay to the bombers as their systems were evidently too ancient to datalink with the AWACS. Although I question whether it would not have been quicker and more efficient for the AWACS to pass the coordinates for the SAM site directly to the bombers rather than the extra step of going through ground control. Unless the bombers so so ancient their radios are not even compatible with those on the AWACS?!
thunderchief
Senior Member
Well , it is possible that H-6s in question didn't have datalink with AWACS , but I really doubt they couldn't communicate over radio . Large aircraft (like H-6 and KJ-2000) have multiple radio-sets , so they could contact even civilian or foreign military aircraft if the need arises .
More likely reason (in my mind at least
) is that communication with AWACS could not be encrypted , or that one AWACS (from one location) was not enough to pinpoint exact location of SAMs . Signal analysis is very hard thing to do , and usually you would need multiple receivers to triangulate one source of emission . In this case , maybe AWACS passed what information they had to GC , bombers passed what they have picked up , AWACS then moved a bit and measured again , and finally GC was able to calculate position of SAMs with certain accuracy .SAM crew supposed to be trained to keep their emissions to a minimum until enemy gets into the range . You would turn on your EW observation radar(s) occasionally to get broad picture , and keep your tracking radars off until the last minute . You could setup cheap decoy emitters to fool enemy SEAD&DEAD forces .
HQ-9 is very advanced (and expensive
Exactly, that's why I think this is more like a staged show rather a real train. The Red side always wins, somehow. I though China has gone past this...
The Red side doesn't always win - unless there's a journalist present
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
Kind of advantage the AWACS can give a field army, the use of AWACS coming into play now with the Chinese military
I think after the last two ZDK-03 are delivered to the PAF there should be a follow up order for a further 2-4 aircraft to total 6 aircraft, if they perform well and give the military the advantage they need they would be very valuable assets
A modern AWACS is a flying radar station that can see land, air and sea and pass that information to its surrounding assets in a secure way, the information sent gives the receiver a early warning advantage, win win for all
Y-9 platform is also pretty good, they would be good candidates for PAF transport fleet, getting 12 such aircraft would give a petty good air lift capability and lift the entire PAF Special Services Wing
I think after the last two ZDK-03 are delivered to the PAF there should be a follow up order for a further 2-4 aircraft to total 6 aircraft, if they perform well and give the military the advantage they need they would be very valuable assets
A modern AWACS is a flying radar station that can see land, air and sea and pass that information to its surrounding assets in a secure way, the information sent gives the receiver a early warning advantage, win win for all
Y-9 platform is also pretty good, they would be good candidates for PAF transport fleet, getting 12 such aircraft would give a petty good air lift capability and lift the entire PAF Special Services Wing