Natural disasters thread

[Bellum_Romanum]

Hey @Mr T I mean isn't this American fella disgusting for harassing this media fella, journalist/opinion maker, Tucker Carlson. What an outrage huh..

How about this lady here getting accosted by frustrated Americans

And check this dude out, getting arrested while reporting the riot/protest happening in the U.S. last year. What happened to your so called "Free Press" as covered by the 1st amendment of your country's U.S. constitution?

 

[vincent]

I don't think they're plain clothes police, but that doesn't mean they have good intentions.

There's a YouTube video

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of a person trying to talk about the flood. She was a survivor talking about how she was lucky to escape and lots of other people died. As she was talking some arsehole intervened to shut her up, going on about the foreign media and China being "smeared". You can see how she just shuts down. She's not "heroically" being quiet to "save China's reputation", she's being bullied in public and is clearly distressed.

I expect those people going after the international media in China are like the arsehole from the video. They don't care about the victims or their families, they're just gits who want to divert attention from the tragedy because they're more interested in protecting an image of their country that they have in their heads. As if China is the only country in the world to face flooding and have people die, and that if there's a transparent public discussion some tragedy will befall the PRC on the international stage.

It doesn't matter if they're doing it of their own initiative or they're part of some neighbourhood committee that's received orders

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, it's disgusting behaviour. It's to be expected for the Chinese media

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to shift coverage from the dead to recovery. It also not unsurprising for the local authorities to try to hide the flower memorials - well done to the locals for ripping the walls down by the way. But there's no excuse for people to bully those who just want to talk about what happened to them or their relatives. People like that should be ashamed of themselves.

Search up 人肉馒头. You are full of it

 

[Mr T]

I have yet to read anything from you where you can actually showcase the objective advantages of the system you so desperately want for China to have and be governed with.

I haven't discussed changing China's political system, not least because that appears to be irrelevant to the treatment of survivors and victims' families. The only way it could be relevant is if the CCP is giving orders not just to the media/social media to censor discussion that isn't focused on recovery efforts, but also instructing people to go around and harrass anyone who wants to speak out.

I'm perfectly willing to assume that the people in the videos causing trouble are local busybodies and not following instructions. But that doesn't make their behaviour any more acceptable. In fact it makes it worse, because they're choosing to put their own nationalism/arsehole attitudes above those who are in need.

Pointing out the number of deaths would from a once in a millennium flood for the people in Zhengzhou and the province of Henan will do exactly what?

It ensures that the victims are remembered as individuals because they can then be named. That pays them the appropriate amount of respect. Whereas if the number is capped then they can't all be named, because immediately people will say "but my [relative] also died" and the figure can be disputed.

It also ensures that the families of the dead can easily come together to seek mutual support because they're able to say "hey, I also lost someone". If there are limits on discussions of who died, it's not possible to seek support from one another, because 500 families getting together would immediately contradict the official story that less than 100 people died.

Or to put it another way, people trying to silence discussion of who and how many died makes China look way worse in the international sphere than if there was transparency. As I mentioned earlier, other countries have terrible floods. The idea that China or the CCP cannot weather foreigners knowing how many people died is a joke. If anything, I expect the sensitivity over the subject is actually over the domestic audience and a concern that there might be widespread outrage amongst Chinese people if it was admitted that several hundred people had died whilst the tragedy was fresh in people's minds.

Irrespective of the reason for official attempts to control the discussion, as I said private citizens victimising survivors or harrassing those that are trying to listen to them are disgusting individuals.

 

[OppositeDay]

There has also been coverage of Germany's failure to address CO2 emissions. For example, there was a recent

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about how the floods are forcing the German political elite to confront the issue. See this

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from earlier in the year on how the German courts have ruled Germany's proposals are damaging the future of German children, or even this Bloomberg article

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.

Besides, I would be appalled if non-Chinese journalists are being held to a higher standard than Chinese citizens when it comes to showing empathy over Chinese people dying. You can expect journalists to sometimes emphasis the bad rather than the good, but there is no excuse for anyone victimising a survivor for wanting to talk about their story.

The guy in the video is quite literally bullying the survivor in public. He's not trying to politely pull her aside and ask if she might reconsider talking in public because of various reasons. He has zero compassion, and his attitude is the same as the people in the videos having a go at the DW journalist.



Well given that Chinese social media is now censoring a lot of discussion of the flooding, especially where it might threaten the CCP's narrative over how many died, where do you expect the victims and their families to talk about this if not on the streets to anyone who wants to listen?

Not really. Just because he acted rushly doesn't mean he didn't care about the survivors. The most he can be accused of is lacking a bit of self-control.

I see no reason to doubt "CCP's narrative over how many died", so your promise that normal discussion has been censored is questionable. Controlling conspiracy theories and misinformation is not the same as censoring normal discussion.

Many people in my extended family live in Zhengzhou, and there's non-stop discussion in the family WeChat group about the flooding. My Australian uncle has been able to post all the nonsense he read on Facebook. The idea that people have no one to talk to other than random strangers on the street is just absurd.

 

[Arcgem]

There has also been coverage of Germany's failure to address CO2 emissions. For example, there was a recent

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

about how the floods are forcing the German political elite to confront the issue. See this

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from earlier in the year on how the German courts have ruled Germany's proposals are damaging the future of German children, or even this Bloomberg article

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.

Tone-deaf as usual. Even a halfwit should be able to recognize those articles portray the German government in a more sympathetic light, as the "victim" of climate change rather than it making a cold calculated decision to put the economy before the environment and its people.

Or to put it another way, people trying to silence discussion of who and how many died makes China look way worse in the international sphere than if there was transparency. As I mentioned earlier, other countries have terrible floods. The idea that China or the CCP cannot weather foreigners knowing how many people died is a joke. If anything, I expect the sensitivity over the subject is actually over the domestic audience and a concern that there might be widespread outrage amongst Chinese people if it was admitted that several hundred people had died whilst the tragedy was fresh in people's minds.

There is no concern about domestic outrage. It is natural for the Chinese people to be outraged about how foreign outlets are milking this recent tragedy for their readership and sponsors, all in the name of "transparency".

This "sensitivity" is simply to deny those leeches of that opportunity. Of course this would make China look worse to them.

 

[Mr T]

Not really. Just because he acted rushly doesn't mean he didn't care about the survivors.

It's conceivable he may care a little bit, but his behaviour makes it unlikely he has that much compassion. He didn't just say one thing, he went on a rant until the poor person walked off crying. His aim was to silence her. You don't do that because you're "rash", you do it because you're an arsehole who has little or no compassion.

I see no reason to doubt "CCP's narrative over how many died", so your promise that normal discussion has been censored is questionable. Controlling conspiracy theories and misinformation is not the same as censoring normal discussion.

Well the fact that CDT reported the

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to follow official statistics and not try to independently assess the numbers of dead is a good signpost.

Moreover it's clear to anyone with an open mind that the authorites are trying to move the discussion on, which is reflected in what the Chinese media is mostly saying right now.

Many people in my extended family live in Zhengzhou, and there's non-stop discussion in the family WeChat group about the flooding.

Yeah, there's a reason why they're able to do that - it's a small, closed WeChat group. If your relatives tried posting public messages disputing the official death toll on Weibo, I'm sure they'd get deleted quickly.

Tone-deaf as usual. Even a halfwit should be able to recognize those articles portray the German government in a more sympathetic light, as the "victim" of climate change rather than it making a cold calculated decision to put the economy before the environment and its people.

Yeah, I don't think you actually read the articles, not least because two of them were from before the floods and one of those was a critical decision from Germany's highest court of the German government's policies.

There is no concern about domestic outrage. It is natural for the Chinese people to be outraged about how foreign outlets are milking this recent tragedy for their readership and sponsors, all in the name of "transparency".

This "sensitivity" is simply to deny those leeches of that opportunity. Of course this would make China look worse to them.

I disagree. The "outrage" against the international media is largely artificial and deliberately whipped up by nationalists whose sympathy for the victims is contingent on China looking good internationally.

Besides, even if there was genuine concern about international reporting, harrassment and victimising survivors is still unacceptable. You can protest peacefully or respectfully question people about their motives, whether their reporting is fair, etc. That's not what's happened recently.

Anyway, I've given my views on the matter. If someone else wants to post a further rebuttal I don't mind.

 

[Bellum_Romanum]

It's conceivable he may care a little bit, but his behaviour makes it unlikely he has that much compassion. He didn't just say one thing, he went on a rant until the poor person walked off crying. His aim was to silence her. You don't do that because you're "rash", you do it because you're an arsehole who has little or no compassion.


Well the fact that CDT reported the

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to follow official statistics and not try to independently assess the numbers of dead is a good signpost.

Moreover it's clear to anyone with an open mind that the authorites are trying to move the discussion on, which is reflected in what the Chinese media is mostly saying right now.


Yeah, there's a reason why they're able to do that - it's a small, closed WeChat group. If your relatives tried posting public messages disputing the official death toll on Weibo, I'm sure they'd get deleted quickly.


Yeah, I don't think you actually read the articles, not least because two of them were from before the floods and one of those was a critical decision from Germany's highest court of the German government's policies.


I disagree. The "outrage" against the international media is largely artificial and deliberately whipped up by nationalists whose sympathy for the victims is contingent on China looking good internationally.

Besides, even if there was genuine concern about international reporting, harrassment and victimising survivors is still unacceptable. You can protest peacefully or respectfully question people about their motives, whether their reporting is fair, etc. That's not what's happened recently.

Anyway, I've given my views on the matter. If someone else wants to post a further rebuttal I don't mind.

Besides, even if there was genuine concern about international reporting, harrassment and victimising survivors is still unacceptable. You can protest peacefully or respectfully question people about their motives, whether their reporting is fair, etc. That's not what's happened recently.

Lol are you reading yourself well here bud? You can harangue all you want but what you wrote here pretty much contravenes and contradicts what you have been singing for us Chinese and China to do in terms of "exercising our rights to free speech." But I guess us Chinese people must conform to the free speech dictum and style according to an American meddle. Basically free Speech with America characteristics.

You can protest peacefully or respectfully question people about their motives, whether their reporting is fair, etc. That's not what's happened recently.

The premise that the Chinese people must abide and act under western precepts of decorum on how to address and express their outrage from sensationalist, slanderous, fact-free and ideologically riddled stories from the propagandists calling themselves "journalists" is outright hilarious. Chinese people will react and act towards outsiders as we see fit and will not be cowed by or molded by westerners. If you don't like it, too bad so sad.

Yeah, I don't think you actually read the articles, not least because two of them were from before the floods and one of those was a critical decision from Germany's highest court of the German government's policies.

Any examples to prove or back up your nonsensical and fake news assertion? Or is your belief that your words are as good as gold and must be trusted because you're not a commie? Lol Come on man, you have to do better than that.

 

[Arcgem]

What such simpletons fail to acknowledge is that all of those critical takes on Germany, from both high and low places, stop short of implying that the German government is institutionally flawed and should be reformed. Not "voting out" reformed, but "revolution" reformed. The former is just political wrangling from opposition parties. The latter will get you investigated, if not booted out entirely.

Bad-faith journalism deserves zero respect, and the reporters who participate in it are accordingly shoved aside like those from any other tabloid press.

 

[taxiya]

You can protest peacefully or respectfully question people about their motives, whether their reporting is fair, etc. That's not what's happened recently.

A habitual liar does not deserve respect. No honest answer can be received from a habitual liar. Demanding "peaceful protest" is defending the "right of lie".

In this case, the German media is the habitual liar. Why? Go back and check the controversy of "Zhang Danhong being fired by DW". DW fired her for speaking some positive things about China, she was deemed not "China bashing" enough. This kind of media has determined to be liars (only telling one side of story).

 

[taxiya]

Well the fact that CDT reported the

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to follow official statistics and not try to independently assess the numbers of dead is a good signpost.

"independent assessment" is the alternative name for "fabrication and lies". Except official statistics gathered from hospitals and rescue services, who else is possibly able to get a number close to the truth?

How does a western "journalist" randomly interviewing people on the street and making a "report" reach an "independent assessment"?