My idea of a modern PLAAF's combat fleet

About 60 years ago, the US was behind UK in jet aircraft and rocket/missile R&D. The US had to pay UK to license RR jet engines, and hire ex-Nazi scientists to work on its rocket program. The US was also unable to produce satisfactory VTOL aircraft and paid UK to license and further develop the Harrier.

Moving forward to 2006, today the UK has to pay US $2 billion USD to "jointly develop" the JSF, then have the US dictate "operational sovereignty" terms.

IMO the PRC should set a long-term goal to be just as successful. Right now the PLAAF still has a lot of learn from the Russians, so go ahead and pay them to buy whatever the PLAAF needs. Over time, "purchase" should become "joint development", and as PRC's technological level improves, and hopefully leapfrog both Russia and India in the future, it's not impossible to imagine a future scenario where Russia and India pays the PRC billions of dollars in a "joint fighter program" where most of the R&D is actually done in China, and the Russians complain over access to source-code.

Combat jet R&D has become very expensive. It'd be smart to leverage the financial resources of other countries, even in licensed production where you have to give away some technology. The more aircraft & parts you make, the better cost-per-unit ratio, and customer demand for parts and upgrades. The MiG-21 and F-16 are good examples.

adeptitus said:

About 60 years ago, the US was behind UK in jet aircraft and rocket/missile R&D. The US had to pay UK to license RR jet engines, and hire ex-Nazi scientists to work on its rocket program. The US was also unable to produce satisfactory VTOL aircraft and paid UK to license and further develop the Harrier.

Moving forward to 2006, today the UK has to pay US $2 billion USD to "jointly develop" the JSF, then have the US dictate "operational sovereignty" terms.

IMO the PRC should set a long-term goal to be just as successful. Right now the PLAAF still has a lot of learn from the Russians, so go ahead and pay them to buy whatever the PLAAF needs. Over time, "purchase" should become "joint development", and as PRC's technological level improves, and hopefully leapfrog both Russia and India in the future, it's not impossible to imagine a future scenario where Russia and India pays the PRC billions of dollars in a "joint fighter program" where most of the R&D is actually done in China, and the Russians complain over access to source-code.

Combat jet R&D has become very expensive. It'd be smart to leverage the financial resources of other countries, even in licensed production where you have to give away some technology. The more aircraft & parts you make, the better cost-per-unit ratio, and customer demand for parts and upgrades. The MiG-21 and F-16 are good examples.

Click to expand...

well, it seems that our disagreement is not over the approach of PRC, but rather the progress of PRC. I believe China in areas like electronics are already ahead of the Russians. And in areas like engines where China is really weak, the Russians really aren't that amazing either (they certainly are not at the level of GE, PW and RR). When Russians have already admitted that their 5th generation plane will initially fly with a AL-31 based engine, it makes you wonder what China has to gain from the Russians. What I'm saying is that China is at the stage where it can dictate the terms of a joint development. I don't think the Russians will be able to accept that. And the Indians certainly would not be able to do so.

The PLAAF needs to redirect all its research toward future J-10 variants. The current J-10's should be transitional only. The PLAAF needs to make 3 kinds of J-10's.

1) multirole, heavier Super-10's

2) navalized Super-10's

3) stealth optimized J-XX

That is the fastest way to catch up technologically.

Knowing that China is unlikely to retire all its old birds, and yet will operate many types of aircraft, I propose, for organisational and logistic purposes, a two-combat air force command system...+ 4 other branches each having their own command...of course everything at the end of the day falls back to central PLAAF command in Beijing

Each 'air force' will have its own command/responsibilities, etc, and these roles and functions will overlap...but ultimately, one will be better orientated for border/homeland defense in China's Northwest, while the more modern force will cover south, central, eastern and north eastern China...

This proposal is valid, as I've read so far...

a) Logistics would be terrible considering one air force...many types of aircraft
b) As someone said, no we don't need J10s and J11s patrolling borders in the far West
c) China's had a reputation of keeping old aircraft in reserves...why not place them in a more operational state to keep pilot hours up, but deploy them to the West where they won't place anymore strain on current PLAAF operations facing Taiwan


Here goes my proposal...


FIRST COMBAT AIR FORCE DIVIDE

Functions - offensive missions, medium range strike sorties, anti-ship, PGM delivery, air superiority, escort, defense of high valued assets from counter enemy attack, defense of ships and offensive ground forces from enemy air attack.

Equipment: 1050 combat aircraft, including 600 advanced multi-role fighters, and 450 strike aircraft with PGM capabilities.
300 J10
150 J11/A/B
150 Su-30MKK
150 JH7
300 Q5D/E/F (yes, arguably an obsolete design, but considering China's situation, I think it is quite capable as a lightweight PGM deliverer)

+ Support elements
IL-78 Tanker
AWACs, EW, ECM, AEW aircraft
Long range UAVs
JL-15 Advanced Trainer (or JL-9 - depending on who wins)
JL-8 Basic Trainer
Su-27UB Trainers

Coverage: Eastern, Central, North East China.
Facing...Taiwan, and potentially S.Korea, Japan.

Secondary Coverage: (units can deploy when needed) to Southern, South Western China.
Facing: India, Vietnam, ASEAN nations.



SECOND COMBAT AIR FORCE DIVIDE

Functions - homeland defense, border patrol, counter insurgency, limited strike and air superiority capabilities.

Equipment: 1150+ combat aircraft
50+ Su-27SK*
600 J7D/E/G
300 J8II/D/F/III
200 Q5B/D/E/F

*Su-27SKs are regarded, in terms of quality, lower than J11, and in my opinion, they should form the elite tier of this second air force divide. This only includes the Su-27SKs that were directly imported from Russia. Though this force is mostly for homeland defense, a small number of advanced long range fighters would be necessary if something did happen, and with a small force of Su-27SKs, at least they could hold the line for some time against any Indian or Russian air onslaught.

+ Support elements
H6U Tanker
JJ-7 Advanced jet trainer (until fully replaced or augmented by JL15/JL9)
JL-5 Basic jet trainer (until fully replaced by JL-8)

Coverage - Western, Northwest, Northern, and South West China.
Facing...India, Central Asia, Mongolia, Russia.

Secondary Coverage - Units can act as reserves or reinforcements and deployed to First Combat Air Force theaters if needed.



Further Divides - in addition to the 2 combat air commands, there should be 4other air commands...


BOMBER AND RECON COMMAND

* Responsibilities
Bomber - Long range strike, cruise missile delivery
Recon - Theater air based reconnaisance

* Coverage - Deployed at a home base somewhere in China, but will be deployed where needed. There will be a number of bases across China that could support this unit.

* Equipment
100 H6E/M
50-80 J-8IR and J-8IIR
Various ECM and command aircraft, including the Boeing 737s, Tu-154s, and JSTAR-type aircraft.



TRANSPORT COMMAND

* Functions - self explanatory, support of ground and air borne troops.

* Equipment
80+ Y8
40-45 IL76
40+ Y7
40+ Y9 (and eventually to replace Y8)
40+ New type of jet transport under development
200+ Y5 utility transport



TRAINING COMMAND

* sole nationwide training responsibilities, with specialized evaluation and basic training centres.


AIR DEFENSE COMMAND

* sole responsibility of managing and coordinating regions and nation-wide air defense operations, from AAA to SAM, and operation and defense of radars and command stations, bases, logistics, etc.





Accordingly, the Navy Air Force should follow suit, though on a far smaller scale...

COMBAT COMMAND - a rather reduced and more compactized naval aviation combat force, sole responsibility reduced to attack of enemy shipping, or support of naval combatants)
20+ H6D/M
24 Su30MK2 (and more if PLANAF buys more)
40 J8D (with H6DU in support)
100 J7E/G
150 JH7

MARITIME PATROL COMMAND - anti-submarine warfare responsibilities included.
Y8MPA
Y8J
Y8 AEW/ECM variants
Be-200/103
SH-5

SHIP-BORNE ELEMENTS
(Any aircraft carrier group)
Z9C
Z8
KA-28

TRAINING/TRANSPORT ELEMENTS