Miscellaneous News

Biscuits said:

Especially now that India is able to create nukes that could at least hit western China and Japan can probably create dirty bombs at very least.

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India's Agni-5 ICBM has an operational range of 7000-8000 kilometers. That's more than enough to cover the entirety of Asia + Eastern and Central Europe + eastern half of Africa even with the ICBM launchers stationed in central India.

Biscuits said:

If there is an imminent nuclear threat, then China could make its talk immediately then. For example through an emergency broadcast where they reveal the approximate location of 500+ missiles

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The locations of the Chinese ICBM silos are already open and public for the Pentagon, their spy satellites overfly China pretty much on a daily basis. There is no need for China to remind them on that.

Besides, why should China even reveal the storage locations of their own nuclear warheads and (spare+mobile) ICBMs in the first place??!!

Doing so would only encourage the US to strike at those storage locations in case nuclear exchange does occur. With those nuclear warheads and (spare+mobile) ICBMs gone, how is China going to conduct retaliatory/second strikes against the US and/or other countries?

Biscuits said:

and explain which American cities will be hit in the event of US nuclear aggression,

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There is no need to explain which American cities will be hit. The Americans themselves have conducted numerous of studies and simulations on which American cities and military facilities will be targetted during a nuclear war thoughout the entire 1st Cold War.

Biscuits said:

and then explain that besides the 500 revealed, there are several times more nukes that have been moved to launch on warning as well.

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Unnecessary. Besides, unless China's nuclear arsenal is really on the same scale and size as her American counterparts, doing so would only risk getting called Beijing's bluff by Washington DC.

ACuriousPLAFan said:

India's Agni-5 ICBM has an operational range of 7000-8000 kilometers. That's more than enough to cover the entirety of Asia + Eastern and Central Europe + eastern half of Africa even with the ICBM launchers stationed in central India.


The locations of the Chinese ICBM silos are already open and public for the Pentagon, their spy satellites overfly China pretty much on a daily basis. There is no need for China to remind them on that.

Besides, why should China even reveal the storage locations of their own nuclear warheads and (spare+mobile) ICBMs in the first place??!!

Doing so would only encourage the US to strike at those storage locations in case nuclear exchange does occur. With those nuclear warheads and (spare+mobile) ICBMs gone, how is China going to conduct retaliatory/second strikes against the US and/or other countries?


There is no need to explain which American cities will be hit. The Americans themselves have conducted numerous of studies and simulations on which American cities and military facilities will be targetted during a nuclear war thoughout the entire 1st Cold War.


Unnecessary. Besides, unless China's nuclear arsenal is really on the same scale and size as her American counterparts, doing so would only risk getting called Beijing's bluff by Washington DC.

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There is a very limited amount of agni-5. India also does not necessarily have launch on warning. That means, if India doesn't expand their arsenal to similar levels as China, a first strike has a good chance to work.

US spy satellites can't see inside tunnels or under covered silos.

China has OTH detection and launch on warning capability, so it doesn't matter if US knows *some* of the locations, because they will get launched on the moment US launches. As for a 2nd or 3rd wave, that's why China has more covered up launchers.

We're talking a fringe scenario where US despite knowing it will result in mutual destruction still decides to commit nuclear aggression.

What "bluff" will US call? 1000 nukes will ruin the entire N American continent just as well as 3000 would. At some point, you run into diminishing returns.

As I've written earlier, the nukes which are launchable from US do not exceed 1600. Legacy cold war stockpiles are just that, ammo stockpiles. And for China to have about 1600 nukes on readiness is not difficult.

Biscuits said:

There is just zero incentive for China to suddenly talk loudly about nukes when it hasn't needed to do it, ever.

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China will never reveal the amount of nukes she has. Nukes has always been her strategic ambiguity. For years, every think tank to self appointed military expert say China has 300 nukes. Suddenly in the last couple of years, it's 1,000. China has never responded. The Chinese are famous for shell games and that's the way China operates. Regardless of the actual number she has, she will have dummies in the mix. How many are real nukes and how many are dummies. Will missile defence know the difference between a real or dummy warhead screaming down? If missile defence responds with all they have, what about the second wave, or third? In those, how many are real nukes? So the Chinese nuclear ambiguity will continue. No reason to do a show and tell.

These will make it into tunnels, unlike Spanish ones.

China-made metro train delivered to Portugal​

Xinhua | Updated: 2023-02-13 13:01


Tan Mu (C, front), general manager of CRRC Tangshan, illustrates China-made metro trains over a model as Portuguese Minister of Environment and Climate Action Duarte Cordeiro (R, front) and Chinese Ambassador to Portugal Zhao Bentang (L, front) listen inside the Trindade Metro Station at the center of Porto, Portugal, Feb 11, 2023. [Photo/Xinhua]

PORTO, Portugal -- First of the 18-set metro trains made by Chinese company was delivered to the Porto Metro company of Portugal on Saturday.

The 4-car train is on display in the Trindade Metro Station at the center of Porto from Saturday till next Tuesday.

The train assessed meets expectations of the public passengers of top quality, more security to advance more people to use the public transports, Portuguese Minister of Environment and Climate Action Duarte Cordeiro told Xinhua.

The train was made by CRRC Tangshan, one of China's largest makers of trains, high-speed trains and metro vehicles.

"It is an example of a train that is adapted to Porto Metro's assessments among passengers and workers," said Cordeiro, sitting down on the carriage's seats after visiting the train cab and trying the driver's seat.

"This vehicle is the prototype and serves as a reference," said Tiago Braga, president of the Porto Metro company.

The first train will start its service in May, after several trials and tests, and all the trains will be delivered by the end of September.

Chinese Ambassador to Portugal Zhao Bentang told Xinhua that the delivery of the metro trains made by CRRC Tangshan is an example that shows the strategic partnership between China and Portugal and the potential of the higher-level cooperation between the two countries.

Portugal is the first European Union country to purchase made-in-China metro trains.

Tan Mu, general manager of CRRC Tangshan, said that the new-generation metro train, jointly designed by CRRC Tangshan and Porto Metro company, adopts digital technology and has the characteristics of light weight, low energy consumption and more digital intelligent, in accordance with the European standards.

The new metro trains have a maximum circulation speed of 80 km/h and capacity for 244 passengers, of which 64 are seated.

With these new carriages, the Porto metro network will have 120 vehicles.

Biscuits said:

There is a very limited amount of agni-5. India also does not necessarily have launch on warning. That means, if India doesn't expand their arsenal to similar levels as China, a first strike has a good chance to work.

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Back in the 1980s, 1990s and 2000s, China also has limited number of DF-5s, and China didn't necessarily have LOW either at that time. Did the US not guard against China back then?

Biscuits said:

US spy satellites can't see inside tunnels or under covered silos.

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I'm not talking about missile silos. I'm talking about tunnels and underground bunkers for storing ICBMs (and nuclear warheads).

Besides, didn't you just mentioned that China should announce the storage locations of their ICBMs (and nuclear warheads) to the US? Here:

Biscuits said:

For example through an emergency broadcast where they reveal the approximate location of 500+ missiles and explain which American cities will be hit in the event of US nuclear aggression

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Doing this is no different than you announcing the location of your armory (where you keep your weapons) to your enemy. You are literally inviting your enemy to torch your armory in the opening stages of your battle before you even have the chance to retrieve those weapons to fight.

Biscuits said:

China has OTH detection and launch on warning capability, so it doesn't matter if US knows *some* of the locations, because they will get launched on the moment US launches. As for a 2nd or 3rd wave, that's why China has more covered up launchers.

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Missile silos can have LOW, but TELs cannot - especially in the scenario that you described as follows:

Biscuits said:

We're talking a fringe scenario where US despite knowing it will result in mutual destruction still decides to commit nuclear aggression.

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Biscuits said:

What "bluff" will US call? 1000 nukes will ruin the entire N American continent just as well as 3000 would. At some point, you run into diminishing returns.

As I've written earlier, the nukes which are launchable from US do not exceed 1600. Legacy cold war stockpiles are just that, ammo stockpiles. And for China to have about 1600 nukes on readiness is not difficult.

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As long as China is not officially confirmed to have more than 1000 nuclear warheads, there is little point diving further into the topic.

Temstar said:

In fact, I remember back when I was in primary school in China the principle sent the whole school to the local movie theater to watch a sci fi movie called

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about a kid who could understand animal speech realizing there's been a leak of vinyl chloride or some sort of chlorinated hydrocarbon gas that will cause massive destruction of ozone layer and him rushing with his animal friends to alert the authorities to prevent a further disaster.

In the movie it was caused by 3 tanker load of the gas sitting in a railway marshaling yard and a couple of thieves sneaking in and opening the tap thinking it was full of fuel oil. They quickly succumbed to the gas and the taps were left running.

Worth noting the movie ends with a dog sacrificing itself by running towards the tankers with a lit touch in its mouth and blowing up the whole thing. Same thing as what the Americans are doing here but explicitly against vinyl chloride MSDS because while it will burn fiercely it will produce dioxin in the process which is much worse than vinyl chloride. Vinyl chloride will degrade over time when exposed to UV to degrade to harmless substances.

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I watched it when I was seven or eight. Gave me nightmares for weeks.

Biscuits said:

There is a very limited amount of agni-5. India also does not necessarily have launch on warning. That means, if India doesn't expand their arsenal to similar levels as China, a first strike has a good chance to work.

US spy satellites can't see inside tunnels or under covered silos.

China has OTH detection and launch on warning capability, so it doesn't matter if US knows *some* of the locations, because they will get launched on the moment US launches. As for a 2nd or 3rd wave, that's why China has more covered up launchers.

We're talking a fringe scenario where US despite knowing it will result in mutual destruction still decides to commit nuclear aggression.

What "bluff" will US call? 1000 nukes will ruin the entire N American continent just as well as 3000 would. At some point, you run into diminishing returns.

As I've written earlier, the nukes which are launchable from US do not exceed 1600. Legacy cold war stockpiles are just that, ammo stockpiles. And for China to have about 1600 nukes on readiness is not difficult.

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I think the same too. My thoughts on how many nukes a country should have drastically decreased after the Ukrainian War too. Looking at the history of the "atomic age" and using common sense, I think these verdicts hold and aren't really controversial.

- Nukes and other WMDs are really effective in deterring direct conventional attacks. No country ever with any nuclear weapons was attacked with the intent to conquer them. This holds even if there is a massive conventional overmatch.

- Nukes are incredibly ineffective in deterring proxy wars. NATO is currently ignoring all of Russia's redlines regarding arms deliveries to Ukraine.

- Tactical nukes are 99% useless. Their use in "small wars" is politically completely unpalatable. Their use against great powers almost guarantees a nuclear apocalypse. I think a country should own 100-200 of them to have a last chance of stopping escalation or enemy conquest before the apocalypse. Other than that, nope. I think their only use is being the last way out before sides start destroying each other's cities, possibly. Their effectiveness against dispersed ground units isn't great either.

- Limited nuclear warfare is a dumb idea. There are no ways the escalation stops after civilians start dying in ten thousands.

- Counterforce and decapacitation strikes are wishful thinking at best. In the early cold war when mobile launchers were almost non-existent and early warning was very unreliable? Maybe. Now? Complete wishful thinking. It is just too easy to have enough mobile launchers. VLO bombers and subs with hypersonic missiles might blow up some silos and non-deployed mobile launchers, but that's about it. And I wouldn't bet on that either considering the stakes.

- You don't really need to destroy a country. Just taking out the metropolitan population would break a country for generations. To add further pain you can take out infrastructure nodes. That would make other smaller cities dysfunctional for years to come. Also would cause many indirect deaths. These don't require many nukes. A few hundred French nukes were enough to deter the Soviets in the cold war. Even if you have 40,000 nukes, you still wouldn't want to eat a few hundred nukes.

So I don't think there are any benefits to having a cold war like arsenal. 300 is too few for many reasons (not enough destruction and ABM tech, primarily). But 5000+ nukes with counterforce measures? That's a waste of money. As I said on another thread, China's nuclear modernization would likely cause an overreaction on the US side, and that's a great thing for China. Spending dozens of billions annually on weapons you will never get to use without getting destroyed is a waste.

Trending news about Ohio on Google LMAO. Way to get your priorities straight.

siegecrossbow said:

Trending news about Ohio on Google LMAO. Way to get your priorities straight.

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I am impressed at how the media is doing its best to hide the truth but isn’t this going to eventually backfire, I mean if the media keeps doing this and a disaster even worse the this occurs and with how shockingly bad the USA infrastructure is right now, it’s like they are wanting this to happen again. I can see how a civil war will eventually occur with Biden focusing on China and Russia like an autistic little sh!t and that I believe is going to be good in the long term for both nations provided they have the patience to wait it out which I think isn’t going to be hard to do given the whining and bitching they had in regards to a balloon

emblem21 said:

I am impressed at how the media is doing its best to hide the truth but isn’t this going to eventually backfire, I mean if the media keeps doing this and a disaster even worse the this occurs and with how shockingly bad the USA infrastructure is right now, it’s like they are wanting this to happen again. I can see how a civil war will eventually occur with Biden focusing on China and Russia like an autistic little sh!t and that I believe is going to be good in the long term for both nations provided they have the patience to wait it out which I think isn’t going to be hard to do given the whining and bitching they had in regards to a balloon

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Friggin chemical fire looks like this and somehow I just learned about it yesterday. WTF!

Seriously, why was no one talking about this???