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Santamaria

Junior Member
Registered Member
For countries at a similar level of development, turkey and Iran are doing really well technologically. Compared with countries like Brazil, Argentina Thailand or Belarus, Iran seems more technologically advanced than any of them.
Compared to Greece, Romania, Poland or Malaysia, turkey is pretty advanced. Obviously they use western parts because they're a medium sized country, not something like the US, EU or China

They tend to speak in a more bombastic way with less substance behind, but that doesn't mean there's no substance behind the words at all
Well, Belarus has its own microelectronics industry, for example they produce lithographic equipment from (225-450 nm). You can check the company Planar JSC
They also produce several products in other industries, and they were the biggest IT center of that company called EPAM until the war started.
I don't think Iran is more technologically advanced than them. And neither those Argentina, Greece or Romania.

And Brazil has an aerospace industry, although is very dependent and integrated with the US. The company is Embraer

Anyway I agree that both Iran and Turkey are countries with a very good scientific and industrial base, and they do very good, specially Iran, for their size and situation
 

canonicalsadhu

Junior Member
Registered Member
The president-elect of Indonesia Prabowo is someone to watch... At Shangri La defense summit, he was asked about China-US rivalry and taking sides, where he emphasized non-alignment and added the following:
"Real security comes through very good relations between our immediate neighbours. This is part of our Asian culture. We must be close, friendly with our immediate neighbours," he said, noting that Indonesia has had conflicts with Singapore and Malaysia in the past.

"But now, we are the best of friends. We resolved our differences without interference from any external power," he said.
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Randomuser

Senior Member
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China has 15 times more population than Turkey or Iran. Of course China can develop technologies that smaller countries can't. Turkey has a significantly higher GDP per capita than China, because they integrated with the EU economy. Iran has a similar GDP per capita but oil and sanctions, which maybe cancel each other out. Iran was also recently attacked in a major war without provocation, you can't blame them for the setbacks that the war caused. The whole West Asian region is held back by the threat of war there that exists currently, but historically wasn't the case.

For countries at a similar level of development, turkey and Iran are doing really well technologically. Compared with countries like Brazil, Argentina Thailand or Belarus, Iran seems more technologically advanced than any of them.
Compared to Greece, Romania, Poland or Malaysia, turkey is pretty advanced. Obviously they use western parts because they're a medium sized country, not something like the US, EU or China

They tend to speak in a more bombastic way with less substance behind, but that doesn't mean there's no substance behind the words at all
I think only Iran has any real potential out of the bunch because they have the history of the Persians. Unfortunately they were taken over by first a US puppet (who later realized what was going on but it was too late) and then religious guys who were scantioned. So it's all hypothetical.

I Recall in 2021 or 22, turkey actually had a lower gdp per Capita compared to China because of their messed up exchange rate or something. This is despite being next to the EU and being part of NATO.
 
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AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
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Maybe Jewish supporters shouldn't have given the world ultimatums. I heard the guy that plays Murray on Stranger Things say if you're not going out of your way to defend Israel, then you're antisemitic. Hard to feel sympathy to a country where the US is allowing them to wipe out the Palestinians from Gaza and then cry hiding behind being the victims of genocide. If the number one country in the world is defending you, you're not helpless. Sorry but there are plenty of examples where they're not doing for others what they expect everyone else to do for them.
 

Index

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Maybe Jewish supporters shouldn't have given the world ultimatums. I heard the guy that plays Murray on Stranger Things say if you're not going out of your way to defend Israel, then you're antisemitic. Hard to feel sympathy to a country where the US is allowing them to wipe out the Palestinians from Gaza and then cry hiding behind being the victims of genocide. If the number one country in the world is defending you, you're not helpless. Sorry but there are plenty of examples where they're not doing for others what they expect everyone else to do for them.
They have it coming to them, despite all the assistance China rendered them, all the way from ww2 to today, Israel threw in their lot with terrorists and betrayed China. Netanyahu has his name written on documents that glorify terrorism.

Alienating the number 1 country in the world should have consequences, and aligning with the largest warlord country and doubling down on violence against their own people will not save them from said consequences.

Sow islamists and you reap islamists.
 
I was previously thinking before how China shouldn't be enemies with India since it has enough crap to deal with. But much like America, being an enemy of India is better than being it's ally. After all it's a crappy ally that makes massive demands yet contributes much less and in many cases tries to undermine you. When India is your enemy, you assume everything it does is bad for you so you can easily tell it to F off and they won't be able to be slimey with you so you force it to show it's true face. No wonder China has no intention of agreeing to anything regarding the border. It's easier to keep Indian as a hostile.
You are thinking in terms of extremes. Relations are not black or white, not every nation has to be either an, "enemy," or "friend." China can recognize the geopolitical realities that would prevent India from being a "friend," but it is still in China's interests to prevent India from being an, "enemy." Whenever possible, you want to avoid making your neighbors, especially big ones, your "enemies." India for the most part has resisted direct alignment with the West, and it is in China's interests that India continues to do so. Adopting a hostile policy towards India only increases the probability of India drifting closer to the West. It is also not in any country's interest for a large neighbor to collapse and descend into chaos, especially if that large neighbor has a nuclear arsenal (regardless of how small and basic that arsenal may be).

Yes, you can say Ming/Qing did not cultivate advanced science and technology (i.e., industrial revolution or military tech) as well, falling behind the West just like the three Muslim gunpowder empires. The difference is modern China learned and adapted, created its own elite science and technology (e.g, Hypersonics, subs, Beidou, EV, solar, etc..) whereas modern Turkey, Iran, Pakistan are reliant on foreign science and technology, still laggards. These three countries still have big bombs, but robust economy and advanced tech? Nothing changed in 500 years. Same can't be said for China.
If you go back about 25 years, China was also heavily reliant on foreign technology, and with a level of industrial and economic development much behind Turkey and Iran. In terms of real (PPP) GDP per capita, China only surpassed Iran within the past decade and still significantly lags behind Turkey. In Iran's case, being sanctioned from much of the international market and being cut off from foreign technology held Iran back far more than its limited energy sales could compensate for. Pakistan, on the other hand is even less developed than India. The differentiating factor between India/Pakistan and Iran/Turkey is that India/Pakistan were British colonies for 200 years while Iran and Turkey were never colonized. In terms of independent technology, very few countries have the necessary population size to be fully independent in terms of technology, not even the US, and definitely not any individual European state (not even Germany or Russia). Only China does, and questionably the entirety of Europe as a whole. India may have the potential based solely on population size, but is held back by innumerable other factors.

I think only Iran has any real potential out of the bunch because they have the history of the Persians.

I Recall in 2021 or 22, turkey actually had a lower gdp per Capita compared to China because of their messed up exchange rate or something.
Persian may have thousands of years of history, but Turkey also has at least 700 years of history (if you choose not to count Byzantium's cultural legacy). But India too has thousands of years of history and Europe only about 1400 years of history, so total length of history is largely irrelevant. What is more meaningful is which countries had independent institutions over the past 300-400 years. Persia, Turkey, Europe, and China did while India/Pakistan and most of the Middle East did not.
 
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