Littoral Combat Ships (LCS)

Re: US Navy launches and christens first Littoral Combat Ship (LCS)

Popeye and Tphuang, I do not believe that this means that the entire program will be cancelled at all. It means that each designer is now going to build one of the initial batch instead of two and that the Navy will choose between these individual ships, or make a decision to go woith some number of both.

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True enough..Recently(last month) the USN CNO visited PCU LCS-3 Freedom. A certain member of this forum(who shall go unnamed) seems to think this is a failed program. Ain't happenin'!

MARINETTE, Wis. (Jan. 14, 2008) Chief of Naval Operations (CNO) Adm. Gary Roughead takes a tour of Marinette Marine Shipyard. The eight-day trip also included a tour of the pre-commissioning unit littoral combat ship (LCS) Freedom. U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 1st Class Tiffini M. Jones (Released)

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Re: US Navy launches and christens first Littoral Combat Ship (LCS)

I commented on this on Galarhn's blog, but it sort of dawned on me that the first 2 LCS's cost added together is going to cost more than the cost of the entire 022 fleet. Which is mind blowing considering how many 022s there are.

The problem is USN kept on changing specs, asked for too much capability and you ended up with cost overruns. And of course, the other problem is that Lockmart shouldn't be building ships. It can't build anything on budget. Let Grumman do the job.

Re: US Navy launches and christens first Littoral Combat Ship (LCS)

I commented on this on Galarhn's blog, but it sort of dawned on me that the first 2 LCS's cost added together is going to cost more than the cost of the entire 022 fleet. Which is mind blowing considering how many 022s there are.

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It's not you tphuang...I will not mention the name...

C'mon tphuang There is no comparison between those two class of vessels. None. The 022 is a partol missile boat with a diffrent mission than an LCS. Nothing more.

The problem is USN kept on changing specs, asked for too much capability and you ended up with cost overruns. And of course, the other problem is that Lockmart shouldn't be building ships. It can't build anything on budget. Let Grumman do the job.

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Love that term Lockmart...

Your above comment is 100% correct. Hopefully the new CNO will get the program back on track.

Re: US Navy launches and christens first Littoral Combat Ship (LCS)

bd popeye said:

It's not you tphuang...I will not mention the name...

C'mon tphuang There is no comparison between those two class of vessels. None. The 022 is a partol missile boat with a diffrent mission than an LCS. Nothing more.



Love that term Lockmart...

Your above comment is 100% correct. Hopefully the new CNO will get the program back on track.

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Not saying there is any comparison between the two vessels. But just an indication of how much extra USN is paying to have a navy that's suppose to be able go anywhere and fight in any condition compared to a navy that's more focused around the shores.

And how much cheaper the cost is when you decide on the ship design and mass produce it.

Re: US Navy launches and christens first Littoral Combat Ship (LCS)

I also do not intent to imply the programm will fail. It's an inconvenience of a bigger problem wihin the USN/ US defence industry. Aquireing new warships. I don't want the program to fail, and don't exspect it to. But the current "mishaps" are a problem in itself. It means time slippages and and brings uncertainty to other projects.
The current fleet of vessels, wich is rather stressed with missions these times is getting older every day and will gradually be retired. And there are missions out there, those ships were not ment to fullfill.

The DDX will come in low numbers at a high price, CG(X) is not even sure, and the navy wants 313 ships that should be rather up to date.

LCS Delays Could Send Fire Scout UAVs to Other Warships
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But other senior Navy officials at the conference made clear the sea service remains dedicated to the planned buy of 55 ships.

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A year ago, the Navy planned to complete the purchase of LCS ships in 2016, but it now has stretched the procurement period to 2019.
Last year’s plan showed the Navy buying 60 ships from 2009 to 2013 at a cost of $75 billion. Now the plan is to buy 47 ships for nearly the same amount, $74 billion.

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I'm also wondering if an Israeli buy of two vessels would help the programm, two out of 55 is not much, and their ships might look quiet different.

Re: US Navy launches and christens first Littoral Combat Ship (LCS)

tphuang said:

Not saying there is any comparison between the two vessels. But just an indication of how much extra USN is paying to have a navy that's suppose to be able go anywhere and fight in any condition compared to a navy that's more focused around the shores.

And how much cheaper the cost is when you decide on the ship design and mass produce it.

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With that statement I agree. The USN needs to get this ship in full production and stop fiddling around with the design.

US Navy LCS-2 Independence Floated/Launched

The second US Navy Littoral Combat Ship, the LCS 2 USS Independence, and the General Dynamics Design thereof, was floated on April 28th and 29th.

This trimaran design is unique for US warships. It will be modular in design and has the largest helicopter landing deck for any surface combatant outside of the large amphibious ships or aircraft carriers. It also includes a RORO cargo bay, a small special operations well dock, and will be highly automated requiring a much smaller US Navy crew than other, similarly sized frigates.

Its common weapons package, common to all modular designs, includes a highly automated, rapid fire 57mm bofors cannon, 4 50. cal machine guns, and from the pictures, seems to also include a SEA RAM CIWS system on the aft end of the deck house.

The US Navy currently plans a brand new bidding process between Lockheed Martin and General Dynamics for the next three, Flight II, Littoral Combat Ships, with the winner building two more ships and the loser only one.

Here are three pics from this weeks floating and launch:

Re: US Navy LCS-2 Independence Floated/Launched

Nice post, Jeff.

Just wondering, although the LCS is not intended for high-seas use, it will still face harsh storms, especially on the Atlantic seaboard. Just how stable will either of the two versions be in such circumstances, especially for those engaged in ASW operations?

Re: US Navy LCS-2 Independence Floated/Launched

This bidding process is a nightmare. The Navy needs to pick one design and settle on it, then produce it. The "two for one oone for the other" deal is a bad idea, what do you do with the third ship? Logisitcally this doesn't make sense.

Re: US Navy LCS-2 Independence Floated/Launched

Finn McCool said:

This bidding process is a nightmare. The Navy needs to pick one design and settle on it, then produce it. The "two for one oone for the other" deal is a bad idea, what do you do with the third ship? Logisitcally this doesn't make sense.

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Based on what I am seeing and hearing, I believe they are going to end up producing both ships. The bidding will probably end up determining which company produces the most. Both designs have merit.

My guess is they will produce like 36 or so of one design and 24or so of the other. But we shall see.

As it is, it sounds like 3 of one and 2 of the other to get through this second round altogether.