Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Radar

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

I think we can take as a given that we are only being given half the story, so I will make my best guess as to the other half.
The Japanese warship wished to induce the Chinese to leave the area and did so by activating its ECM to disrupt Chinese Radar and Communications. The Chinese responded by demonstrating that the counter measures were not effective by burning through and establishing a lock with the targeting radar.

The comment of the Japanese not knowing they had been targeted at the time as I thought active targeting set off more bells, lights and whistles than a Las Vegas jackpot. Maybe ECM cuts both ways?

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra



The incident happened in international water near Okinawa, the Chinese ships were from North Sea Fleet, sailing towards Western Pacific, and onwards to South China Sea.

The Japanese ships and helicopters were as usual play a marking game ( as in basket ball game), closely follow the Chinese ships. According to Chinese, Japanese ships have on many previous occasions (including these incidents), harrasing the Chinese ships with PC-2 and helicopters flying closely over them, as well as sailing zip zap into the path of Chinese ships.

I believe the captain of the PLAN ship lost patient and decided to give back a hard one.

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

I think we can take as a given that we are only being given half the story, so I will make my best guess as to the other half.

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Exactly.. none of us where there so we can only guess based on sketchy news reports..

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

J-XX said:

......
This will be a fight to the finish.

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Well let's not hope that to be the case shall we? As much as we all here appreciate military hardware/software we also know that war is a terrible thing and should be avoided at all cost.

And it would be very very bad for everyone if the 2nd and 3rd largest economies in the world go at it with the US having a vested interest and most likely involvement as well. If certain something hits the fan, it will truly make Iraq and Afghanistan looks like child's play. As we all know everyone involve in this matter have a lot more than just AK-47s, IEDs and RPGs.

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

There will be no war between Japan and China. This is but a sideshow. The real crisis that will hit Japan, China and the rest of the world is Japan's suicidal economic policies.

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

In the past, whenever Chinese ships are spotted by Japan in International water, Japan flies aircraft in close proximity to the Chinese. How close is close? . The proofs are all those high resolution photographs of Chinese ships taken by Japan. Japan also sends their ships to tailgate the Chinese, and occasionally cut in the middle of Chinese fleet to demonstrate power. On one occasion, Japan ship even attempted to disrupt UNREP process being carried out on Chinese side.

What Japan considers as usual business is already aggressive when there is no tension. These same actions are exactly the threatening kind that will cause Chinese vessels to paint Japanese with fire control radar. I expect there will be more of such incidents until the Japanese take the hint and back off.

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

China should state thier side of the story otherwise too many unknowns

Either way this is not cool, because you are switching on weapons and in such a situation a live shot can be fired, that is not what anyone wants

Even the Iranian have extremely strict orders when it come to fire control radars and warning shots, you either go all the way or you don't, if u switch on a fire control radar be ready to fire a missile otherwise the target ship might react in a way you don't like

There is hundreds of ways of showing power other than radar locks

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

asif iqbal said:

China should state thier side of the story otherwise too many unknowns

Either way this is not cool, because you are switching on weapons and in such a situation a live shot can be fired, that is not what anyone wants

Even the Iranian have extremely strict orders when it come to fire control radars and warning shots, you either go all the way or you don't, if u switch on a fire control radar be ready to fire a missile otherwise the target ship might react in a way you don't like

There is hundreds of ways of showing power other than radar locks

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See what happens if an Iranian fighter tries to overfly an American warship or if Iranian warships deliberately cuts in front of an USN warship. They would not only be painted, but most likely shot down/sunk for their troubles.

As you yourself pointed out, we only have half the story, likely significantly less than even half, so making any kind of pronouncements on this incident is premature at best.

As Engineer already stated, the Japanese have a long and consistent history of unsavoury behaviour when it comes to harassing PLAN ships in international waters. It could easily be that they pushed their luck too far this time, or more likely, there was a directive from Beijing giving the PLAN and ship commanders greater flexibility and latitude in the kinds of responses they are allowed to taken when the Japanese starts behaving belligerently.

If it was a case of the Japanese overflying Chinese warships or trying to cut in front or even through a Chinese fleet, well the fault lies with them for playing such petty games at a time of heightened tensions between the two countries.

The circumstantial evidence certainly points to this being the most likely explanation at present, since there is no good reason a Japanese warship should find itself within 3km of a Chinese warship/fleet in international waters and far from any disputed territory.

The timing of this incident is also interesting in that in came just as tensions seem to have at least stopped escalating over the Diaoyu Islands disputes and high level negotiations are taking place.

It would be ironic indeed if for all the BS speculation about how much control China's civilian leaders have over the PLA, it turns out that this is a case of the Japanese civilian government not being able to fully control the ultranationalists in it's own military, who are trying to keep tensions high for their own reasons by engineering this incident.

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

asif iqbal said:

China should state thier side of the story otherwise too many unknowns

Either way this is not cool, because you are switching on weapons and in such a situation a live shot can be fired, that is not what anyone wants

Even the Iranian have extremely strict orders when it come to fire control radars and warning shots, you either go all the way or you don't, if u switch on a fire control radar be ready to fire a missile otherwise the target ship might react in a way you don't like

There is hundreds of ways of showing power other than radar locks

Click to expand...

I'm sure the PLAN knows all the possible ways and they might have exhausted all the other less confrontational means. You know how these cat and mouse games are played on the high seas. The Japanese might have been pushing the envelope one time too many...

I do agree that the Chinese should let their side of the story be heard. This silence thing might make them look bad.

Re: Japanese Defence Minister: Helicopter & DDG "locked on" by Chinese Frigates' Ra

Engineer said:

In the past, whenever Chinese ships are spotted by Japan in International water, Japan flies aircraft in close proximity to the Chinese. How close is close?

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. The proofs are all those high resolution photographs of Chinese ships taken by Japan. Japan also sends their ships to tailgate the Chinese, and occasionally cut in the middle of Chinese fleet to demonstrate power. On one occasion, Japan ship even attempted to disrupt UNREP process being carried out on Chinese side.

What Japan considers as usual business is already aggressive when there is no tension. These same actions are exactly the threatening kind that will cause Chinese vessels to paint Japanese with fire control radar. I expect there will be more of such incidents until the Japanese take the hint and back off.

Click to expand...

I hope the Chinese side gets smarter with the accusations by employing more camera footage of their own.

Personally, I wouldn't be surprised if this is something played up by the Japanese side for their own purposes, perhaps to make it more palatable for Article 9 to be removed and accepted by their civilian population. Mukden Incident - clear example of them staging events for their agendas.

asif iqbal said:

China should state thier side of the story otherwise too many unknowns

Either way this is not cool, because you are switching on weapons and in such a situation a live shot can be fired, that is not what anyone wants

Even the Iranian have extremely strict orders when it come to fire control radars and warning shots, you either go all the way or you don't, if u switch on a fire control radar be ready to fire a missile otherwise the target ship might react in a way you don't like

There is hundreds of ways of showing power other than radar locks

Click to expand...

Without knowing more details, it's not clear cut to say the Chinese did not have valid reason to turn on FCR. For all we know, maybe turning on the FCR stopped whatever harassment that came from the MSDF. If the report that the CN ships were from the NSF enroute to the Western Pacific is true, it sounds like the MSDF was shadowing them near Okinawa and things probably got a little too close for comfort at 3km. Japan's suggestion of firing tracer rounds doesn't help with the tension and only gives further impetus to keep that FCR on in case of need to fire back quick.