J-20 5th Generation Fighter VII

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nastya1

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zbb said:
Are there any estimates on the numbers of J-20's produced per year and total number produced so far?
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Probably around 30 total so far.
Not just stealth fighters but overall US has far superior airplane production manufacturing capibility. This is the most worrying. China right now able match ship production manufacturing capibilty of US but not Aviation which is a decisive factor in the outcome of a war.
Its a fundamental aviation manufacturing capability issue.
 
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Chish

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nastya1 said:
Probably around 30 total so far.
Not just stealth fighters but overall US has far superior airplane production manufacturing capibility. This is the most worrying. China right now able match ship production manufacturing capibilty of US but not Aviation which is a decisive factor in the outcome of a war.
Its a fundamental aviation manufacturing capability issue.
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Don't think China strategy is matching quantitatively in every thing America has, wheather they are planes, ships, or missiles. I think Mao once said that China will fight its own war, that is, it will fight according to its own rules. So your worrying may be misplaced.
 
Figaro

Figaro

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Chish said:
Don't think China strategy is matching quantitatively in every thing America has, wheather they are planes, ships, or missiles. I think Mao once said that China will fight its own war, that is, it will fight according to its own rules. So your worrying may be misplaced.
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Actually I think the strategy has changed 180 degrees. I mean the entire military doctrine has shifted away from a People's War in the Mao era (which requires massive numbers and low tech) to the information/high intensity modern warfare (which requires less numbers but high tech) doctrine. I really don't see how China is not trying to match American fighters or ships qualitatively.
 
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Chish

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Figaro said:
Actually I think the strategy has changed 180 degrees. I mean the entire military doctrine has shifted away from a People's War in the Mao era (which requires massive numbers and low tech) to the information/high intensity warfare (which requires less numbers but high tech) doctrine. I really don't see how China is not trying to match American fighters or ships qualitatively.
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China will be matching in quality, not quantity. Completelty different thing.
 
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nastya1

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Chish said:
China will be matching in quality, not quantity. Completelty different thing.
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Yeah right. with all due respect US can output a F35 faster than China output a j10A or jf17. How do you even compete in that? Just look at the tools being used in the manufacturing floor will tell the story
 
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ougoah

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nastya1 said:
Yeah right. with all due respect US can output a F35 faster than China output a j10A or jf17. How do you even compete in that? Just look at the tools being used in the manufacturing floor will tell the story
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Well China doesn't use the JF-17 or build J-10As anymore but yes J-10C isn't comparable to the F-35 at all and the rate at which F-35s are being produced for the USAF pretty much guarantees the quality and quantity will both be in favour of the USAF. J-20 production is also slower than the F-35 and probably much more so until things change.

USAF can't move all the F-35s produced to fight against China. They can only transport them via carriers and regional bases where any F-22 and F-35 are stationed will be primary targets so the real numbers are far more even, probably even in favour of China but the capability is still going to be on the USN USAF side with the F-35. J-20 just isn't in great enough numbers yet so sinking those carriers are going to be very important and at the moment very doable even if China will need to resort to nukes to accomplish this. I doubt the US will retaliate against Chinese cities even if their entire fleet is sunk by Chinese nukes. Escalation simply doesn't work that way unless they're confident few Chinese nukes can land in continental US which is too high a price to pay for retaliating against losing military assets after they defeat Chinese military assets. This is all if Chinese conventional war doesn't succeed in defending which is an uncertainty.
 
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nastya1

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ougoah said:
Well China doesn't use the JF-17 or build J-10As anymore but yes J-10C isn't comparable to the F-35 at all and the rate at which F-35s are being produced for the USAF pretty much guarantees the quality and quantity will both be in favour of the USAF. J-20 production is also slower than the F-35 and probably much more so until things change.

USAF can't move all the F-35s produced to fight against China. They can only transport them via carriers and regional bases where any F-22 and F-35 are stationed will be primary targets so the real numbers are far more even, probably even in favour of China but the capability is still going to be on the USN USAF side with the F-35. J-20 just isn't in great enough numbers yet so sinking those carriers are going to be very important and at the moment very doable even if China will need to resort to nukes to accomplish this. I doubt the US will retaliate against Chinese cities even if their entire fleet is sunk by Chinese nukes. Escalation simply doesn't work that way unless they're confident few Chinese nukes can land in continental US which is too high a price to pay for retaliating against losing military assets after they defeat Chinese military assets. This is all if Chinese conventional war doesn't succeed in defending which is an uncertainty.
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Not just F35. But China still doesnt have numbers of fighters to match F18 in SCS. Maybe only 10% of that. Its pretty woeful numbers.

Its ironic that China is known for its manufacturing prowess yet its hightech manufacturing is very much behind as evidenced by aviation and semiconductor sector.

It will take long while for China to catch up.
Its unfortunate that it has to face fullblown showdown with US when its not even ready.
 
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ougoah

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nastya1 said:
Not just F35. But China still doesnt have numbers of fighters to match F18 in SCS. Maybe only 10% of that. Its pretty woeful numbers.

Its ironic that China is known for its manufacturing prowess yet its hightech manufacturing is very much behind as evidenced by aviation and semiconductor sector.

It will take long while for China to catch up.
Its unfortunate that it has to face fullblown showdown with US when its not even ready.
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If you're talking about fielded J-15s against F-18s then yeah but even then three USN carriers do not carry 10 times as many J-15s as there are in service on 001 and 002. We're not comparing the entire USN with PLAN fighters. China is relying too much of PLAAF.
 
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ougoah

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It's far more reasonable to add all the eastern and southern PLAAF assets along with the entire PLAN against the USN pacific fleet and if you do that and also consider the missile advantage of China, then the fight is not anything like "China's only got 10% of F-18 fleet" which is inaccurate and untrue in many ways.

The US can barely take their entire pacific fleet to fight China and this is not even their entire navy. Meanwhile China will be using the entire PLAN along with every asset that can be used in this fight. For a clear picture someone needs to add the entire missile cell count of the USN pacific fleet. Can't count US regional bases since they barely have a few patriots defending them from PLARF. Australia and UK may send some support and Japan too.
 
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